lost hikers may pay $$

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

http://www.wmur.com/news/17997603/detail.html?rss=man&psp=news

My guess is that we will be reading more about this SAR.

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

MUL eidtorial and comments

http://www.theunionleader.com/artic...rticleId=0edab19e-3382-4dd3-a26a-421d890d3a0b

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I think it was MichaelJ who posted recently that bushwhacking etiquette ran a close second to dogs on the trail in terms of contentious issues. The issue of billing for rescues ranks right up there as well.

In the responses to the Union Leaders article/editorial, the "western model" of billing for rescues was mentioned. I'm not aware of any such model, at least in the Sierra, and that covers a rather large chuck of real estate. I asked friends who are either active and have been active in SARS whether rescues are billed and the answer has been no. This doesn't prove/disprove a "western model", but if one exists, it is by no means all-inclusive, to the best of my knowledge.

It's not my intention to spark yet another contentious thread by responding to Thom's posts. This subject has been covered ad nauseum here on more than one occasion.

 

[Chip]

All rescue missions, whether born of an irresponsible act or not, should be charged to the rescuee. If I go to the ER with a broken leg, it's not the responsibility of the attending physician to determine fault; I'll have a bill to pay whether my injury resulted from a reckless act or an accident.

This person has a great point. Fees are paid for services rendered almost everywhere. Why should SAR be gratis for any reason ? Because it has been or there can be volunteers involved ?

The time I had to call 911 to get a message to my wife, I would have been happy to have paid for the officer's time. It was my fault I was MIA, no one else's.

 

[Chip]

It's not my intention to spark yet another contentious thread by responding to Thom's posts. This subject has been covered ad nauseum here on more than one occasion.

Mine either, really. I guess we have "figured this one out" already.

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

I also have no idea what a "western model" for rescue is. But, the main reason that I posted this rescue and the follow up editorial was because the rescue occurred outside the Whites, on what under normal conditions would be considered a "walk in the park" (i.e., Saddleback Mountain is not a primo destination for peak-baggers). A lot of the comments to the editorial, which proposes warning signs at the foot of all trails everywhere in the state, were very similar to replies for VFTT posts about a couple of the rescues in the Whites last winter. I am a proponent for warning signs, but only at the base of trails that exit above treeline, realizing that many will pay no attention to them anyway. But, the signs would provide teeth for the authorities when they try to recover rescue costs when the rescuees are deemed negligent (no longer simply reckless).

 

[Hobbitling]

Lets privatize the police and fire departments too.

"hello, this is 911 Incorporated. please have your credit card available. If you are being robbed at gunpoint, please press 1. If your house is on fire, press 2..."

 

[Chip]

I believe the "western model" might be or refer to similar programs as The American Alpine Club has adopted. Global Rescue is a for fee rescue service. Membership in the AAC provides coverage for the first $5000 in rescue expenses. "Because Global Rescue is coordinating/performing the rescue, they will secure payment in advance for any expenses incurred beyond $5,000. This means they may ask you or nearest of kin if you are willing to pay for the cost of rescue beyond $5,000. GLOBAL RESCUE IS NOT AN "INSURANCE PROVIDER"; THEY ARE A PROFESSIONAL EVACUATION SERVICE."

So, in theory, this is a model that the AMC or another group could adopt for it's members.

 

[MadRiver]

Just curious, is Global Rescue required to coordinate or seek permission from the local authorities before they are allowed to initiate a rescue?

 

[jniehof]

the "western model" of billing for rescues was mentioned. I'm not aware of any such model, at least in the Sierra, and that covers a rather large chuck of real estate.

This may be related to a common misunderstanding of the CORSAR card, which is intended to facilitate reimbursement of the rescuing agency (not insurance of the rescued). The only other jurisdiction I'm reasonably familiar with is Whatcom County, WA, where rescue is an operation of the sheriff's department (and they don't exactly blow wads of cash on it, either).

It seems obvious that the current model of having F&G responsible for rescues with funding only from permitting/licensing isn't holding up, but none of the alternatives seems particularly equitable, either. Yes, when I broke my jaw I paid for the ambulance to the hospital (tip: medical insurance usually doesn't cover ambulances--they say they do, but the maximums are laughable), but I didn't pay for the police response. What's the appropriate analogy? For that matter, "hikers" (since a lot of commentary lumps us all together like some cult) pay significant sweat equity in the small percentage who are SAR volunteers, who take on plenty of non-"hiking" tasks (e.g. lost children in the woods--is anyone going to seriously suggest charging the twelve year old who wanders away?)

I don't see a good solution. I just know that blaming it on "someone else" ("hikers", "out of state", etc.) isn't going to fix anything.

 

[SAR-EMT40]

I had mentioned before that our town has a policy now of charging out of towners for rescues that involve the use of our heavy rescue truck. We are a relatively small town but have an interstate the goes through it. A substantial amount or our calls and majority of the use of our heavy rescue vehicle (i.e. Hurst tool and other heavy equipment) is caused by people driving irresponsibly through our town. This burden, it has been decided, will not be passed on to the taxpayers of the town when it can be avoided. We submit bills to the insurance companies and the people deemed responsible by LE. While it doesn’t delay or change the treatment that they receive at the scene in any way, they are held responsible for their actions to the extent that we can do it.

Keith