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torn&frayed
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I wonder if the park has ever considered putting up some of those "Turn Back Now" warning signs like the ones scattered around the Presidentials. My group has always treated Katahdin as if it were Washington or Adams with respect to the risks involved.
Blue
New member
Good article Tramper.
The biggest difference between Baxter and the WMNF is the hiker trailhead registration system at BSP. I stayed at Roaring Brook around Memorial Day and they were searching for 3 day hikers who were missing from the campground. They knew the campers were missing because of the sign in / sign out system, and had an idea of the trails they took during their hike. The 3 eventually found the park road after 2 nights out.
Around Mt. Washington, it's a different story, as you know. A hiker could go missing for days - if family doesn't report it, and there is no record of the route.
I would think that because Baxter's system, there are far more searches because if someone doesn't sign out, they will initiate a search (sometimes the parking lot for the car plates) after a certain length of time, whereas in the WMNF, they might not initiate searches if they don't know someone is missing.
I guess my point is that because of the two different systems, I would think it's hard to compare the number of SARs.
The biggest difference between Baxter and the WMNF is the hiker trailhead registration system at BSP. I stayed at Roaring Brook around Memorial Day and they were searching for 3 day hikers who were missing from the campground. They knew the campers were missing because of the sign in / sign out system, and had an idea of the trails they took during their hike. The 3 eventually found the park road after 2 nights out.
Around Mt. Washington, it's a different story, as you know. A hiker could go missing for days - if family doesn't report it, and there is no record of the route.
I would think that because Baxter's system, there are far more searches because if someone doesn't sign out, they will initiate a search (sometimes the parking lot for the car plates) after a certain length of time, whereas in the WMNF, they might not initiate searches if they don't know someone is missing.
I guess my point is that because of the two different systems, I would think it's hard to compare the number of SARs.
Tom Rankin
Well-known member
torn&frayed said:
I was up there in September, and I *THINK* there were signs like what you suggest.
In any case, the rangers at the trailhead ask questions of each group they see going by, about preparedness, water supply, etc. I guess it's possible to skirt the rangers, because the ranger at the top told me that he sees people up there in sandles, sneakers, etc., and some who have brought no water at all!
SherpaKroto
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Gee, thanks Al 
We were only 1/2 hour late (8:30) and having a great time. When we left we fully expected to make it a 12 hour day. I guess we should have mentioned that to the Rangers Just remember - if I wasn't late, you would have missed the Northern Lights!
BSP is much more in tune with where people are on the Mountain. They control who comes in, where they hike, and how many. Somewhat annoying, but no worry about seeing 300 people on a single trail (like Tuck's in the Whites), and comforting to know that should problems occur, there will be someone qualified who knows you are late.
We were only 1/2 hour late (8:30) and having a great time. When we left we fully expected to make it a 12 hour day. I guess we should have mentioned that to the Rangers Just remember - if I wasn't late, you would have missed the Northern Lights!BSP is much more in tune with where people are on the Mountain. They control who comes in, where they hike, and how many. Somewhat annoying, but no worry about seeing 300 people on a single trail (like Tuck's in the Whites), and comforting to know that should problems occur, there will be someone qualified who knows you are late.
When we were younger, we got "thrown out" of BSP for hiking the Knife Edge at night in early January. We had ascended the Chimney between Pamola and Chimney Peaks, and because conditions were really icy for descending the Dudley Trail (it was winter, duh), we decided to traverse the KE to descend the Cathedral Trail (rockier, but less icy). The Chimney Pond ranger was keeping an eye on our head lamps as we made our way across the KE to Baxter Peak and was waiting for us at the base of the Cathedral Trail with citations. Fortunately, the ranger did not make us head out that night, and we were departing the next morning anyway.
Nonlegit
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Now, i may have missed the point of this thread or may have not read correctly, so go ahead and fix it if i have no idea what i am talking about.
When i was At Mt. Washington last Feb. there was a sign in/out at pinkham notch and we were informed by one of the guys working the cash register that rangers were diligant with checking the logbook for people who did not follow their indicated plans...
*by around Mt. Washington, I assume your talking about all the collective routes that ascend the peak, correct? And also, our plans had to be written in the logbook, with times etc. And of course i am talking about winter only
*-I do know though from reading around (unfotunately not from experience) that BSP rangers are much more thorough, so much so that they actually check your gear before you attempt a winter ascent of Katahdin.
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I read the article, thanks for the link Tramper Al.
I found this paragraph interesting...
Rachel Therrien, a member of the park’s Advisory Committee, observed that people of all ages may be taking greater risks on mountains because "society is promoting extremism and no fear. We need to begin to get strong thinkers on this [issue]," she urged.
I happened to be at Chimney Pond in 1993 when Rachel Therrien screamed for help all night long, after attempting to descend from the Knife Edge to Chimney Pond by an "easier" route than the trail.
