Skylight to Haystack via Panther Gorge or 2xMarcy?

[beaner]

I am thinking of ADK parking-Phelps-Table Top-Marcy-Gray-Skylight-Haystack-Basin-Saddleback-Gothics(Sawteeth, possibly)-Armstrong-UWJ-LWJ-Ausablwe Club as a two day event for Dec 31-Jan 1

What are the chances that Elk Lake-Marcy trail is open from Four Corners to Panther Gorge and then Barlett Ridge trail up to Haystack. Would I be better off retracing my steps over Marcy, then going Phelps-State Range trail to Haystack? Beaner

 

[blacklab2020]

Depends on when you do this and your strength.. Going down into panther gorge and up the backside of haystack is not off limits by any rules or regulations and I would highly recomend it if you are strong enough.

It will more likely be easier to go over marcy if everything is windblown and there is less snow pack. Dropping down into the gorge you will run into less heavily traveled trails and may have to break your own trail, and you are further from rescue. The elevation change, either route is the same. Its a little shorter going from skylight through the gorge.

I would leave it up to how you feel at the time. But I highly recommend climbing the backside of haystack with the appropriate climbing skills etc. Its steep but worth it. You wouldnt be retracing your steps. Because of additional snow pack in the gorge (it really might be worth it to leave that to a summer trip).

Justin

 

[randomscooter]

The trail from Four Corners down to Panther Gorge, then up Haystack, is generally not travelled in winter. I would say the odds of your finding it broken are small.

As for the other segments of your planned route, some of these are also difficult to predict with accuracy, but what the heck, I'll give it a try anyways. Assuming no big snowfall for a week prior to your hike: the trail into Marcy will certainly be broken, as will the side trail to Phelps. Tabletop trail is somewhat less certain, although the odds lean in your favor since it is an "easier" mountain and a regular target for early-season ascents. Over Marcy to Gray and Skylight the odds start going slightly against you, especially since it is early season and these are more remote summits that are generally more favored for later winter ascents, and also the more favored route is from Lake Colden. The Phelps trail from Little Marcy down to the Range connector trail is occasionally traveled in winter but not regularly, as most winter Marcy ascents are done either from the Loj or Lake Colden. Even odds the connector trail up to Haystack will be broken. Haystack to Basin to Saddleback odds are somewhat against you, then Saddleback down the Range to LWJ your odds are good.

The itinerary you describe is ambitious. In summer travelling light, a well-trained hiker/runner (top 5%), familiar with the trails and all the watering holes, can cover this route, excluding Sawteeth, in perhaps 15 hours. I say this not to discourage you (those who know me will agree that I am among the last to discourage ambitious projects), but to provide a frame of reference from which you can extrapolate and fine tune your specific plan.

 

[beaner]

Thanks for your words of experience.

Because this hike would separate me from my car I am thinking it would be better to go ADJ LOj-Phelps-Table Top-Marcy-Gray-Skylight-outpost-Iroquios-Algonquin-Wright-ADK Loj. It would be a 2day with the overnight some where along the way. By the sounds of it I should be prepared for 2 nights just in case. How would this route be Dec31-Jan1? beaner

 

[randomscooter]

Thanks for your words of experience.

Because this hike would separate me from my car I am thinking it would be better to go ADJ LOj-Phelps-Table Top-Marcy-Gray-Skylight-outpost-Iroquios-Algonquin-Wright-ADK Loj. It would be a 2day with the overnight some where along the way. By the sounds of it I should be prepared for 2 nights just in case. How would this route be Dec31-Jan1? beaner

This route offers much more flexibility than your original because there are two bailout options, Lake Arnold Pass and Avalanche Pass, that will get you back to your vehicle if conditions dictate. I should mention that there is no camping allowed above 3500' except at designated sites. There is a long stretch on your proposed route, from just below Indian Falls to Feldspar Leanto, which is above 3500'. I am not aware of any designated sites along this section of your route, but I am not certain. Hopefully someone else will chime in here.

Presumably you will be making side trips to Phelps, Tabletop, Skylight, and Gray without carrying your full pack. You need only carry your full pack over Marcy. With four side trips you will have numerous options to bypass one or more of them if conditions are less than optimal. That would improve your chances of reaching Feldspar Leanto the first night.

If you know up front that conditions are not ideal, you might consider going directly through Lake Arnold Pass to Feldspar Leanto, or through Avalanche Pass to Lake Colden to set up camp, then day hike from camp. You would miss Phelps and Tabletop this way, but would be doing a lot less elevation with your full pack.