1st winter peak today (slide in catskills)

[coldfeet]

This was my second Catskill hike and would you believe it, the same mtn! Went out with the catskill 3500 group,,8 of us and I thought i was in shape. The ladies were flying up the trail and I was in the end sweating and sucking up air. I think I tried to keep up with their pace and bad idea. I couldn't take off any more layers or i would have been arrested for exposure. The more I hear about how easy slide is the more upset I get. Just to let you know we went up and down in 5 hours..I think that was a little quick but that's life.

Weather was in the mid 20's and cloudy, no views because of the tiny flakes falling. Used 6 point crampons for the first time 1/2 mile before the peak and 1/2 mile down..pretty cool, only got tripped up twice but ZERO falls this trip!

I think I carried the most out of anyone and was prepared for a problem. It was fun but driving home was slippery. Thx to all for the "winter tips" and "Day packing" ideas. Happy holiday!

 

[coldfeet]

PS I drove 340 miles to hike 6.7 miles, what does that make me? (Be nice, I'm sensitive)

 

[MattC]

Congrats on bagging your 1st winter Catskill peak. I did likewise on Balsam on X-Mas Eve. Hiking w/ the club can be fun, but once there's 5 or more people, it's very difficult to keep a pace with which everyone is comfortable. Me and one other guy (so far) are probably doing Panther this Friday. We may do a through-hike from Fox Hollow to Giant Ledge, or we may just go up and back over the Ledge. We'll probably get a fairly early start (maybe 8:30 or so) and move pretty quick. Time is an issue for me since I need to be in Fleischmanns @ 5 that evening. Of course we only have sun until 4:30, so we'd want to be out by then anyway. Let me know if you might be up for this hike.

Matt

 

[coldfeet]

Hey Matt,

Thx for invite but I got to get back to the city that day (kids will be skiing and boarding on the 31st) and hopefully go out on Sat. 1/1 with the 3500 club with Tom if I'm up to it..thx..love to hook up some other time..David

 

[ajtiv]

Congratulations coldfeet.
I am sure you were in the back of the pack because you were hauling twice as much as the rest.
I agree with the Boy Scout motto but with experience you will increase your comfort level carrying less.
Good job coming through it.
I agree I always hate the drive back. My legs are always stiff when I get out of the car from a 3 hour drive home from a day hike.
Congratulations 3 more winter peaks to go.
Al

 

[hikethe115]

Congratulations! Sorry I didn't see your post on the weather in time to respond. I'm glad to hear it well. I agree that part of why you were slower is likely that you were probably carrying more than the others. Did you end up wearing the Koflach's?

A note on the weather....what you need to check is where they are actually reporting the weather from. If you check on weather.com for Phoenicia, you are really getting the weather for Monticello. They pick the nearest point with reported information. Perhaps another site you checked had more realistic information.

Hope you keep on hiking and maybe I'll see you on the trails.

 

[Peakbagr]

Its too bad you were pushing to keep up all day. According to the schedule, this was supposed to be a moderate hike(Slide certainly is) at a moderate pace. The measure of a good trip leader is to make sure everyone enjoys the trip. This means keeping a comfortable pace for everyone that still allows the trip to be completed in a reasonable and safe time. Everyone's measure of "moderate" is different, but the leader should be cognizant of that.

 

[mavs00]

PS I drove 340 miles to hike 6.7 miles, what does that make me? (Be nice, I'm sensitive)

ummm, just like the rest of us

 

[coldfeet]

Hey Mavs00--very cool cartoon

Dawn - wore 3 season gor tex boots..feet only got cold after lunch because i wasn't moving during lunch..Someone also told me that crampons make your feet cold because of the metal (conduction?)

Ajtiv - thx..would have liked a carpool from here..let me know if u want one.

PS. "I did have a good time"..I really wouldn't know what not to pack next time. I also seem to like being in the back because I can relax when i want to and will catch up to the group later. A nice kid (15) told me not to bring so much. I told him what I brought and asked him what I should exclude. He didn't have an answer. All he had was water and lunch. His dad did think they have been very lucky doing out so far on winter hikes. He's rethinking now.

PS I brought 4 L and only drank 2 L..maybe that was a problem..

 

[Jay H]

I guess you did that from Slide Mountain Road.. I and a friend of mine were in Denning (which is on the other end of the Phoenicia East trail) on 12/26, didn't see any large groups or so in the trailbook on the way out.

