Newbie interested in basics

vftt.org

Help Support vftt.org:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Toe Cozy

New member
Joined
Sep 1, 2004
Messages
497
Reaction score
102
Location
Springfield, Springfield!. Avatar: Spruce Peak Kim
Hi all,

I tried to do a search for this info, but I'm clearly not capable of that difficult task since I didn't find what I needed. So I'll just ask here. Sorry if this is beating a dead horse so to speak. Feel free to just point me to previous thread or web pages or whatever.

I am interested in trying some winter hiking this year, but I'm a little intimidated by it all. I'd love some info on basic day hike gear necessities and nice-to-haves, good hikes to start with, (Vermont locales esp. It's where I live).

Thanks!

Toe Cozy.
 
No problem. A good place to start is to scroll down in this forum until you reach the recent "winter hiking protocol" thread. About 25 posters weighed in on that one. What sort of summer hiking have you done? That would help to give recommendations about winter hikes.
 
Hey Miss Toe Cozy,

My offer to take you on your first winter hiking trip is still there if you are interested. I was thinking maybe we could hike something the Sunday after Christmas in Vermont. Call me and we can figure out our schedules.

As far as gear to start with . . . you can use your Osprey for your winter daypack, it is a bit big but if you pack your gear properly you can cinch it down and have it carry well. Rent snowshoes first if you don't want to jump feet first into winter gear buying. If you are gonna do smaller hikes with not much steep, you can get away with either no crampons or just insteps. You can also rent crampons . . .

Warm clothes, layers work really well. For both top and bottom, start with a base synthetic layer like Bergelene and add layers as you see fit ending with a waterproof/resistent wind blocking layer. I carry the middle insulating layer (fleece top and bottom) and only wear 2 layers because I tend to heat up quickly. For below treeline hiking, I carry a pair of liner gloves, a pair of fleece gloves and a pair of heavy duty overmitts or heavy warm mittens. I also carry those chemical warmers for just in case. I wear one heavy pair of socks but you can wear a liner and a pair of wool or synthetic socks. The boots are really a personal preference and very dependent on where and what you are hiking.

When I first started winter hiking I used my 3 season boots but quickly found they weren't enough for what I was hiking and so I have been wearing a pair of Montrail Moraines which are heavy duty winter leathers. Last winter I finally invested in a pair of double plastic boots because my winter activities were getting more challenging and I found my boots would freeze on overnighters.

You also want to have things like neck warmers/scarfs, hats/ear muffs, and other warm things like that . . .

You might also want to invest in a couple of water bottle insulators and nalgene bottles.

Well, that is just some things to start with . . . I am sure I have fortgotten something but others will jump in with more advice and do check out that other thread, it has GREAT information.

Welcome to the world of winter hiking girl . . . you are HOOKED now :)

sli74
 
Oh goodie!!! Replies already, how fun!!! :D

I knew I'd find you here Jaws! If I'm hooked it's all your fault, you know that right? Anyway...what the heck are insteps and where does one find them?? I can't sleep until I know the answer to this perplexing question! Isn't fun to have someone so clueless about stuff! Then you can shower me with all your hard earned knowledge. I love your avatar picture, BTW. I was starting to feel less excited about winter hiking as the weather has gotten colder...but just today the bug bit me and I know I have to get out there and try it a little bit this winter. So, we'll have to talk and figure out when I can go with you. I'm planning on going for my first winter hike with you! I just gotta! I'm so excited.

Waumbek, my summer hiking has been mostly day hikes until this summer/fall when I did 130 miles backpacking on the LT (with sli74). I have hiked Katahdin over the Knife's Edge in the summer. I am comfortable doing up to an 11 mile hike over moderately difficult terrain in one day, in good weather, with a 30 lb. pack, in general. I can go further...but then it's not fun anymore. I have no experience with orienteering. I haven't done any serious hikes in the Whites at all. I know, you're all aghast at that, how can I cross things off a list if I don't hike in the Whites?...but it's the truth. I love hiking, but I'm no peakbagger...yet. ;)

Anyway...looking forward to other posts. Thanks for the info and encouragement.

T.Co.
 
