Please help NH F&G this Christmas

[forestgnome]

Please read this article about the budget crunch at New Hampshire Fish and Game. These great folks are an enormous benefit to us all. They often rescue injured or lost hikers, and they have done priceless work to protect wildlife and habitat. They are looking at ways to restructure the funding, perhaps capture a small portion of meals and rooms taxes.

In the meantime, you can help by purchasing items from F@G, such as calenders, Wildlife Journal subscriptions, etc. What a wonderful Christmas present for loved one!

Happy Trails

 

[HAMTERO]

thanks for the info forestnome.

 

[BIGEarl]

Buyer Beware

Sorry if it seems that I'm a little grumpy about this, but...

From personal experience I can tell you to avoid their gift certificates.

I received one a few years ago and they did a bait-and-switch. Even though there were no notices posted in their Concord headquarters sales office or on-line regarding restrictions on their use, they refused to accept the gift certificate when I attempted a purchase in their Concord office and required cash payment. When they refused to accept the gift certificate I requested something in writing documenting the policy. They were unable or unwilling to provide the requested information. They were also unwilling to issue a refund.

Now, I am stuck with a gift certificate that will require a few more years to completely use.

And, I am forced into providing an interest-free loan to the New Hampshire Fish & Game Department.

 

[NewHampshire]

Talk about Bureaucracy bull. The Fish and Game is getting the short end of the stick lately. When I register my boat, I have to do it through the State DMV. I do not own a snowmobile or 4 wheeler, but I assumer registration is the same. So whay does the F&G get stuck doing the grunt work in enforcment without budgetary supplementation? And SAR? Perhaps its time the state got off their butts and started some kind of funded program that sees SAR handled by firemen, policemen, or a division specifically dedicated to this. Heck, use Fish and Game guys, but pay for it from the state budget!

Policing stupid drunk snowmobilers, or rescuing people who get themselves into trouble, is not what I pay my outrageous liscence fees for. When I buy a hunting/fishing liscence its because I expect the cash to go to game and habitat management. Now they want to add on to fees the state already imposes by making boaters pay for all this junk!? WTF!

Yes, this peeves me real bad, as you can tell .

Brian

 

[Fitz]

Fees

This has been all over the paddlers websites recently. You will probably need a decal on your hiking boots soon. Afterall, most everybody has two boots, so it will be easy to double the income!

If you think the dollars would go to boat ramps or access, I have a bridge to sell you...

"During that time, the cost of health insurance premiums and medical benefits for retired department workers has risen 159 percent. Perry said if the department fails to raise money for the budget that begins in July, 28 full-time workers and 36 part-time workers would be without jobs."

Paddle fees to bail out poor management.

 

[SAR-EMT40]

You will probably need a decal on your hiking boots soon. Afterall, most everybody has two boots, so it will be easy to double the income!

This will suck. I use several types of boots depending on what I am doing. I would have to get registrations for all of them. I would guess that they will make tread depth the determining factor for the cost based upon how much estimated trail erosion I am causing. This is gonna suck bad.

All kidding aside I am a kayaker also and thinks that this is pretty screwed up. Fortunetly, I usually bring my kayaks to Maine to use. Though I kayak enough in NH I may have to pay any registration.

Keith

 

[Mattl]

Yes! It would such a great help to them, as a former employee of fisheries, I am no longer there because of the problems with money they are having. They are a tremendous help for fisherman, hikers, and recreation. It is important to help them through this as much as possible. -Mattl

 

[forestgnome]

Paddle fees to bail out poor management.

Well, it is a government agency, not a private business, so poor mgmt. is a real possibility for the problem, but I don't know about F@G mgmt. F@G is extremely important to NH. It helps tourism, especially 'ecotourism', which is a major part of our economy, both directly and indirectly.

I don't paddle or know anything about it, or about proposed boat fees. I don't take taxation lightly, trust me on that one! I already pay the $25.00 to the FS for the season pass, and I'd gladly pay a boot tax, as Keith chidingly proposes, if it went directly to F@G. Would $5.00 make a difference in the cost of even one trip to hike the White Mtns., let alone a yearly pass to hike? If every hiker paid even $5.00 a year, it would help a lot.

My thought is to identify who is using the resources and spread out the fees across many groups. As it is, I think anglers and hunters pay the lion's share. Don't know about paddlers. We hikers get a lot of benefit from F@G, so I think we should pitch in proportionately.

F@G takes care of all that we love in NH. Nothing is free.


Happy Trails

 

[bikehikeskifish]

For those interested in this issue, and it should be everyone, regardless of their opinion, this will be a topic on The Exchange tomorrow.

Thanks for posting this -- I have a meeting at 9, but will certainly listen on-line after the fact.

