Recommendations For My 2nd GPS Unit - Anything New The Past Few Years?

[DayTrip]

I've been using, and been very happy with, a Garmin GPS62 for the past 4-5 years but after several near accidents leaving it on the roof of my car it finally cartwheeled down Rte 93 at a high rate of speed SAT so I find myself in the market for a new one. If they still make the GPS62 I'd be more than happy to get another one but before I did I was curious to hear from some of the "techies" here to see if there have been any innovations of late. IIRC Delorme and Garmin are the same company now so I don't know what that has meant for the product offerings.

>Anyone make a recent GPS purchase they are happy with?
>With all the advances in cell phone apps is it time to take the plunge and go that route (I currently use Gaia GPS for casual hikes around my house but don't know how/if it works with no cell service)?
>Do any units operate on rechargeable lithium ion batteries instead of needing AA or AAA batteries? My InReach has such a battery and goes several days without needing a charge. Would be nice not carrying extra batteries or using a back up battery that worked for all my devices for simplicity/weight.

If anyone has any feedback on the latest technology it would be appreciated before I make a purchase. Thanks in advance as always.

 

[Nessmuk]

I've always been very happy with my Garmin 60csx for many years. I detest that I later bought a 62. I hate the change in the display interface appearance and the way it mounts to handlebars and canoe thwarts, requiring use of zip cable ties each time you change where it mounts. The 60 requires only a stubby phillips screwdriver that I carry in my PFD to go from one canoe to another. And the 60 will always last for more than 24 continuous hours on one set of batteries. I can practically set my watch with batteries dying in the 62 every 7 hours, almost exactly 7 hours every time, regardless of display or settings, while the 60 continues to happily purr on. I use 2 60csx units with different info displays in front of me, mounted to the thwart of my canoe during canoe races, but I almost threw the dang 62 in the Yukon river after the 3rd battery set died on the 7 hour clock during a Yukon River race. I had the 62 running only as a backup with another crew member and did not change screens or manipulate it at all during operation until the 7 hour dead battery mark. I always use lithium batteries in all GPS units. My SAR team has the newer 64 model, which I have shown during search incidents acts the same as the unfortunate 62 with dislikable display screen and poor battery life. So I went to ebay and bought 2 additional 60csx units while I still could.

 

[bignslow]

I use Backcountry Navigator Pro for offline mapping on my phone (you download your maps in advance). The resolution/quality on the maps is as good as I get on my 60CSx and my current phone is water (splash) resistant (unlike the 60CSx which is full waterproof).

Depending on your goals, it is also worth considering GPS watches (especially as a backup/tracking device). Mine lasts all day (12+ hours), and can give a "track back" feature.

From what I've seen, the Suunto products are more outdoor oriented than the Garmin which are more running oriented.

 

[DougPaul]

I have 2 Garmin 60CSx's and 1 62S and have researched the 64 series. The reports on the 64 series weren't too good and I chose not to buy one. IMO, the 62 series has some advantages and some disadvantages over the 60CSx. One of my 60CSx's remains my workhorse. If I needed to buy another, I'd try to get a 60CSx.

BTW, while it takes a bit of work searching through the menus, it it possible to turn off many of the toy features of the 62S which makes the displays similar to the 60CSx.

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

. I can practically set my watch with batteries dying in the 62 every 7 hours, almost exactly 7 hours every time, regardless of display or settings, while the 60 continues to happily purr on.

Are you using a compass rose display on the 62?

In response to your earlier reports on this problem, I made some measurements of the current draw of my 62s and found that it had a similar draw to the 60CSx except when showing a compass rose display.

In normal operation (GPS and compass on, light off, no compass rose display):
60CSx: 75ma
62s: 85ma

Same with the compass rose display on:
60CSx: 75ma
62s: 170ma

Note: there appear to have been 2 versions of the 60CSx: the newer one draws less current than the older one and can use fresh lithium batteries. The above numbers are for the newer 60CSx which probably has more hardware in common with the 62s than the older one.

Doug

 

[Nessmuk]

Are you using a compass rose display on the 62?

Absolutely not. As a volunteer and professional land navigation instructor (I am employed by NYS Homeland Security to teach land nav to law enforcement, and volunteer instruct for SAR and NYS outdoor Guides), I use a real compass for direction finding, and a GPS only as a supplemental navigation aid. I never turn on the magnetic compass mode in the GPS. During the Yukon River canoe races, I have one 60csx in front of me ( as bow paddler) running in map display mode, and another next to it displaying compass mode (speed, distance and direction to the next waypoint). if that is what you mean by compasss rose display, then yes, but direction is calculated internally from forward motion via GPS, not by magnetic means. Each 60csx at some point gets to stay on continuously for more than 24 hours with one set of lithium batteries. They probably could go longer, but I always change batteries daily. The few times I have attempted to use the 62, it was not in mag compass mode either. Of the 4 60csx units I have used in canoe racing and in SAR, each has performed identically, but the 62 is crap IMO. One does not have time to change batteries every 7 hours during a 1000 mile race in strong river current. During multiple days on SAR incidents I have had similar bad experiences with the 64.