Last edited:
TC, sounds like you're pretty accomplished already but if you're going solo in winter a good first hike is Butler Lodge on the Butler Lodge Trail (west side of Mansfield). The road and parking lot at the trailhead are plowed out by the town. The hike is a couple of miles and moderate grade. Butler Lodge is a great place to hang out. There's no woodstove in winter any more, of course, but it's a place to get inside for awhile. Then you can make the decision about whether to go further up. There's a spur to the Long Trail although from there on up the going gets tougher. You've already done that in summer as part of your LT backpack so you know, and if the snow is very new and deep, the spur may not be broken out. In any event, the lodge itself is a good first destination. It has a nice view west to Lake Champlain. If you want company at the lodge, go any holiday weekend or week in winter; if not, pick a weekday during a non-holiday time. The Butler Lodge trail will probably always be broken out after a weekend. Have fun! After that, the sky's the limit ...
 
gear is always fun, in fact maybe too fun for me (im a gear junkie)...

However, there are some winter basics (and im sure some others will pitch in their basics)

1. It gets really cold, and you ALWAYS have to overprepare in a sense. Basically just remember that you cant go in somewhere and get warm, a tent doesnt count. You get warm and dry by your body and whatever you carried along with you. Cotton kills counts in the winter x 100.
2. bring More food and water-candy works good when you wake up at night :D keeps you warm, dont let your water freeze
3. as long as you are dressed and have food and water, then its all about getting around. then you might want to look into snowshoes, crampons, touring skis, etc, whatever floats your boat.


-leave a plan, take a friend, be safe. ice is slippery and it can get cold. people die in NE all the time in the winter because of underpreparedness(...), and sometimes due to unfortunate events even prepared and experienced people get in trouble. Just dont underestimate anything :rolleyes:

^ very oversimplfied, but the basics
 
Insteps are basically 4 points crampon style that get strapped onto your boots so the points are under the arch part of your boot. I own a pair but usually I either go with just my boots (barebooting) or with full crampons . . . I am kinda a wimp about ice so I put the crampons on long before everyone else . . . here is a link to the insteps I own . . .

http://www.campmor.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?memberId=12500226&productId=47886

Knowing you however, you will be hiking with me checking mountains off some list or the other so you might wanna just invest in full crampons. Most folks find 10-pont crampons sufficient . . . I own the Grivel G-12 s and I LOVE them. My snowshoes are the MSR Denali Ascents now but I started with the Atlas 1022s . . . both great snowshoes . . .

I am looking forward to hiking with you again real soon . . . I don't know if we can match the feat of hiking 130 miles on your first backpacking trip but winter is a ton of fun if you are well prepared and hiking with good friends . . . Talk to you soon,

sli74
 
Toe Cozy: Hiking with Seema in the winter is fun (when is hiking with Seema not fun?), and you'll be in good hands. Wait until you see the neat things her hair does!

Most everything that you need will come some from trial and error. Start small, stay away from cotton, work out a layer system, and just go. I'm sure that there are some local hills that you are very familiar with, so start there. Learn map and compass basics: one good way to strt the learning process is to take them out on every hike as you start. Orient the map with your compass, visualize your route, and pay attention to features that you will pass. The more you use it, the better you will get.

Knowledge comes fast and there are 2 ways to gain it:
1) the hard way: head out, and you'll see what you need. Taken to the extreme, it would take you about 3 steps when barefoot to realize that you needed boots:)
2) the expensive way: buy it, try it, replace it.

I prefer method #1. Sure, you might suffer a bit, but you will quikly find what you REALLY want and need. Pay attention to what your hiking partners use, and don't be afraid to ask questions during the hike.