I'm hoping Laura Knoy will ask them HOW they got into such financial difficulties. That's the part I haven't heard yet, other than "costs are going up". Like my costs aren't going up too? Maybe you all could send ME a contribution to cover MY increased cost of living -- I'll send you some of my hiking photos in return for the stipend

I buy a fishing license every year so I can legally take my kids fishing while at my father-in-law's lake house on Sunapee. $35 is pretty steep. For my own fishing, I'm a saltwater guy -- no license required (as none should be.)

I have resisted posting on this before because it is inherently political. Political AND fund-raising (of sorts)... I'm kind of surprised it hasn't already been locked... but I'm still kind of a newbie so maybe it's relevant enough.

Tim

 

[teejay]

A modest proposal

I recently read one of Rick Reilly's "Sports Illustrated" columns in which he dwelt on this. http://www.nytimes.com/2006/10/11/s...5ae915a15&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss That's right. The Chicago White Sox sold the starting time of their home games to 7-Eleven®. He goes on to suggest even more creative ways of generating revenue through naming rights. Imagine the marketing clout of, "It's first and goal to go on the Motel 6-yard line." What company wouldn't give its corporate eye teeth for that marketing moment.

Why not take this to its next logical step? NH F&G needs money, NYSDEC needs money and I'm sure other state's conservation/tourism agencies do too. And we want views from the mountains. What makes more sense than to sell naming rights to the views in exchange for companies that would pay to create them? How much do you think the Bean® Boott Spur would be worth to the folks from Freeport? Imagine the crowds flocking to Owls Head to experience the Wise® Potato Chip View. Microsoft would surely want a Vista® somewhere. A paper company "Only took trees, left nothing but the view." Norelco: "We shaved Mansfield's chin." We could even get on this burgeoning bandwagon and have our own "Views From Table Top."

It doesn't have to stop there. The possibilities are myriad. Who would miss seeing Dirt Devil's Tower on their way to Edy's® Grand Canyon or Tetons? MacDonald's® Golden Arches National Park, another must see. Fire towers, lean-tos and shelters, trails, if you can buy it, then you can name it, and they will come.

Now, with apologies to Jonathan Swift, Rick Reilly and all the products and corporations for whom I may have forgotten ®, ©, or ™, I hastily remove my tongue from my cheek. Then again, maybe this isn't such a bad idea.

teejay

 

[forestgnome]

Cantdog, thanks for the link. Although I don't paddle as a sport or hobbie, I'm getting a canoe from my neighbor. I'd gladly pay $10.00 a year for it, even though I won't use it all that much, plus a yearly $10.00 to hike the White Mtns.

I have no idea about the competance of F@G mgmt. It's healthy and American to criticize poor mgmt. of any govt. agency, no matter how it is funded. Ok, now what? Let it fold?

Tourists often snowmobile on my street, which is illegal and dangerous. Despite the facts that it is dirt and has a 20mph limit. I almost squashed one one day, when I came around the corner and two of them were racing. One was passing the other, so when I came around the bend in my pickup it was nearly a bloodbath. I called the police. They said "call F@G"!!! "They handle snowmobile problems, not our jurisdiction."

Last summer, tourists let their 7 year old shuttle back and forth in a golf cart, with two kids even younger in it, on my street from their condo to the beach, sharing this winding dirt road with heavy 40 mph (despite the 20 mph limit) traffic. Fearing a gruesome accident, I called the police, who came quickly because that golf cart was not legal to be on a public road.

I asked the cheif why they had jurisdiction for the golf cart but not the snowmobiles. He thought it was crazy too. Now, I don't bother calling because I don't want F@G rescouces going toward policing town roads.

Does anyone here donate to any enviromental protection orgs? I guarentee you wouldn't be happy with every expenditure of that org. Please stop and think about how vital F@G is to all who love the White Mtns.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

So you should buy a snowmobile (if you don't already have one) and operate it in the police department parking lot until F&G comes and tells you to stop.

The police surely have jurisdiction over the roads, regardless of the vehicle, if it is illegal to operate it, they have the authority. Perhaps you live on a private road?

I think we taxpayers are kind of tired of bailing out the government (this taxpayer surely is.) I know there are lots of MA taxpayers here. How many of you voluntarily pay the higher tax rate on the income tax form? (Do they still have it? I haven't filed in MA in a few years) I have always thought that this was a ridiculous concept, but perhaps it actually does work.

Tim

 

[giggy]

I know there are lots of MA taxpayers here. How many of you voluntarily pay the higher tax rate on the income tax form? (Do they still have it? I haven't filed in MA in a few years) I have always thought that this was a ridiculous concept, but perhaps it actually does work.

