4 Season Tent Help

[Paul]

I am in the market for a 3 person, 4 season tent, not necessarily for die-hard expedition hikes, but some limited winter nights as well as late fall and early spring nights at reasonable elevation (3000 ft or higher in New England), where the weather can be quite unfavorable at times. The tent must be reasonably light, ideally < 9 lbs and suitable for backpacking. I have narrowed the choice down significantly and think I have reached the finalists. Unfortunately these tents are nowhere to be found in New England, so its difficult for me to actually try them. Does anyone have any experience with these tents and their suitability for overnights in damp, wet, cold, and windy conditions (e.g. here, Scotland, Greenland, Iceland, etc.)? I believe the dry weather performance even in warm day / cold night conditions out West will be fine or can be made fine with any of these. The tent candidates and weights (with ground prints) and square footage are:

Big Agnes Royal Flush with ground print: 8 lb 5 oz + 11 oz = 9 lb, 45.6 sqft
Hillberg Nallo 3 with ground print: 5 lb 12 oz + 1 lb = 6lb 12oz, 36.6 sqft
Hilleberg Nammajt 3 with ground print: 7lb 4 oz + 1lb 2 oz = 8 lb 6 oz, 36.6 sqft

Based on the pricing I have been given, the Hilleberg tents will cost about $135 more than the heavily discounted Big Agnes. One of my main concerns with the Hilleberg is the pitch on a tent platform since they are not free-standing. An advantage of the Hilleberg is that you can buy a mesh inner tent to use in the hot summer if you like, making this a very flexible tent. I realize that the Hilleberg is likely a superior tent and that the Nammatj will be a go anywhere tent. I have no prior experience with either brand so I am interested in getting anyone's thoughts on these three tents and their versatility. I have already eliminated these tents, primarily due to weight, although I realize many are excellent tents:

North Face VE25
Mountain Hardware Trango 3
Marmot Thor
Black Diamond Squall
Nemo

Others, but very skeptical:
Cabela's Instinct
LLBean 4 season

I don't think I'm missing much, but if there are tents out there I'm missing I'd be interested in knowing about them.

Thanks.

 

[sardog1]

What you're missing is the VE-25. I have its predecessor, the VE-24. You won't notice the weight nearly as much when the wind is hammering you in the locales you mention.

Here's a field report from last year:

Winter-Tent-Challenge-13

 

[jfb]

I have no experience with those three particular tents, but I notice that the Hilleberg tents have only 36.6 sq.ft. floors. That area is normally considered to be a two-person tent size. You may want to look at other two-person tents and then compare weights again.

Setting up a non-freestanding tent in late fall, the ground is likely to be frozen so you may want to use pegs that are stronger than the stock pegs, which will add a little more weight.

Other brand tents are Sierra Designs, MEC, REI, Integral Designs.

 

[Tom_Murphy]

some limited winter nights as well as late fall and early spring nights at reasonable elevation (3000 ft or higher in New England)

Does this mean above the treeline?

I have had great success using a 3 season tent for below treeline winter camping. You still need to be aware of snow loads and ventilation.

TJM

 

[Paul]

Generally no above treeline camping in New England, but certainly some out West.

What three-season tent are you using? Many of today's three season backpacking tents are one dimensional and focused only on minimizing weight. They are loaded with mesh and are really only 1-season (month) tents. I would like the weight minimized and the strength maximized, which is why I am strongly considering the Hilleberg. I have some old Sierra Design tents that work well for the type of application I am referring to, but they are two person and the water resistance they used to have has seriously degraded. Unfortunately Sierra Designs has taken a completely different approach in their latest product line and has very little to offer for the type of tent I need.

I was also looking at the REI Arete ASL, but that is no longer available.

 

[Paul]

Thanks for the comments. Sierra Designs has taken a different path and no longer offer 3+ season tents. Only single-walled and very lightweight designs (and a car camping series). REI had the Arete 3 ASL, but that seems to have been discontinued. Integral Designs seems to only offer a 3 person size tent in a single-wall design. I will look into MEC to see what they might have.

 

[sardog1]

I have some old Sierra Design tents that work well for the type of application I am referring to, but they are two person and the water resistance they used to have has seriously degraded.

Yes, I'm flogging a supine equine, but you should know this anyway:

Four years ago I left the then twenty-six year old VE-24 at a campground for a few hours to have dinner at a friend's house. On the way back, it was raining so hard that I had to pull off the road. The tent was bone dry inside, as in inside-an-Egyptian-pyramid dry.

[/hard sell]

 

[jfb]

I don't think I'm missing much, but if there are tents out there I'm missing I'd be interested in knowing about them.

Thanks.

You should probably consider the Nallo 4, with 46.3 sq. ft. of rectangular floor space.

 

[kaseri]

Hilleberg tents are by far the finest I've ever seen.

 

[Paul]

Hilleberg tents are by far the finest I've ever seen.

Thanks for the comments on the Hilleberg tents. This seems to be a widely shared sentiment by those who have seen the Hilleberg line. What tents do you both have experience with?

The Nallo 4 is an interesting choice. Its packed weight is only 6lb 12oz, amazing for a 4 person shelter with such protection. My only concern with the Red Label tents in the Hilleberg line is how warm they are. The material seems exceptionally lightweight and its hard to believe it offers such warmth at that weight. Do either of you have experience with that? I'm not planning on camping at Thunderstom Junction in mid-January, but some nice overnight trips when the weather turns fowl in late fall (temps in the 30's, windy, wet, etc.) and perhaps high elevation camping out West (10,00 feet or higher).

 

[Tom_Murphy]

What three-season tent are you using? Many of today's three season backpacking tents are one dimensional and focused only on minimizing weight. They are loaded with mesh and are really only 1-season (month) tents.

I use a Mountain Hardware Light Wedge 2 that I bought about ten years ago. It is my winter solo tent.

http://www.backcountry.com/mountain-hardwear-light-wedge-2-tent-2-person-3-season-mhw1785

 

[Chip]

Here's a field report from last year:

Winter-Tent-Challenge-13

I participated with my Sierra Designs tent, which did very well, but is not for above treeline.
There were many Eureka! tents on Rainier in 2008.

I have preferred free standing, double wall tents. I don't like the idea of a tent that is not freestanding as it is critical and may be difficult to get it staked out well.

This has some good info: http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/4-Season-Tent-Reviews?n=0&sort_field=score#compare

 

[jfb]

I've used a Sierra Designs 3-man and owned a Sierra Designs Glacier for 25 years. I've also used a NF VE-24 and now own Marmot Eclipse 1-P for summer and Mountain Hardwear Trango Assault.

I prefer the freestanding tents for all conditions, although tents that need staking work fine on a nice, grassy lawn.

If 40 sq. ft. is enough space, you could probably get by with a MH Trango 2. It's similar in size to the Hilleberg 3-man Saivo, but a pound lighter.

 

[Paul]

Thanks for your comments. The Saivo is a beautiful tent, but a bit more tent than I need. The Trango is of course a standard for guiding services and an excellent tent too, but I would need the 3 person version based on how the square footage is configured. I am closing in on the Nammatj 3 as it seems to be the best match for my needs and its strength to weight ratio seems to be near ideal for my purposes.