Pond Safety in Whites

[DougPaul]

How big a hole would you have to make to get to water? Assuming you are using the adze, it would be a fairly large hole to get either 4" deep or to hit water, as it would need to be bowl-shaped. Would the pick work?

The pick is better for chopping a hole (or a step) in hard ice. The adz is more for hard and soft snow.

The ice axe may not dig as fast as your heavy-weight implements of destruction, but the primary issue was more testing backcountry pond ice for safety rather than ice fishing. For safety testing, one only needs to be able to dig a hole in up to ~6in ice.

For fishing close to your car, take your pry bar. For fishing on a mountain pond requiring a long walk, take your choice.

Doug

 

[Jazzbo]

Other factors to consider for pond ice safety

When we walked around the EDGE of Lonesome Lake the other weekend we factored in the fact that we saw footprints of 6-7 people who had walked the edge before us, fact that pond is not very deep at the edges, ice was probably also thicker oround the edges, and TH was approx. 60 min away. If one of us broke through we certainly wouldn't be over our heads and TH is right near by. Temps weren't all that cold that day either.

1Happyhiker's situation up on Kinsman Pond was similar, except edges of Kinsman Pond is even shallower. Lucky if you go in up to mid-shin. Going straight across increases risk factor a lot. On the other hand .. distance to TH is much longer so there's that to take into account.

Depends how familier you are with the pond. If you know where the water enters it might be deeper or shallower or moving water might make it thinner.

Concentrating the load increases the risk. If conditions are uncertain spread the party out at least 15' spacing. If ice is snow covered and you have snowshoes snowshoes this spreads out your weight ... all factors in your favor. That's what makes snowshoes work. They distribute your weight over larger area.

So there's no simple formula. Just a complex matrix of risk afactors like everything we do in mountains in winter.

Off soapbox. I love it when we get a good freeze before any snowfall and you get deep glass like ice to skate on. On a bright sunny frigid day. That's the best!!!! This happens every once and a while down here in southland. (Boston area that is) And you get beautiful ice with bubbles and cracks. Here's my son David peering into the ice to study a crack on Mystic Lakes in Medford MA. That ice is easily 6-8" thick. You could jump up and down as hard as you like.

[/URL][/IMG]

Abstract art at it's best.... poetry in ice.

[/URL][/IMG]

 

[smitty77]

Off soapbox. I love it when we get a good freeze before any snowfall and you get deep glass like ice to skate on. On a bright sunny frigid day. That's the best!!!! This happens every once and a while down here in southland. (Boston area that is) And you get beautiful ice with bubbles and cracks. Here's my son David peering into the ice to study a crack on Mystic Lakes in Medford MA. That ice is easily 6-8" thick. You could jump up and down as hard as you like.

That's my favorite too, especially for ice skating - much better than that man-made rink garbage they call "ice".

I love the rush you get when you're standing in the middle of a lake, and the sun starts to "warm" the surface in the early morning and then...... POP! Nothing else will quite make your heart jump that way. Keep in mind this will happen even with thick ice.

Even after many years of ice fishing, I won't get on a lake I don't know without some research first. Springs and current can create some awful thin spots. I have a long lake right near the house with a constant in/out flow of water. While most of it freezes solid (max depth is only 15' I think), where it necks down to cross under the highway hardly ever freezes solid reliably.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Well the ice axe might just do the trick (but I wouldn't know as it's clearly been established I don't own one.) My concern was leaving a weakened spot / bowl where nobody was expecting it.

I've used a chainsaw to cut holes for ice fishing too. That works really well!

Tim

 

[REK]

This thread makes me think of Jack London's "To Build a Fire".

 

[NewHampshire]

Back during my ice fishing days my buddy, who was much shorter and lighter than me, would drag out this 8 foot long steel rod (we hauled it in on my sled or his collapsable icy shelter) and he would stab the heavy rod out in front of him several feet. We really only bothered early in the season, and neither of us would go out without at least 6 to 8 inches of ice...even then we were careful. Yes 4" of ice may be safe to walk on, but as mentioned thickness is not always going to be consistent, plus 4" is fine if alone with little gear. If you go in a group (and thats the entire point of ice fishing ) 4" means you spend your time spread out from your buddies and heavy gear.

And whats this translate into with hiking? If you are not alone SPREAD OUT when walking on early season ice. Not only do you have the safety net of avoiding one guy breaking through the ice and take out any number of people with him/her, but by not concentrating the weight of more than one person in any general spot you help avoid breaking through that much more.

Brian

 

[evilhanz]

This thread reminds of winter camp when was about 12 years old and my first time on ice. After a long day of building igloos and snow caves, we were headed back to the bunk house across an icy, snow-covered field. We got about halfway across before I realized that the field was actually a pond. I froze in my tracks for a minute watching water pool around my feet and trying to remember what they told us about ice safety. The trip to shore was made in record time

 

[sardog1]

Dr. Gordon Giesbrecht of the University of Manitoba is the go-to guy for ice safety for walkers. His faculty profile page has essential information, including his Discovery Channel videos and writings on what to do when you fall in.

EDIT: For those who might have wondered: Yes, twice, luckily under ideal circumstances each time. Otherwise, "('t)is a consummation devoutly to be [NOT] wished."

EDIT 2: Well, okay, one time did involve undoing each of the snowshoes underwater. But it was only thigh deep . . .

EDIT 3: Yeah, but that other time I didn't have either snowshoes or pack on, so catching my elbows on the lake ice was a successful strategy on the way down . . .

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

I've used a chainsaw to cut holes for ice fishing too. That works really well!Tim

Darwinian co-evolution on the chain saw, as we found these to be the ticket for extracting 3- to 4-meter long 3" diameter lake sediment cores through 2+ meters of ice on Baffin Island (i.e., by chain sawing a long slot into the ice, we were able to pull the 100+ pound sediment cores out at an angle, which made all the difference).

(we hiked to access the sites)