GPS shopping

So, we are shopping for a new GPS. We have an older Garmin and were wondering if the new ones are easier to use and have a longer battery life? Our main concerns are:
Easy to use
Withstands extreme cold and heat
Battery life
Durable
Reliable (good reception)
can be used with mapping software

Any suggestions? We have heard that the color screens can break in extreme cold weather conditions. Is this true? What is everyone using in the winter?

There are a number of threads on this topic--search an ye shall find. (You may have to use Google advanced search because the built-in search does not indexed 3-letter "words" such as "GPS".)

That said, the Garmin 60CSx is probably the most popular hiking GPS and should be on any hiker's short list. (I have one, many other VFTTers have one too.) I have posted more detailed info in some of those previous threads.

Doug

GPS rec's have been well-hashed round these parts. (I know, since I read most of the threads when researching my GPS purchase last summer.)

I ended up with a Garmin 60CSx, which you'll find is a popular model with a lot of VFTTers. I haven't used it a ton in the winter (yet), but it has most of the attributes you're looking for. I *think* you have to use Garmin's mapping software, but there are others far more knowledgeable than I who can chime in to confirm.

Do a forum search. But make sure you brew up a large pot o' coffee and have some time to spare first.


[Curse you, DougPaul...you type faster than me! LOL]

J.Dub said:

I ended up with a Garmin 60CSx, which you'll find is a popular model with a lot of VFTTers. I

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My choice as well as alot of my hiking friends--All 4 seasons--(w/ lithium batteries in the winter it will easily last all day no matter how cold) I have never lost a signal and it's easy to learn and use.

Cool, I will check it out! Thank you!

Garmin GPSMAP 60 cxs

I recently bought one on line for $250 (new, not reconditioned). I especially like the 2 AA battery power. So far I have about 12 hours on the first set of batteries and the indicator shows full charge. After 8 hours snowshoeing in 15 degree weather the battery indicator showed half charge, but once the unit got back to warm environs the indicator showed full again.

I made the (probable) mistake of buying the Garmin US TOPO 24K National Parks East CD for use with the unit and my PC only to discover that the map for my area shows tha AT location as it was about fifteen years ago. Didn't show relocations. Comparing the CDs maps to my paper USGS maps makes the Garmin Mapsource CD come out very lacking.

Then I bought the National Geo National Parks CD only to find out that except for the Smokies and Shenandoah Park the AT isn't even on the CD. Ugh!

Still in love with the 60csx

Hey Paradox, what did you use to send me the AT Corridor Boundary work map? I know you used the 60csx those days cause that's why I bought mine.

So, is the National Geographic mapping compatable with it?

I've had a 60CSx for coming on 3 years and it gets used just about every week. I've told some friends that its such a good unit that I'm considering getting a backup 'just in case'.
You must have Garmin software to use on the unit. I have Garmin's Mapsource 100k which is all the USGS topo maps for the entire 50 states at a 100k resolution. Also have Nat'l Parks East. Thats 24K and has most of the eastern seaboard Nat'l Parks, plus the Greens, Whites, ADKs and BSP.

Although some done do this, most of my fellow 60CSx users also have the Nat'l Geo software. Thats to see reproductions of the full USGS quads on your computer, to draw routes that you upload to your GPS unit. And you can visualize in great detail the tracklog of your hike onto the NG software for review afterward.

The SirfStar chip in the 60CSx was a huge leap forward. In rain, clouds, fog, snow on trees, in deep cols and behinds big trees and rocks, the 60 simply refuses to lose signal.
I will also accept multi Gibabyte memory cards. With a 2 Gb card, I have around 2,000 full USGS topo maps in the unit. Travel out west? Just go to your hard drive where you might have stored other mapsets, and I then just download the topos for the part of the country where I'm travelling and hiking.
After 3 years of intensive use, my perceived drawbacks: The use of lithium batteries is 'iffy' with some units. The unit senses the slightly larger voltage of a new lithium battery and shuts itself down. The Garmin techs have told me that this happens with some users and not others. Their fix is to put the lithiums in a flashlight or other electronic device and run it for a few minutes. A PITA, but it can work. I prefer to use high quality rechargeables, cheaper and easier on the environment, and carry a pair of 'preused' lithiums as a backup.
Also, there is a limt on the number of USGS quads you can download regardless of memory card size. Its somewhere under 2,200. It would be nice if they fixed that(unless they did already and I'm not aware). That would allow you to use a much larger card and put the continenal USA on it.

Any other complaint would be tiny. Its a great GPS unit, just wish I had 2.