I found this paragraph interesting...
Rachel Therrien, a member of the park’s Advisory Committee, observed that people of all ages may be taking greater risks on mountains because "society is promoting extremism and no fear. We need to begin to get strong thinkers on this [issue]," she urged.
I happened to be at Chimney Pond in 1993 when Rachel Therrien screamed for help all night long, after attempting to descend from the Knife Edge to Chimney Pond by an "easier" route than the trail.
Nadine
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Two years ago I was having coffee with one of my Baxter Ranger buddies, and he said to me--in context of the conversation..."this ain't Mount Washington, where you can live free or die trying"
FWIW, I hiked up the AT early this spring, my name first on the register for the day. On my way up I passed a hiker descending. Knowing I was the first name on the list I struck up a conversation with the fellow. He was carrying no pack, but he did have 50ft of 10mm rope, a few technical climbing pieces, and was wearing bluejeans and sneakers. He told me he summittted yesterday, but was too tired to descend back to his lean-to so he spent the night on the trail. He had no prior hiking experience, and no idea what to expect. He carried no extra clothing, water or food.
It's amazing the number of hikers I see in baxter dressed in jeans (or other cotton clothing) and sneakers.
Nadine
FWIW, I hiked up the AT early this spring, my name first on the register for the day. On my way up I passed a hiker descending. Knowing I was the first name on the list I struck up a conversation with the fellow. He was carrying no pack, but he did have 50ft of 10mm rope, a few technical climbing pieces, and was wearing bluejeans and sneakers. He told me he summittted yesterday, but was too tired to descend back to his lean-to so he spent the night on the trail. He had no prior hiking experience, and no idea what to expect. He carried no extra clothing, water or food.
It's amazing the number of hikers I see in baxter dressed in jeans (or other cotton clothing) and sneakers.
Nadine
A ranger's duties
The summer that I spent mapping glacial geology from a camp at Chimney Pond, I assisted Chris Drew (he was then CP ranger, so that dates me) with many unbelievable night rescues from the Knife Edge and elsewhere on the mountain during rainstorms, etc. To this day I have never seen so many ill-prepared people hiking in the Whites or in any mountain environment on the planet as I encountered that summer in Baxter, by whatever standard, total numbers, per capita, or any other metric. That summer, Katahdin seemed like a magnet to those without a clue.
About that time, authorities at Denali National Park were encountering the same problems, so their solution was to lighten up on the regs, with their thought being that perhaps folks would take on more personal responsibility, assuming that they were expecting automatic rescue tagged to their climbing permits, etc. For the most part, this change worked for Denali.
The funniest (not ha, ha funny) story of my summer at CP was meeting a guy that Chris had to bust for at least five violations, including: 1) hiking without signing in/out, hiking with a dog, carrying a fishing rod, traveling off trail, illegal camping (the guy did not know where he had spent the previous night, but it was above treeline), and probably a few other infractions that I cannot remember.
But, to put Katahdin in its proper context, later during the same winter that I got busted for hiking the Knife Edge at night, a group of six ice climbers on Pamola Peak got nailed by an unseen March storm (these are notorious on Katahdin, and commonly build out of view to the west from CP), were forced to bivi just below the summit, and suffered one death and one double amputation of the legs due to severe frostbite. Two of the leaders had pioneered some of the hardest ice climbing routes on Katahdin.
The summer that I spent mapping glacial geology from a camp at Chimney Pond, I assisted Chris Drew (he was then CP ranger, so that dates me) with many unbelievable night rescues from the Knife Edge and elsewhere on the mountain during rainstorms, etc. To this day I have never seen so many ill-prepared people hiking in the Whites or in any mountain environment on the planet as I encountered that summer in Baxter, by whatever standard, total numbers, per capita, or any other metric. That summer, Katahdin seemed like a magnet to those without a clue.
About that time, authorities at Denali National Park were encountering the same problems, so their solution was to lighten up on the regs, with their thought being that perhaps folks would take on more personal responsibility, assuming that they were expecting automatic rescue tagged to their climbing permits, etc. For the most part, this change worked for Denali.
The funniest (not ha, ha funny) story of my summer at CP was meeting a guy that Chris had to bust for at least five violations, including: 1) hiking without signing in/out, hiking with a dog, carrying a fishing rod, traveling off trail, illegal camping (the guy did not know where he had spent the previous night, but it was above treeline), and probably a few other infractions that I cannot remember.
But, to put Katahdin in its proper context, later during the same winter that I got busted for hiking the Knife Edge at night, a group of six ice climbers on Pamola Peak got nailed by an unseen March storm (these are notorious on Katahdin, and commonly build out of view to the west from CP), were forced to bivi just below the summit, and suffered one death and one double amputation of the legs due to severe frostbite. Two of the leaders had pioneered some of the hardest ice climbing routes on Katahdin.
