Multiple Hiker Rescue by other hikers on a Presi

[peakbagger]

https://www.concordmonitor.com/Pete...ers-in-White-Mountains-Fish-and-Game-34810825

Once you scroll through the ads there is a good level of detail. Hard for folks from away to realize that even though there are still small patches of snow in the mountains that the temps are getting high even up north.

I usually have some NUUN and couple of Oral Rehydration packets in my daypack. I have handed out a few Nuun on long distance meetup hikes for folks who had symptons of electrolyte imbalance.

 

[Rhody Seth]

Good on those young folks for being prepared and knowing what to do!

 

[TEO]

From the article linked to above:
"Meanwhile, Emergency Medical Services were telling Leddy that it might take three or four hours to get a rescue squad up to them and they’d have to foot the bill, she said."

When will someone is going to decline to be rescued upon hearing that they will be billed and sustain serious injury or death as a result?

 

[sierra]

From the article linked to above:
"Meanwhile, Emergency Medical Services were telling Leddy that it might take three or four hours to get a rescue squad up to them and they’d have to foot the bill, she said."

When will someone is going to decline to be rescued upon hearing that they will be billed and sustain serious injury or death as a result?

I did a double take when I read that. That cannot be considered a standard practice, I hope. Get them down an then worry about charging them.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

911/EMS is not the ones who go out - F&G does (or the WMNF Snow Ranger's in the bowls in winter). It's on F&G to decide, based on preparedness and your Hike Safe or other $upport (fishing/hunting license or OHRV/Boating...) whether or not you should be billed. 911/EMS/Ambulance will typically bill you or your insurance even in town.

I think

Tim

 

[sierra]

911/EMS is not the ones who go out - F&G does (or the WMNF Snow Ranger's in the bowls in winter). It's on F&G to decide, based on preparedness and your Hike Safe or other $upport (fishing/hunting license or OHRV/Boating...) whether or not you should be billed. 911/EMS/Ambulance will typically bill you or your insurance even in town.

I think

Tim

That makes sense, EMS told them that, not F&G. Good catch.

 

[peakbagger]

In past rescues F&G has reportedly given out similar advice that their response time was not instantaneous and those calling for rescue may be responsible for rescue costs. I dont see why other posters object to what is essentially the truth.

 

[skiguy]

In past rescues F&G has reportedly given out similar advice that their response time was not instantaneous and those calling for rescue may be responsible for rescue costs. I dont see why other posters object to what is essentially the truth.

If they called in the first place what are the chances of them saying..."Ah forget it if your going to charge me. I'll just lie here and die". On the other hand it's argued that folks may not call in the first place knowing they may get charged. In either case negligence or recklessness is the underlying reason for being charged. How do we decrease those underlying behaviors? Better education possibly. Although IMO there will always be an underlying ignorance amongst the outdoor population. I have no hard facts. But if the last week is any indication it seems as if the unprepared is on the rise. Is this because of increased population and or an increased user base. Hopefully not an increase in baseline ignorance.

 

[DayTrip]

But if the last week is any indication it seems as if the unprepared is on the rise. Is this because of increased population and or an increased user base. Hopefully not an increase in baseline ignorance.

I would say there has definitely been a noticeable increase in non-hiker/first time hiker/less experienced hikers hitting the trail this year, presumably from the lack of recreation options due to COVID. Seeing a lot of people in jeans, no packs, groups which are clearly families, etc, etc. I did my first hike back in the Whites last week and foot traffic definitely seemed higher. (I went up the Skook to Lafayette; got a really early start and saw no people until I hit ridge, passed 14 people above treeline ALL attempting 1 day pemi-loops; On way down I passed over 20 people on Skook and many of them were definitely not "normal" hikers). Several told me they had been to 1-2 other trail heads but they were mobbed. So I presume this year will involve a lot of folks like this story just looking to get out there and having no idea what they are getting into.

 

[JustJoe]

It's the new normal. Get used to it.

https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/519753455/father-and-son-rescued-from-jewell-trail

 

[jfb]

That's a great adventure for a 8-year-old kid. Good thing his father knew exactly who to call for assistance.

 

[skiguy]

It's the new normal. Get used to it.

https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/519753455/father-and-son-rescued-from-jewell-trail

So that makes it a "Hat Trick" for the last week. Get out the lawn chairs and the popcorn. It's going to be an entertaining Summer.

 

[ChrisB]

It's the new normal. Get used to it.

https://www.einnews.com/pr_news/519753455/father-and-son-rescued-from-jewell-trail

I like the part where F&G try TWICE to talk this guy out of a rescue. "Come on buddy, you can do it! You got 50% battery life in that iPhone."

Well if he's really from tony Westport CT he'll have no trouble paying for this little misadventure.

On they good side they did summit!

 

[peakbagger]

I think somewhere in the past on VFTT, probably pre facebook was a report of a upset hiker who had decided to publicize their poor treatment by the AMC LOC hut crew. They had ended up near the hut late in the day and demanded that the hut crew let them stay the night. The hut was full so the hut crew offered to sell them a flashlight and point them down Ammo trail. The individuals were unhappy about this option and I think the AMC offered them to contact Fish and Game to declare an emergency. They grudgingly ended up walking down and then proceeded to try to bad mouth the AMC.