I regret purchasing my Garmin Colorado-- the display is quite dim. I didn't return it to REI because I put some use on it while sea kayaking. Frequent software updates have solved most of serious flaws with the unit (jumping position reports) but the display is still too dim.

Another vote for the 60CSx. It 's been beaten pretty good and still works great. Might lose a signal in the west in extremely steep canyons but its pretty rare. Around here no signal loss even in my jacket pocket.

Peakbagr said:

I've had a 60CSx for coming on 3 years and it gets used just about every week. I've told some friends that its such a good unit that I'm considering getting a backup 'just in case'.
You must have Garmin software to use on the unit. I have Garmin's Mapsource 100k which is all the USGS topo maps for the entire 50 states at a 100k resolution. Also have Nat'l Parks East. Thats 24K and has most of the eastern seaboard Nat'l Parks, plus the Greens, Whites, ADKs and BSP.

Although some done do this, most of my fellow 60CSx users also have the Nat'l Geo software. Thats to see reproductions of the full USGS quads on your computer, to draw routes that you upload to your GPS unit. And you can visualize in great detail the tracklog of your hike onto the NG software for review afterward.

The SirfStar chip in the 60CSx was a huge leap forward. In rain, clouds, fog, snow on trees, in deep cols and behinds big trees and rocks, the 60 simply refuses to lose signal.
I will also accept multi Gibabyte memory cards. With a 2 Gb card, I have around 2,000 full USGS topo maps in the unit. Travel out west? Just go to your hard drive where you might have stored other mapsets, and I then just download the topos for the part of the country where I'm travelling and hiking.
After 3 years of intensive use, my perceived drawbacks: The use of lithium batteries is 'iffy' with some units. The unit senses the slightly larger voltage of a new lithium battery and shuts itself down. The Garmin techs have told me that this happens with some users and not others. Their fix is to put the lithiums in a flashlight or other electronic device and run it for a few minutes. A PITA, but it can work. I prefer to use high quality rechargeables, cheaper and easier on the environment, and carry a pair of 'preused' lithiums as a backup.
Also, there is a limt on the number of USGS quads you can download regardless of memory card size. Its somewhere under 2,200. It would be nice if they fixed that(unless they did already and I'm not aware). That would allow you to use a much larger card and put the continenal USA on it.

Click to expand...

I echo the above. (Thanks for saving me from having to write something similar... )

A few additional details:
* The max size microSD card is 2GB. The cards are pretty cheap: you can have several covering different regions for travel (eg out west)
* The max number of map segments is 2025. (not likely to change)
* Only Garmin maps can be loaded into the GPS. (NG TOPO! etc can only exchange waypoints, routes, and tracks.)

* Agree with maps: get at least Garmin Topo US 2008. Nat'l Parks East is nice too. Adding a road map can be handy too... (I have all three loaded in my 60CSx.)
* Canadian topos are also available
* Garmin is now producing some 25K topo maps (west to east) on memory card only. List ~$100/region_or_large_state. Expensive if you want a lot of coverage.
* NiMH rechargable batteries are a good investment for frequent users.

* I wouldn't consider anything but a high sensitivity unit. (60/76Cx, eTrex with an H in the model number. Mapping, color displays (C in the name), memory cards (x in the name), and sensors (S in the name) are, IMO, desireable.
* Many have found the Colorado and Oregon to be disappointments--more gimmicks, some desirable features removed.
* 60/76CSx models are electrically identical (just different cases). Same with 60/76Cx.

* A GPS is a complex device. It will take a bit of work to learn how to use it effectively.

Doug

On memory cards - I bought 2 SD memory chips recently for my 60CSx. On the 2GB chip I put the entire west coast - CA, OR & WA, and still have room left. When I have a few minutes I'll see if I can add AZ, UT, CO, ID and MT to that mapset before running out of room/capacity.

On the 1GB chip I put all of NE, NY, and most of PA and still have plenty of room as that mapset is only 168MB.

SD memory chips are very cheap - got each of these for less than $10 from Amazon, including shipping.

A thought on mapsets - creating them is time-consuming when you're selecting large chunks of real estate, so give the mapset a name. That way if you want to add/delete quadrants you can edit the mapset, rather than create a new one.

Another 60CSX vote

We own two 60 CSXs and think there is nothing better. We use rechargable batteries, the recargables don't last as long in the real cold but we had them on Adams on Friday with the GPS out in the elements all day. I try to keep the replacements as warm as possible and I changed the batteries after we returned to tree line at about 3:15 PM (8 hours) with 2 bars left. We were real glad to have it with us as the clouds really socked us in while on the summit. We were well prepared to use the map & compass but it was much easier following our track back using the GPS in the big wind (kind of spoils you a little).