OK, a long list follows (you've been warned!)
Here is a gear summary of what I use for a typical day hike:
General comment on clothing: the most important piece of gear that you will need. Layering is key, starting with a good polypro or capilene layer and building from there. Focus on hand, head and eye protection: you will want to be able to cover every exposed inch of skin when required to prevent frostbite. With proper clothing, you will find that you stay quite comfortable while hiking. With that said:
Base Layer: I start with a midweight (or lightweight if warm) polypro long sleeve top and bottom. I also have a poly/mohair shirt that I like. As it gets colder, I put a T-shirt on (REI poly). I also carry a Sportif Windstopper fleece vest (the back is regular fleece). It goes on often before (or instead of) my shell
Hands: Poly liner GLOVES under Fox River double ragg wool MITTS under OR Gore-Tex overmitts. I carry fleece and Gore-Tex liners, have used them infrequently, but I always carry them!
Socks: Smartwool Expedition weight over poly or Thermax liners. Also use Wigwams and Thorlo, but Smartwool are #1 to me. I don’t use VBL, but some folks like them.
Gaiters: OR (Outdoor Research) Expedition Crocs. Try them on over your boots and hiking pants before you buy them. The Expedition Crocs are the only Crocs that fit my short stubby legs :), but I suspect the regular Crocs will fit you fine. Gaiters are real important for dryness and warmth.
Wind Pants: I don’t get cold easily, so only use Marmot Precips. I am looking for a good pair of waterproof/breathable full zip pants, but have not been lucky (you won’t have that problem – they just don’t think guys like me hike)
Shell/Jacket: Sportif 3 ply Goretex shell with hood. Cabelas Down Jacket sized to fit over my shell (like a TNF Nuptse)
Hat/Balaclava: OR Peruvian windstopper hat and OR Windstopper Gorilla balaclava (I’m not sold on this one yet). I also have a Seirus neoprene/fleece facemask that I use often
Eye Protection: Smith Double lens goggles. Julbo Sherpa glacier glasses. I coat both with Cat Crap to keep them from fogging. I wear my contacts in winter almost exclusively.
Boots: I love my Koflach Degre's but spent quite a few years hiking with leathers before I could afford them. If doing day trips, stiff leathers (steel shank) will be fine to start. Light day hikers are not recommended. Make sure that they are waterproofed well (I use sno-seal)
Crampons: I've never had a problem with my Grivel G-10's New Classics. I bought my recent pair 6 years ago. They are a modified strap type and fit a wide variety of boots
Snowshoes: I've not seen many wooden snowshoes on the trail, but they would be excellent off trail. I really like my MSR Denali Evo Ascents and my Sherpa Khumbu Climbers. I carry a repair kit of some basic items, mostly pins, duct tape and cable ties.
Hiking Poles: mandatory IMO. They help you keep your balance, and are indispensable in helping you get back up if you fall (or end up in a spruce trap). Make sure that you swap to the winter snowflake baskets.
Water: I use an OR bottle parka for one of my water bottles, and stash the 2 others in my pack, near my back. I typically carry 3-4 liters on winter hike. You need to be very conscious of staying hydrated in winter!
Pack: Yes, you will need a pack to carry all this stuff. When choosing one, pay close attention to how you will attach your snowshoes and crampons. When they are not secured well, it will quickly be a source of frustration. I use a TNF Exocet, like it, but would love it if it had some internal frame system. Figure on 2000-3000 cu in.

That's the short list... It doesn’t get into the safety gear that you will want to bring (stove, 20F sleeping bag for every 2 people, etc), but at least it’s a start. There are many good gear lists available on the web.

As Nike would say: Just Do it. And as the Boy Scouts say: Be Prepared.
 
Last edited:
Toe Cozy,

The secret to winter (shhhh)?
It's better than summer.

The best feeling is being out on a frigid day with friends and get out on a summit with a little wind and snow -- you stop and realize that you're warm and feel good, even if you eye lashes have frozen ;)

Sherpa's suggestions are great. Last year I borrowed a few things from my local outdoors club (crampons) and purchased some things that I thought were essential (hard shell, soft shell for example). Some things are very personal -- my hands get cold no matter what gloves and glove liners that I have on -- so I bring those chemical warm packs and toss them in my jacket. They have been essential to me, especially at -23 degrees. My point is to think about yourself in regards to gear - do you heat up fast? cool down fast? do hats make your head sweat?

oh - and I bought plastic boots at the end of last season - I can't wait to try them out!
 
SherpaKroto said:
I am looking for a good pair of waterproof/breathable full zip pants, but have not been lucky (you won’t have that problem – they just don’t think guys like me hike).

Why, whatever do you mean, guys like you, Sherpa? I thought you were just 3 elite athletes rolled into one!!! ;)

SherpaKroto said:
As Nike would say: Just Do it. And as the Boy Scouts say: Be Prepared).

An excellent yin/yang of quotable quotes. I lean more toward the Boy Scout side of things though. Let's hope that doesn't make me an arm chair winter hiker for 5 years the same way I was an arm chair backpacker before I went out and "just did it" this summer!

So, do you think I can get away with my Vasque Sundowner Leather/goretex boots at least for beginning easier stuff? Or am I gonna have to get some more serious leather boots right away?

T.Co.
 
Toe Cozy said:
So, do you think I can get away with my Vasque Sundowner Leather/goretex boots at least for beginning easier stuff? Or am I gonna have to get some more serious leather boots right away?
Go for it. I often hike in my Asolo 535's or Cerro Torre's in winter. There is no real "mystery" with Winter hiking: it's just colder and has more snow than the other seasons:). Think of it like driving in winter: you take extra precautions (carry a shovel, jacket, scraper, drive more cautiously, etc), but likely only switch to the snow tires when you really feel that you want/need them. They will be fine to start out. You'll know when you want/need more boot.

If I keep "recuperating" I'll soon be 4 elite athletes;) The Buddha Packpacking Team lives!
 
Top