many rescues this wknd.
- Thread starter richard
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Raven
Well-known member
I would like to see the percentages on rescues and how big of a slice the ATV world is taking up now. I am reading about more and more ATV rescues it seems. Glad they quickly dumped the old three wheel versions. I had a friend who changed the path of his life in an accident on of those when he was about 15.
I did see some data once, can't find it now, but the # of ATV riders & snowmobilers needing assistance was more than # of "hikers". However, it doesn't get too much discussion since:
1) The fall back will always be "yeah well our fees are put to use. What about hikers?"
2) Those needing assistance are less costly endeavors. Since they are on a road, they can be hauled out via a wheeled vehicle. And, there's no searching involved.
Yes, those 3-wheelers were a roll-over waiting to happen.
ATV accidents do seem to be quite common in the region and its not unusual to see a couple every weekend in the local papers. A fairly prominent cause is lack of experience and generally those cases are folks who have rented ATVs. There are apparently quite a few options to rent ATVs in the Ride the Wilds network although I only see the one firm in Gorham. It looks like there is minimal training for the folks who rent them. I expect Fish and Game is far better equipped for ATV accidents as all the officers have ATVs and a rescue requires far less resources compared to lost hiker searches or carry out rescues. There is local push back on the impact of Ride the Wilds on local resources but generally the limited news coverage in the region down plays it as ATVs are major revenue source for the region and the local papers are very dependent on advertising dollars. Unfortunately, the primary revenue from ATV use is the room and meals tax and that money flows to Concord while the local towns and county end up shouldering the burden for increased police and ambulance costs with no state reimbursement.
There are reportedly some token efforts to enforce the rules on the trail networks but most admit that the ATV users need to self enforce. Much of the trail network is on private land as most of the federal land and land under conservation easement explicitly prevents ATV use. If anyone has been in Success Pond road on weekends, despite the majority of the road being closed to ATVs, the amount of ATV traffic tearing up and down the closed section usually keeps continuous dust cloud in the air. Even where ATVs are driving on local roads, the police tend to ignore infractions unless they are blatant. I personally have had several potential dangerous run ins with poorly lit ATVs on closed sections of town roads at night and expect one of these days there will be serious accident between a car or truck and a ATV. Some of the private landowners who allow trails to be run on their property are starting to speak up about the lack of enforcement and I wouldn't be surprised if a few landowners shut down access in its entirety. One local town, Randolph, is actively preventing use of ATVs over the Presidential Range Trail, the former railroad bed that runs east to west from Berlin to Whitefield, much to the consternation of the ATV clubs and local tourist businesses. The clubs are fairly effective at bullying local town officials in making concessions to allow ATV use despite the objections of abutters and they make frequent potshots at Randolph for not going along with the trend.
There have recently been video crews following NH F&G officers filming for the North Woods Law replacement show (since the state of Maine elected not to continue the show), I expect that much of the show will focus on ATV accidents as they are frequent, easy to film and potentially more dramatic although a high profile lost hiker search like the one on the AT in Maine a few years ago will probably bring in some ratings.
There are reportedly some token efforts to enforce the rules on the trail networks but most admit that the ATV users need to self enforce. Much of the trail network is on private land as most of the federal land and land under conservation easement explicitly prevents ATV use. If anyone has been in Success Pond road on weekends, despite the majority of the road being closed to ATVs, the amount of ATV traffic tearing up and down the closed section usually keeps continuous dust cloud in the air. Even where ATVs are driving on local roads, the police tend to ignore infractions unless they are blatant. I personally have had several potential dangerous run ins with poorly lit ATVs on closed sections of town roads at night and expect one of these days there will be serious accident between a car or truck and a ATV. Some of the private landowners who allow trails to be run on their property are starting to speak up about the lack of enforcement and I wouldn't be surprised if a few landowners shut down access in its entirety. One local town, Randolph, is actively preventing use of ATVs over the Presidential Range Trail, the former railroad bed that runs east to west from Berlin to Whitefield, much to the consternation of the ATV clubs and local tourist businesses. The clubs are fairly effective at bullying local town officials in making concessions to allow ATV use despite the objections of abutters and they make frequent potshots at Randolph for not going along with the trend.
There have recently been video crews following NH F&G officers filming for the North Woods Law replacement show (since the state of Maine elected not to continue the show), I expect that much of the show will focus on ATV accidents as they are frequent, easy to film and potentially more dramatic although a high profile lost hiker search like the one on the AT in Maine a few years ago will probably bring in some ratings.
I'm curious how many car crashes there were. Looks like at least 1 moose was killed along 115.
richard
Member
I saw the dead moose and 1 dead deer.
CaptCaper
Active member
You guys nailed it on the head.... rescuing hikers cost a lot more money and effort and very dangerous a lot of times.. Many or most don't have the hike safe cards. ATV's folks along with all the rest of hunter,etc. pay the fees year in and year out.