Kevin Rooney said:

A thought on mapsets - creating them is time-consuming when you're selecting large chunks of real estate, so give the mapset a name. That way if you want to add/delete quadrants you can edit the mapset, rather than create a new one.

Click to expand...

This mapset is just a file listing the map segments, so you are just reinitializing the list of active maps in Mapsource. Having several mapset files makes it easy to have several standard mapsets for the GPS or to restore one's standard mapset after loading a temporary mapset in the GPS.

BTW, you can select a rectangular set of maps segments by dragging the mouse. Makes it quick and easy to select large regions.

In any case, you cannot edit the mapset in the GPS--you have to erase all maps in the GPS and reload from scratch.


BTW2, the memory cards are microSD--standard SD does not fit.

Doug

I have the old garmin geko 301. I would like a new gps someday, but this one still works well enough. I am struck though by how nobody appears to care about weight and size. As nice it is, the 60CSx is 7.5 oz with batteries, and over 6 inches long with the antenna sticking out top. I just have a hard time seeing carrying something so big and heavy on the average hike for what use a GPS can be most of time. I would like the vista's to be small and lighter too, but the vista is more manageable at 5.5 oz. For backcountry navigation in real use, what can the 60CSx do that the vista can't? (this question is not for me as much as for the OP, to at least offer the choice to save money and weight).

DougPaul said:

BTW2, the memory cards are microSD--standard SD does not fit.

Doug

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Thanks for catching that - the 60CSx use microSD's. I bought microSD chips which came with the SD adapter, so that the microSD can do double duty and fit in my Canon cameras as well as they use SD.

Will have to play with the mouse re: mapsets. Have used the 'click each quadrant method' and while that is no big deal for VT, for CA it is!

I have the old garmin geko 301. I would like a new gps someday, but this one still works well enough. I am struck though by how nobody appears to care about weight and size. As nice it is, the 60CSx is 7.5 oz with batteries, and over 6 inches long with the antenna sticking out top. I just have a hard time seeing carrying something so big and heavy on the average hike for what use a GPS can be most of time. I would like the vista's to be small and lighter too, but the vista is more manageable at 5.5 oz. For backcountry navigation in real use, what can the 60CSx do that the vista can't? (this question is not for me as much as for the OP, to at least offer the choice to save money and weight).

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Wow! Weight didn't even cross my mind! Good point! I am gonna have to do some more research!

Vista, garmin

The new vista cxh, great reception....small and handy...rugged, and about 24 hrs on a set of batteries... I love mine

michaelb said:

I have the old garmin geko 301. I would like a new gps someday, but this one still works well enough. I am struck though by how nobody appears to care about weight and size. As nice it is, the 60CSx is 7.5 oz with batteries, and over 6 inches long with the antenna sticking out top. I just have a hard time seeing carrying something so big and heavy on the average hike for what use a GPS can be most of time. I would like the vista's to be small and lighter too, but the vista is more manageable at 5.5 oz. For backcountry navigation in real use, what can the 60CSx do that the vista can't? (this question is not for me as much as for the OP, to at least offer the choice to save money and weight).

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Geko 301 vs 60CSx (or any high sensitivity GPS):
The reception of the 60CSx over the geko 301 under poor skyview conditions is dramatically better. (Yes, I have an eTrex Vista and a 60CS (both pre-high-sensitivity). I almost always use my 60CSx (high sensitivity)).

eTrex Vista HCx vs 60CSx:
Both will perform well with a poor skyview. The eTrex is a bit lighter, but has fewer features and a smaller display. (Larger displays, up to a point, are a big help.*) The optimum orientation of the eTrex is horizontal while the optimum orientation of the 60CSx is vertical (easier to carry on a pack strap). The 60CSx can also use an external antenna (desirable if you want maximum accuracy, for instance to map a trail).

* The 60CSx display is large enough that I can also use it in my car. (I can use the 60CSx anywhere I use a GPS: hiking/walking, biking, driving, or boating.) Many feel that it is the best all-around GPS available.

Doug

Kevin Rooney said:

Thanks for catching that - the 60CSx use microSD's. I bought microSD chips which came with the SD adapter, so that the microSD can do double duty and fit in my Canon cameras as well as they use SD.

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My microSD card also came with an adapter. (I think they all do.) Yes the adapter allows one to use the microSD card where ever an SD card can be used. One advantage for the GPS is that one can load maps directly on a card without using the GPS by putting the card in an adapter. (It is reportedly faster.)

Will have to play with the mouse re: mapsets. Have used the 'click each quadrant method' and while that is no big deal for VT, for CA it is!

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I think you will find it to be a great time and wrist saver...

Doug