Yes - they have it - and the rate is very low of the amount people that do pay it. It doesn't work. Its a joke. I don't know what goes in in NH, but I refuse to give the MA gov anymore than I am legally bound too.

People of course can do what they want - but many times - I think its a knee slap reaction - to say "its going to a good cause". I always question it. Just yesterday, I witnessed in an outdoor store someone buying a homeless guy (it was obvious) top of line mountaineering gear - ($100 mammut gloves and a mountain hardware windstopper hat) - I don't know where the money came from - but it was likely from a a charity or social program. safe to say this guy ain't climbing denali or the black dike this year - so why mammut gloves - the store brand at 1/2 the price wasn't good enough??? - I left shaking my head - I would love them mammut gloves....but since I got bills to pay, they went back on the rack for me..................

merry xmas to me

 

[David Metsky]

Moderator Warning
No politics please.

-dave-

 

[darren]

They got along for 70+ years without taxing hikers, kayakers, and salt water fishermen, why do they need the extra cash now? Cost might have gone up, but so has the number of fresh water fishermen and hunters and the license fees.

"We spent more money, so we need more money" does not cut it. Where did the money go? You do not fix poor management by giving it more money. You fix it by firing the people that hosed it up and hiring someone that can do more for less.

- darren

 

[bikehikeskifish]

They got along for 70+ years without taxing hikers, kayakers, and salt water fishermen, why do they need the extra cash now? Cost might have gone up, but so has the number of fresh water fishermen and hunters and the license fees.

"We spent more money, so we need more money" does not cut it. Where did the money go? You do not fix poor management by giving it more money. You fix it by firing the people that hosed it up and hiring someone that can do more for less.

- darren

Actually, I am half way through the Exchange (NHPR) program and what Director Lee Perry has said is something we've already discussed -- The population has increased dramatically (no, really?!?! ) while the percentage of fishermen and hunters ("the wallets") has not kept pace, so there are more people to patrol (ATV, snowmobilers), more people to preserve habitat from, and basically continue with the charter that is based on New Hampshire's heritage.

(We know that national parks usage is down, and likewise hunting and fishing, and hence the revenue gleaned from their license fees.)

His position is to continue to make fish and game user-supported, but garner funds from a larger percentage of the users. One way to do this is to get a piece of the room and meals tax, which comes from tourism, which is another large consumer of the F&G services. Another way (no news here) is the canoe/kayak "conservation sticker".

They say they have squeezed all they can squeeze at this time.

NOTE: This is a paraphrasing of what I heard -- and it's only 1/2 of of the program. I do not necessarily agree with or espouse these opinions.

The program is archived at the link posted earlier, if you'd like to hear it for yourself.

Tim

 

[bikehikeskifish]

I also agree with examining the idea of transferring some of the responsibilities to more appropriate departments, like the state police or local PD/FD.

This was also discussed on The Exchange. Perry's perspective on this was that F&G is better trained to handle certain responsibilities, and should receive money from the PD/FD, rather than duplicating the training, equipment, etc. The F&G officers are (if I heard correctly) full-status state police officers with a specialization.

I support the idea that redundant services are wasteful.

Tim

 

[spider solo]

I, of course, would agree that this season, (dare I say the Christmas word) would be a nice time to remember Fish & Game and many other organizations in need of finanical support.

Though I do not Hunt or Fish... I, like others, support the non game division of F&G... it's kind of the closet division that you don't hear that much about, but I really don't know if those monies go towards SAR or policing snowmobiles, ATV's , etc. while the whole time I think it's going for habitat and migratory studies..

This I feel I do know.... the more money they do manage to dredge up from additional fees, whether on non motorized human powered craft or other sources, the less apt they are to be sufficently funded by the State .
It becomes a case of " see you didn't need money from us after all so we will further reduce your funding....but by the way, that new Berlin ATV park..your going to have to patrol that as well..."

 

[darren]

New Hampshire has some of the highest sport fishing and hunting license fees in the nation.

The reason I stay on the Eastern half of Umbagog....

I've said it before on this site, Mass fresh water fishing licenses are out of control - like $30 for in-state. I have made the decision not to fish fresh water anymore just because of the cost. They wonder why the number of fishermen (people) has not kept up with the increase in population and it is because their fees are out of control. Why would Carm and I pay $60 to fish a couple of times in fresh water when I can go down the street and fish in the ocean for free? Hopefully they don't try to put a fee on that
(federal water) or I will have give up on that too. They could have gotten maybe $20 out of us but they certainly are not going to get $60.

- darren

 

[darren]

I guess I should make it clear that I am not anti- Fish and Game. I appreciate all they do. I just am not a fan of increasing funding just because "cost has gone up". I'd just like a tight look at duplicated services etc.

- darren