Thank God they've opened up for ATV's as the North Country needs it, And hikers don't go past the Presidentals much..so they don't help the North Country and most don't care at all about anything above Cabot.. I hiked to Rogers Ledge Sunday and didn't see a soul all day. That's why I went there. I know all the rest of the 48K's etc. were a total Zoo....
I don't ATV and won't because of the dust..but what ever floats your boat. I have nothing against them. I believe in the land of many uses and share accordingly.
Thank God they've opened up for ATV's as the North Country needs it, And hikers don't go past the Presidentals much..so they don't help the North Country and most don't care at all about anything above Cabot.. I hiked to Rogers Ledge Sunday and didn't see a soul all day. That's why I went there. I know all the rest of the 48K's etc. were a total Zoo....
I don't ATV and won't because of the dust..but what ever floats your boat. I have nothing against them. I believe in the land of many uses and share accordingly.
CaptCaper
Active member
Yea..they same amount of skill it takes for those that perish on Mt Washinton doing solo or what ever..
PB is quite spot on. There is local push-back to the ATV swell, especially when there are large scale events.
I'm not sure who in their right mind thinks that 2000 ATV's in one day is reasonable traffic for the Mt Washington Auto Road, but lots of ATV folks seem to think it should be " no problem". Why isn't there ample space for parking ? Why in the world is Rt 16 not open for ATV traffic?
The hornet's nest has been disturbed.
Services are thin, and folks are going to have to learn to live with that reality. My guess is that NH F&G is going to run the $$$$ flag up the pole, upside down, before this season is over.
For sure, the citizens of the North Country are already buzzing about the fact that they bent over backwards to accommodate ATV's, but what they have to offer is seen as " not enough".
Not enough motel rooms, not enough gas stations, not enough restaurants, not enough porta-potties , not enough people to clean the porta potties. Not enough public roads open to OHRV traffic, not enough parking, and certainly not enough folks directing traffic to make it easier for ATV's to get where they want to go.
Cuz, we should understand, ATV's are the new bread and butter for the North Country, and without their dollars, we'll all starve.
Hey. I don't make this stuff up.
I'm not sure who in their right mind thinks that 2000 ATV's in one day is reasonable traffic for the Mt Washington Auto Road, but lots of ATV folks seem to think it should be " no problem". Why isn't there ample space for parking ? Why in the world is Rt 16 not open for ATV traffic?
The hornet's nest has been disturbed.
Services are thin, and folks are going to have to learn to live with that reality. My guess is that NH F&G is going to run the $$$$ flag up the pole, upside down, before this season is over.
For sure, the citizens of the North Country are already buzzing about the fact that they bent over backwards to accommodate ATV's, but what they have to offer is seen as " not enough".
Not enough motel rooms, not enough gas stations, not enough restaurants, not enough porta-potties , not enough people to clean the porta potties. Not enough public roads open to OHRV traffic, not enough parking, and certainly not enough folks directing traffic to make it easier for ATV's to get where they want to go.
Cuz, we should understand, ATV's are the new bread and butter for the North Country, and without their dollars, we'll all starve.
Hey. I don't make this stuff up.
CaptCaper
Active member
I don't agree with most you've posted.. lot's of large events in this state...and on the auto road.. got to share the resources.... and most like the ATV's a few as usual don't but they are few..but cry at most stuff anyway. Like the Easter seals ride in's up here every thing works out. every one gets their rooms,etc. We have lot's of open rooms in Lancaster for overflow.. I think some claim the sky is falling but they just don't like the idea of ATV's.... I know a friend's husband who we hike with hates them... so narrow minded... I told him I hike,snowmachine,travel across the usa in a camper,snow shoe, ski ..I would atv ....I'm an all around guy of many uses..like the sign says.... share the trails in the winter .. go to trails un used and don't complain about the snowmachines on the bike path.. they have to share with you. He doesn't like to hear that..his wife winks at me.. 
LOLOL < I > don't agree with the perceptions about the North Country that I posted. It isn't a matter of agreeing , it is a matter of recognizing that the perceptions are there and they are voiced to locals by visitors. Locals, working as hard they possibly can, to offer experiences that people WANT.
Don't blame me, I'm just the messenger.
Don't blame me, I'm just the messenger.
Amen!I don't agree with most you've posted.. lot's of large events in this state...and on the auto road.. got to share the resources.... and most like the ATV's a few as usual don't but they are few..but cry at most stuff anyway. Like the Easter seals ride in's up here every thing works out. every one gets their rooms,etc. We have lot's of open rooms in Lancaster for overflow.. I think some claim the sky is falling but they just don't like the idea of ATV's.... I know a friend's husband who we hike with hates them... so narrow minded... I told him I hike,snowmachine,travel across the usa in a camper,snow shoe, ski ..I would atv ....I'm an all around guy of many uses..like the sign says.... share the trails in the winter .. go to trails un used and don't complain about the snowmachines on the bike path.. they have to share with you. He doesn't like to hear that..his wife winks at me..