I kind of stay away from AMC or any large group hikes because I do tend to be faster than those. Not really any fault of the AMC or anything, it's just group dynamics. As far as carrying stuff, you are wise to be prepared for winter. Although when I am not winter bushwacking or not hiking solo, I admit to sometimes taking food/water and just some layers of clothes, rather than say the survival blanket, etc. etc.

As a short 5'5" male, I hike in midweight 3-season goretex boots, a pair of Montrail torre GTXs. I have tried some full winter backpacking boots (Vasque somthing or other) and they hurt, forget about being very heavy. They are taller and offer more ankle support than my Montrail but because of their height, they really rub my bones bad so I don't wear them. Even when I'm backpacking, I wear the Montrails. I don't find I need that much ankle support. I could probably backpack in a pair of trail runners. That's probably just me though.

Jay

 

[erd]

Hi Coldfeet!

Crampons can indeed make your feet cold. Wearing them's a bit like strapping cooling fins on your feet. One possibility (if it doesn't have a bad effect on the comfort of your boots) is putting in an insulating insole, but see below.

Koflachs are (as previously discussed) overkill for Catskill day hiking, although if you are inclined to chilly feet they will certainly do the job, and if you are comfortable walking in them, hey, why not. They are heavy, though, and will slow you down.

Your three-season hiking boots may be OK with extra insulation, but may I suggest in that case investing in a pair of expedition-weight Capilene socks and/or a pair or Serius Stormsocks? In the event you have to stand around on a very cold day, these could save you frost-bite. This is a real risk for those with a disposition for cold feet (and even for those whose feet run warm in especially tough conditions).

2 litres is more than OK for the time you were out.

As a hike leader of pretty extensive experience and the outings chair of the 3500 Club, I can vouch for the fact that diverse paces are the hardest issue we face on hikes; this is inevitable. In three-season hiking it is less an issue--the faster members can go ahead a little distance and wait (with the permission of the leader), or the party as a whole can move at the pace of the slowest member. In winter, though, there is a real safety issue involved.

As I've already indicated, standing around may quite quickly (especially on days when it is very cold or there is high windchill) lead to frostbite. A low-grade form, usually (not the more gruesome manifestations one reads of in climbing books), but frostbite none the less. My preference as a leader is that all members of the party move at the same speed, which is by definition that of the slowest member. Still, enforcing this puts a serious onus on the leader, who (after all) can only cajole the participants.

I'm delighted that, although you felt a little pushed, you still enjoyed the hike. The hike time you report is about average for winter Slide. I do hope that you will continue to hike with the Club, but if you do find pace an issue, contact me and I may be able to set up some slower paced outings. I'm not a speedy hiker myself, by any means. Oh, and contact me off-list if you wish should you want to discuss appropriate gear to carry on winter excursions.

Best wishes,

Ted.

 

[coldfeet]

Ted..you have mail

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

"I drove 340 miles to hike 6.7 miles, what does that make me?"

Like Mavs said, that makes you one of us! Cold feet from crampons? We're all different in that regard. I hike all winter in my normal boots, in crampons or snowshoes, with no discomfort. I find that Goretex gaiters make a big difference with comfort. Congratulations on your first winter peak!

 

[coldfeet]

Thx AIG..going on my first bushwack tomorrow!

 

[crazymama]

Good job Coldfeet!

Glad you had a good hike.

I know what you mean about trying to keep up with the fast hikers. I tend to be a slow to moderate hiker. If I'm capable of keeping up with faster hikers without feeling uncomfortable or angry, then I do. Otherwise, I hike my own hike, and let them hike their own hike, all stopping occasionally to regroup. In defense of fast hikers, they have THEIR natural pace, which is most comfortable for them. But it IS something of a psychological struggle to deal with being at the back of the pack...I just keep telling myself, this is not a race!

On the rare occasion when I'm hiking with someone slower than me, I slow down and take time to really enjoy where I am.

When I can, I try to find hikers who are about my pace, as it makes it more fun for everyone. This website has been a wonderful help.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

Turtles unite! I know what you mean. It is much more enjoyable to actually hike WITH somebody else. I may be slow, but I can hike all day, which is how it turns out sometimes! HAPPY NEW YEAR!