GPS waypoints for some WMNF trailheads

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Mohamed Ellozy

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I have started a page with waypoint data for some trailheads in the WMNF. All were recorded, as opposed to being picked off the map, as all products based on USGS maps contain outdated information (Osseo starting on Kanc; Livermore trail ending about a mile below Lily Pond, ...).

It is definitely a work in progress: I want to complete the coverage of the 4Ks, and will add whatever other file formats may be requested (assuming that I can produce them!).
 
Very cool! I found the CVR format a piece of cake for my 60CSx. Do you want the ones that I have accumulated for your files?

Are we meeting at LverWV tomorrow morning? I cannot seem to find "Depot Camp" on any maps that I have, although I'm quite sure I was there when I did the Tripyramids.
 
Paradox said:
Are we meeting at LverWV tomorrow morning? I cannot seem to find "Depot Camp" on any maps that I have, although I'm quite sure I was there when I did the Tripyramids.
If you did the Tripyramids from the Waterville side you were there. And yes, it is LverWV.

Different GPSr units have different maximum lengths for names of waypoints, so I used the most restrictive (six letters). Some names are longer, but after truncation to six letters they are all (I hope) unique.
 
Suggest you compile a list of all the trailheads you want to cover & which ones you have data for & which ones you don't... if you need help acquiring waypoints for the rest, please let us know. I always carry my GPS when I am hiking (& it even works, when it decides it wants to acquire :mad: )

edit: I have a waypoint acquired this past wkend for the parking area at the dam a few hundred feet from the Mahoosuc Trail trailhead leading up to Mt Hayes, let me know if you want that; I may have some others.
 
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Paradox said:
Do you want the ones that I have accumulated for your files?
arghman said:
Suggest you compile a list of all the trailheads you want to cover & which ones you have data for & which ones you don't... if you need help acquiring waypoints for the rest, please let us know.
Many thanks to both for your kind offers, which I will take up when I get to compiling more waypoints. Right now I am looking at how to organize the stuff on my site (e.g. Should the trailheads be grouped by road, as I have done, or by section of the site?). Also trying to get some consistency in the naming system. I also need to know what formats are needed, e.g. does anyone here use the TomTom navigator, which I think uses a different file format? Finally I will need some feedback as to how useful all this is, no point in doing it if nobody uses it!
 
Good for you, Mohamed, for undertaking this project.

Climber.Org has a wealth of information for California. In case you haven't seen it, a starting point is here. Might give you some ideas about how to arrange (or not) the White Mountain info.

Kevin
 
Mohamed Ellozy said:
Many thanks to both for your kind offers, which I will take up when I get to compiling more waypoints. Right now I am looking at how to organize the stuff on my site (e.g. Should the trailheads be grouped by road, as I have done, or by section of the site?). Also trying to get some consistency in the naming system. I also need to know what formats are needed, e.g. does anyone here use the TomTom navigator, which I think uses a different file format? Finally I will need some feedback as to how useful all this is, no point in doing it if nobody uses it!

I thinks it's great. I'm sure I'm not alone on having trouble finding trail heads in the past. Even if one doesn't have a routing gps they can still use the way points to get there and or load into a program to show them the roads to get there before hand.

Maybe to keep it simple just put them within the 4000' trail description's you have going in your routes to peaks list.

Verify the way points yourself to keep the list accurate,reliable of course and your reputation preserved.
 
Mohamed Ellozy said:
Right now I am looking at how to organize the stuff on my site (e.g. Should the trailheads be grouped by road, as I have done, or by section of the site?). Also trying to get some consistency in the naming system. I also need to know what formats are needed, e.g. does anyone here use the TomTom navigator, which I think uses a different file format? Finally I will need some feedback as to how useful all this is, no point in doing it if nobody uses it!
agreed, I think the 3 major important aspects are
* content (scope)
* accuracy
* useability

content -- your choice as to scope.
accuracy -- I would recommend for each trailhead having 1 person record a waypoint, & another person check it to see that it works (and record the names / dates of who did both, for your own purposes).
useability -- not quite sure what to recommend. This is really key, I can't tell you how many times I've stopped browsing particular websites, even if they have good information, because the interface sucks.

re: format
GPX format is good because it seems to be the only major standard out there (and it's XML so you can do lots of easy auto-processing on it). CSV is good because it's plaintext for use with spreadsheets. I'd try to be minimalist & support as few formats as possible, unless it's easy to write a script to autoconvert from your base format. (edit: autoconversion itself is fairly easy, you can use GPSBabel, but then you have more storage space & have to integrate multiple HTML links into your website. If you have a server that can generate them on the fly, then maybe it's not so difficult.)

Something that I think would be useful would be to link into Google Maps & show the trailheads as part of your routes-to-the-peaks pages. Unfortunately I'm not yet familiar how to use their API, but I know there are lots of sites which have done it. (I may try to get familiar with it this winter; I've been attempting to automate part of my botanical data entry with a local web server & it will reduce my human-error rate if I can see on a map which waypoints I'm working with. If I learn anything interesting I'll let you know.)

Why I would use it: I know where many of the trailheads are, but if I'm planning a hike, I'd like to know where the trailhead is. If it's easy to find, I don't need a GPS waypoint, I'd just need a map. If it's not easy to find (e.g. the trailheads on Success Pond Rd) or if it would provide reassurance that I'm really heading the right way (trailheads off of the USFS dirt rds e.g. Gale River Rd or Mill Brook Rd), then a GPS waypoint would be helpful. Even the Ferncroft trailhead (and the turn to get there!) would be helpful to have GPS points.

A comment to that effect (whether trailheads are easy/hard to find) would also be helpful.

Unless you are concerned about someone "stealing" data, or the files are too large, I'd do one (or both) of two things:
(1) just put all the waypoints in 1 file
(2) on each page of your site, put a link to waypoints relevant to those hikes (whether trailhead waypoints or summit waypoints)
 
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arghman said:
re: format
GPX format is good because it seems to be the only major standard out there (and it's XML so you can do lots of easy auto-processing on it). CSV is good because it's plaintext for use with spreadsheets. I'd try to be minimalist & support as few formats as possible, unless it's easy to write a script to autoconvert from your base format. (edit: autoconversion itself is fairly easy, you can use GPSBabel, but then you have more storage space & have to integrate multiple HTML links into your website. If you have a server that can generate them on the fly, then maybe it's not so difficult.)
I also agree that GPX formant is a good choice because it is the only cross-vendor standard. A number of software packages (including Garmin Mapsource) can read it directly. And agreed that another advantage is that the XML is easy to process.

And instead of posting the waypoints in multiple formats, I suggest you just post a link to GPSBabel (http://www.gpsbabel.org) and let people do their own conversions. At the very worst, one can simply read the gpx file with a text viewer.

Doug
 
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