Lots of habitual moaning in the North Country. Land of many uses. Love or leave it.
CaptCaper
Active member
Amen!
I come from the Cape and had many battles over water right of ways,etc. I learned to share.. I go to Gorham alot and never see many if any ATV's and they aren't a bother on the roads.. so who cares. And a big festival for them is fine ...for the one weekend a year.. I'd rather have them ATV's Snowmachines,etc there then a bunch of casinos or bars and end up like LasVegas and the dump it is.. with drunks,prostitutes and other seedy characters... most are family folks on these machines..good folks.
I am not necessarily opposed to ATVs, I tend to support the "broad tent" approach to outdoor recreation as the majority of the various outdoor hobbies all support a lot of the same goals. ATVs tend to stick to old logging routes and town roads which frequently are in the valleys, the newer ATVs are somewhat limited to the terrain they can travel due to their size and most of the clubs try to keep them on the trail network. The majority of the impact of Ride the Wilds is north of Gorham with Gorham basically serving as commerce hub as there isn't much for tourist services north of RT 2 with the exception of Pittsburg. The area that Ride the Wilds is mostly focused on are the areas most impacted by the collapse of the paper industry in the region along with a second blow from when the Balsams shut down. Despite the loss of the paper industry in the region there are still extensive wood products holdings in the region that require access roads so all the ATV network has to do is use mostly existing roads with occasional connectors.
Most folks from Mass and even southern NH cannot envision the sort of damage of losing over 50% of the primary jobs in a rural area in less than 20 years will do to an economy and the tourism approach is the one asset that remains. Despite the objections of the non motorized crowd, the revenue generated by ATVs is significantly higher per participant than non motorized users like hikers. Few hikers even head north of RT2 once they get Cabot and Waumbek off the list so there isn't a lot of overlap between the activities.
The big issue is the exponential growth of the popularity of the sport, the local communities are having a tough time scaling up to meet the usage. The state drains revenue via the room and meals tax but very little if any comes back to the towns to handle this growth. Last years Jericho ATV fest was far better organized then prior ATV fests and I expect this years event will be even better organized. I also expect it will be dry run for the Camp RZR even being held in September.
Most folks from Mass and even southern NH cannot envision the sort of damage of losing over 50% of the primary jobs in a rural area in less than 20 years will do to an economy and the tourism approach is the one asset that remains. Despite the objections of the non motorized crowd, the revenue generated by ATVs is significantly higher per participant than non motorized users like hikers. Few hikers even head north of RT2 once they get Cabot and Waumbek off the list so there isn't a lot of overlap between the activities.
The big issue is the exponential growth of the popularity of the sport, the local communities are having a tough time scaling up to meet the usage. The state drains revenue via the room and meals tax but very little if any comes back to the towns to handle this growth. Last years Jericho ATV fest was far better organized then prior ATV fests and I expect this years event will be even better organized. I also expect it will be dry run for the Camp RZR even being held in September.
CaptCaper
Active member
The state may not kick back money in your eyes but that a side for a different day..think of the money that is rolling in to the area towns. I must say they certainly need it.. it depress's me when I go to Gorham,Berlin,etc. So run down..and falling apart...my friends joke how you need 5 North Country women lined up to make a full set of teeth. I'm use to the Cape and all it's money... Hopefully some fixing up will happen now in Gorham and Berlin etc.
This is great ATV thing as the snow machine season never kicked off in these towns...all summer..ATV is a long season. And this festival coming up is equal or better then the Sno Deo..
I usually get to Gorham Berlin and North all the time on our 4 strokes and eat at J's .Milan General,Log Haven, etc.. not last year once... were we able to pull out of Lancaster to there.. I did trailer up to Pittsburg for about 300 miles for the season.. I usually do 1500 to 2000 miles per season.
This is great ATV thing as the snow machine season never kicked off in these towns...all summer..ATV is a long season. And this festival coming up is equal or better then the Sno Deo..
I usually get to Gorham Berlin and North all the time on our 4 strokes and eat at J's .Milan General,Log Haven, etc.. not last year once... were we able to pull out of Lancaster to there.. I did trailer up to Pittsburg for about 300 miles for the season.. I usually do 1500 to 2000 miles per season.
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It probably best not to insult the locals since you apparently are living in the area.
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Agreed, speaking on behalf of my entire in-law family.
Raven
Well-known member
As a seedy character myself with a missing tooth, I agree.
I like Gorham. The North Country people of NH are generally good people, just like most people are everywhere.
The cape is nice as well. You can get there by going south.
It is not the ATV's anyone objects to, as ATV's don't have attitude.
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