Many if not all rescue related services have emergency protocols in place, before they are executed someone in authority has to make the decision to declare an emergency. F&G has that authority, they dont leave that decision to the person asking for rescue as every rescue response has the potential to cause other unplanned for impacts.To the person asking for rescue their priority is going to be the highest. Its sad to say but ATV accidents are now the number one user of F&G resources in Coos county (not so sure about Grafton). A typical F&G response to a hiker rescue potentially ties up more F&G staff than an ATV rescue. Once those staff are committed they are not readily available to respond to other rescues. So the decision to send a couple of rangers up to walk some under equipped hikers in warm conditions could mean not having the resources to respond to a more serious event. This happens all the time and at some point the state runs out of resources. Volunteer groups can help staff the rescues bu a F&G officer has to be in charge.

 

[Andrew]

In my experience it is actually a good idea to inform a patient as to exactly how their rescue will pan-out. In-experienced hikers just assume that a call for a rescue will be some quick modern, painless extrication- not the long painful ordeal that is about to ensue. I worked for NH State Parks at Monadnock for 15 years starting in the early 90's, the last 8 as the park manager and defacto S&R chief. Under the previous supervisor we put almost every patient in a litter and carried them down (often with them jumping out and saying thanks at the trailhead!) I remember one epic rainy Columbus Day weekend where we were called for 5 nearly simultaneous rescues reportedly needing carries; we ran back and forth putting the best equipment and resources to each only to find the next more serious and some serious choices having to be made.

We had the advantage of having 2 paid 'Mountain Patrollers" roaming the mountain (weekends & holiday's only) and some pretty reliable/experienced regular volunteers who got really good at discussing the realities of their situation w/ patients as they performed high level first aid (sometimes fiberglas casts) while either waiting for the team to arrive or help the patient perform a self rescue. Many times when I responded and explained the reality of the rescue to a patient they realized they could make some choices of their own that in the end may be better for all.

I winced at the ".....and you might have to pay......", but it does need to be said. My dentist always makes me sign such disclaimer of the possibility of going beyond my insurance coverage. An example being the day back at Monadnock when a patroller happened on a strong hiker he knew sitting off trail complaining of light-headedness and tingling in his left arm. We suspected cardio situation naturally, and it was winter with a nasty storm heading in so we did not want this to turn into a carry late into the evening storm. Managed to get Maine Med. to fly on behalf of DHART and pluck the patient from the upper ledges within an hour and half. Turned out to be a toxic chemical exposure build up from the patients workplace. The hiker was mad at us for years that he was expected to pay the multiple thousand $ helicopter ride bill....which was eventually negotiated down quite a bit.

It's not always as cut and dry as one might think!

 

[ChrisB]

In my experience it is actually a good idea to inform a patient as to exactly how their rescue will pan-out. ... I winced at the ".....and you might have to pay......", but it does need to be said.

Agreed. The White Cross and White Dot trails do generate their share of drama to be sure. And knowing it is not necessarily a free ride down can change a person's outlook.

At least we don't have an "Into the Wild" bus here in NH. Alaska just removed that accident-magnet from the backcountry.

 

[skiguy]

Agreed. The White Cross and White Dot trails do generate their share of drama to be sure. And knowing it is not necessarily a free ride down can change a person's outlook.

At least we don't have an "Into the Wild" bus here in NH. Alaska just removed that accident-magnet from the backcountry.

But we have Mount Washington.
Colorful 19th-century circus showman P.T. Barnum was a lucky guy.
Not only did he have success in the world of entertainment, he had a clear day on one of the several days when he reached the summit of Mount Washington — always a rarity, given the 6,288-foot mountain's notorious weather, which is said to be cloud-covered 60 percent of any given year and which is “Home to the World's Worst Weather!”
Barnum was reportedly so impressed, he hailed the view as “the second greatest show on Earth!”

 

[Will]

At least we don't have an "Into the Wild" bus here in NH. Alaska just removed that accident-magnet from the backcountry.[/URL]

There's apparently no truth to the silly rumor that the AMC is going to have it dropped on the top of Lafayette and charge $147.50 admission.

Looks like it's going to be a flat $150.

 

[Mike P.]

It's a great loop and some of us would have made it even with the 11:30 start. For the rest of us, myself included who should take advantage of cooler early morning temps to ascend (loved the snow on 6/13 in NY that we had) the 11:30 heat of the day start is a poor choice even if you have hours of more daylight.

I had hoped to take my 17 year old up Washington this year but with Covid-19 summits with lines for pictures seems kind of silly. We weren't all that comfortable sharing Cliff's small summit opening with three other people. I don't know how they got a parking spot at 11:30!

 

[DayTrip]

I had hoped to take my 17 year old up Washington this year but with Covid-19 summits with lines for pictures seems kind of silly. !

I was up there SAT and without the Cog and the shuttles the summit sign line was pretty small. Don't think I ever saw more than 6-8 people gathered there at any one time and most people were trying to maintain some distance from each other. Lot of groups gathered in more remote parts of the summit area to take photos.