It's not funny

[DougPaul]

Depending on the IP, pranksters may be ban-able (I used to help moderate a board that uses the same software as VFTT; we used ip's to suss out multiple accounts, in some cases ban particularly troublesome trolls)

IP addresses are not a good way to identify individuals. An entire organization can sit behind the IP address of its firewall, most home users have dynamically assigned IP addresses (ie they can change), and more than one person can use a single machine.

I am not a lawyer, but it is my understanding that a search warrant would likely be required to get access to the information necessary to trace an IP address to an individual. And even with such information, it still may not always be possible.



With regard to inaccurate conditions reports (intentional or not), one should always keep one's judgment turned on when hiking no matter what one has been told. Which appears to be what Mike Morse did.

Doug

 

[BobC]

I'm amazed that some people think it's stupid to actually plan your hike around trail conditions reports. Yes, it's foolish to not be prepared for anything...conditions can change between the time of the report and when you get to the trailhead. But if you're not supposed to plan your trip based on the reported conditions, why even have a trail conditions section? What else would people read it for, if not to have info for planning ahead?

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Page one of NH trail conditions contains 25 reports totaling 6680 thread views with an average of 267.2 reads per thread.

Somebody reads them for some reason.

Tim

 

[Rick]

I do not know anyone specifically, but I have heard rumours of some aspiring ADK winter 46ers who would wait until a large ADK Chapter had a trip to a set of peaks and then they wouls swoop in the next day to take advantage of the ease of a broken trail to the top.

I am not comfortable with this, if it is being done by climbers wholesale.
I always looked upon getting to the trailhead and finding the trail broken out as a sort of Trail Magic. Not something I would seek out specifically as it seems a bit like asking for slackpacking. Anyways just my $.02

 

[Peakbagr]

"but I have heard rumours of some aspiring ADK winter 46ers who would wait until a large ADK Chapter had a trip to a set of peaks and then they wouls swoop in the next day to take advantage of the ease of a broken trail to the top."

This has been going on for years. In the Adirondacks, Catskills and New England.

 

[Ridgewalker]

There is a reason why trail conditions are at your risk, even the most well intended report is based upon the deceit or veracity, skill, speed, and other factors and thus it remains current dependant on those cases. I think our eyes have poured over this issue enough. We've called out the ethics and the case has been adressed, let the wicked be punished and let known.

 

[Neil]

I don't know which is the funniest: the bogus TR, the sucker, the sucker telling the on-line world about it or getting steamed up over the whole thing. My reaction was to laugh my head off. No one's life will ever be in jeopardy and no one should rely on the TR's any more than they rely on the weather report.

Who knows, maybe with the phenomenon of trail vulturing some person decided to mete out his or her own twisted form of justice. Perhaps they are reading this thread and rubbing their hands together gleefully knowing that they "caught" someone and as a bonus have begat this thread.

Trail vultures be warned: This can happen to you.

I learned from a very reliable source that a certain Dack winter hiker actually phones people from the trailhead (people are requested to leave their phone numbers in the registers at the ADK TH's) just to make sure they made it to the summit.

Personally, I'm still trying to find Toolshed Hill.

 

[NewHampshire]

Lame? Sure I guess I could go with that. Endanger somones life? Can't see how there though. I mean, if a trail is not broken out, or if no ice is reported somewheres and indeed there is, well no one is forcing the person who read and believed that report to continue on. As has been said, use the reports at your own risk. Frankly this is why I don't bother with trail conditions reports. They don't interest me (either for information or as entertainment ) since I go prepared for all conditions at all times and am prepared to a) do what I have to do to get somewheres, or b) just turn back. If I decide one day I want to go somewheres and/or on a certain trail I go. If it is broken out, great. If not, oh well break out the snowshoes. Thats what hiking is about. I think some people have become spoiled by the trail conditions reports and the fact that winter hiking has become so in vouge. I remember Hikerfast telling me about when he was winter hiking back in the 80's, when you pretty much were guarenteed to have to break trail from start to finish, and the only way to really get help was to join an AMC mass group hike. Think about that the next time you debate "gee, should I bring the snowshoes or not".

Brian

 

[Waumbek]

caveat emptor, buyer beware;
caveat lector, reader beware;
caveat hiker.

Thus ever always. Nothing new here.

 

[smitty77]

I remember Hikerfast telling me about when he was winter hiking back in the 80's, when you pretty much were guarenteed to have to break trail from start to finish, and the only way to really get help was to join an AMC mass group hike.

The hike to Carter Notch I brought up in the "hut temperature" thread was done in such a time. 19-mile brook was well packed, but the path to Wildcat A was covered with about 16" of unmolested snow. Before the internet, every hike was planned with a "best guess" as to trail and weather conditions.

We are truly spoiled in this information age.

 

[drewski]

funny---i think its hysterical

i love toolshed hill---thats in VT right???

 

[Paradox]

Toolshed Hill? As a matter of fact, I have my GPS track right here.

 

[Neil]

Toolshed Hill? As a matter of fact, I have my GPS track right here.

You wouldn't happen to know if it was broken out would you?

 

[Paradox]

You wouldn't happen to know if it was broken out would you?

Heh, heh, heh.

 

[MonadnockVol]

Just a rumor

I suppose there's no truth to the rumor that VFTT is installing webcams every 50 feet along every official trail in the Northeast so that none of us will ever be in doubt about conditions ever again. Another benefit is that I will never have to go hiking again: I'll just log in.

 

[McRat]

I suppose there's no truth to the rumor that VFTT is installing webcams every 50 feet along every official trail in the Northeast so that none of us will ever be in doubt about conditions ever again. Another benefit is that I will never have to go hiking again: I'll just log in.

Actually, it is true... and I heard Giggy is funding it!

I just wanna say you're awesome, Giggy! If I can't join you to break out Tom, Field and Willey after every snowstorm, I only hope we can rope up sometime and ascend the treacherous north face of toolshed itself. It may only be 10 feet, but it's almost a 90° angle of sheer surface with minimal handholds and a treacherously thin layer of ice at best.

Of course, now that you've reunited Led Zepplin for the Winter Gathering (hope I didn't let the cat out of the bag ), you probably wont have time to hang out with lower-downs like myself; nor should a man of your standing have to endure such a distraction from your great works.

Rock on, Guy! Rock on.

 

[cbcbd]

C'mon, we all know that the only time to bag any peaks is after Mats is done breaking all the trails for the rest of us.

 

[RoySwkr]

I remember Hikerfast telling me about when he was winter hiking back in the 80's, when you pretty much were guarenteed to have to break trail from start to finish, and the only way to really get help was to join an AMC mass group hike.

Or sneak up the next day

What amuses me is that now even large groups are afraid to go out and break trail, we used to break out NH100 bushwhacks with 2 people where there was definitely no previous track. Of course we used bigger snowshoes than what is common now. But an AMC group thinking that it's too deep to go to Owls Head - isn't that why you go with a group? [Sorry, maximum group size for Owls Head is 4 and "guided" groups aren't allowed off-trail in Wilderness ]

 

[RickB.]

Can some one explain why we care whether some one else benefits by our trail breaking? Perhaps, if a very able-bodied hiker did nothing but exploit others' work but, let's face it, we generally end out doing our share whether we want to or not. Trails blowing in and untallied mountain snowfall have certainly put me to (unexpected) work over the years. Do we now view our activity as many road cyclists do theirs, that if you can't average 18 mph (break trail all day), you shouldn't be out there?
The "advancements" we've witnessed and accomplished, such as all in one winter lists, would be very difficult, indeed, if many of the trails had not been previously broken out and that's why that wasn't done until the 90's (I believe). And the solo achievements so common today would be impractical and more dangerous without the trail condition info we share. But I don't think this prank is endangering others as much as just being very inconsiderate.
People drive long distances planning to do hikes solo or in small groups that wouldn't go without close to the reported conditions. So, no, I don't think it's funny. Are we trying to help one another with our trail condition reports or just spraying our latest conquests?

 

[PA Ridgerunner]

I do not know anyone specifically, but I have heard rumours of some aspiring ADK winter 46ers who would wait until a large ADK Chapter had a trip to a set of peaks and then they wouls swoop in the next day to take advantage of the ease of a broken trail to the top.

I am not comfortable with this, if it is being done by climbers wholesale.
I always looked upon getting to the trailhead and finding the trail broken out as a sort of Trail Magic. Not something I would seek out specifically as it seems a bit like asking for slackpacking. Anyways just my $.02

Some have even been known to check weather forecasts.