 

[DayTrip]

I've always been very happy with my Garmin 60csx for many years. I detest that I later bought a 62. I hate the change in the display interface appearance and the way it mounts to handlebars and canoe thwarts, requiring use of zip cable ties each time you change where it mounts. The 60 requires only a stubby phillips screwdriver that I carry in my PFD to go from one canoe to another. And the 60 will always last for more than 24 continuous hours on one set of batteries. I can practically set my watch with batteries dying in the 62 every 7 hours, almost exactly 7 hours every time, regardless of display or settings, while the 60 continues to happily purr on. I use 2 60csx units with different info displays in front of me, mounted to the thwart of my canoe during canoe races, but I almost threw the dang 62 in the Yukon river after the 3rd battery set died on the 7 hour clock during a Yukon River race. I had the 62 running only as a backup with another crew member and did not change screens or manipulate it at all during operation until the 7 hour dead battery mark. I always use lithium batteries in all GPS units. My SAR team has the newer 64 model, which I have shown during search incidents acts the same as the unfortunate 62 with dislikable display screen and poor battery life. So I went to ebay and bought 2 additional 60csx units while I still could.

I use (well used) rechargeable Energizer batteries in my 62 and had no problem getting 12-14 hours of constantly on use out of them (little less when it is cold) with screen brightness at 100% (generally it is just tracking though and I'll peek at it to check time, elevation, set a waypoint. I'm not actively viewing the map). I'm going on about 4 1/2 years with the set of batteries I have now and I assume they are losing some holding power because time on a charge has dropped this year. I have noticed this year that my display is hard to read and I don't recall that issue before. Awhile back I had a Windows related problem and did a reset of the whole thing and I believe changed a setting somewhere to account for the issue. I remember when I got mine there were very mixed opinions on the unit. In reading I have since done that seems to be common for Garmin so I wonder how "tight" there manufacturing process is. Quality sure seems to vary from person to person. I personally liked my 62.

 

[DayTrip]

I have 2 Garmin 60CSx's and 1 62S and have researched the 64 series. The reports on the 64 series weren't too good and I chose not to buy one. IMO, the 62 series has some advantages and some disadvantages over the 60CSx. One of my 60CSx's remains my workhorse. If I needed to buy another, I'd try to get a 60CSx.

BTW, while it takes a bit of work searching through the menus, it it possible to turn off many of the toy features of the 62S which makes the displays similar to the 60CSx.

Doug

Yah that is probably my biggest criticism of the 62 - the fact that the menus are not very intuitive and require many steps in some cases to do simple things. It's fine when you first get and go through and configure everything but then a year or two later when you go to do something it's hard to recall how to do it.

 

[DayTrip]

I use Backcountry Navigator Pro for offline mapping on my phone (you download your maps in advance). The resolution/quality on the maps is as good as I get on my 60CSx and my current phone is water (splash) resistant (unlike the 60CSx which is full waterproof).

Depending on your goals, it is also worth considering GPS watches (especially as a backup/tracking device). Mine lasts all day (12+ hours), and can give a "track back" feature.

From what I've seen, the Suunto products are more outdoor oriented than the Garmin which are more running oriented.

So stupid question: if you are downloading the maps does the software still track position, distance, elevation, etc out in the field and calculate "stats" without cell service when you are actually hiking? Do you ever get gaps in tracks like when you are in ravines, etc? It would be nice to consolidate devices but I still have a fundamental mistrust of my cell phone as a navigational tool.

 

[alexmtn]

In thinking about device consolidation I considered 5 tasks:
- phone/text
- track recording
- on-map navigation
- GPS-based check-in/SOS
- photos

The lightest-weight approach to the above that I've been able to devise combines an iPhone SE, GAIA GPS software, a Spot3, and (for winter and multi-day trips), an Anker backup battery pack. In working with this combo, the chief tradeoffs I face are (1) having to be careful to protect the phone from water/condensation and drops--which exacts a convenience cost (but on the bright side, helps keep ZipLoc in business); and (2) the SPOT's one-way communication limitation. The

In using the phone plus GAIA for navigation, though it has its quirks, I find the user interface to be both comprehensive and drastically more ergonomic than that of any dedicated GPS unit I've seen, and the ability to work with a map on a bright/clear phone screen is truly enabling. And YES, you can download any map area you like for offline use while out of cell range. I like the variety of maps that come with GAIA, which includes the classic USGS topos, along with the ability to utilize any geo-referenced map image. If you spring for GAIA's $29/yr premium service, all your content automatically syncs to your account on GAIA's cloud for safekeeping and/or sharing, and you get access to a broader variety of base maps. The spatial precision (and accuracy), i.m.e. +/- 20-30', also is both amazing and drastic overkill for meeting my backcountry nav needs. All that said, I'm still learning--it's still less than a year since I succeeded in attaining sufficient emotional fortitude to override my map/compass purist side and endow myself with a GPS nav capability.

DayTrip, beyond this, two other recent developments to report.

First, there is now the inReach Explorer, which includes full map-based nav capabilities -- if this is what you have, vs. the lesser SE or predecessor model, then you already have the map-nav in addition to the beacon/communication capability. I opted in favor of Spot for weight reasons.

Second, [findme]Spot has released a potent competitor to the inReach.

Alex

 

[Nessmuk]

Interesting that I did not see a compass function (with a real compass) in the above list as a tasker. I would never trust my navigation entirely to electronic devices. A quality compass is relatively immune to abuse and damage, is completely waterproof, it never runs out of batteries, and is my always reliable navigation partner.

 

[alexmtn]

Interesting that I did not see a compass function (with a real compass) in the above list as a tasker. I would never trust my navigation entirely to electronic devices. A quality compass is relatively immune to abuse and damage, is completely waterproof, it never runs out of batteries, and is my always reliable navigation partner.

Should go without saying -- but now that you've said it, we're covered both ways!

In a similar vein, I'm tempted also to mention a flashlight, especially since these days flashlights/headlamps are indeed electronic devices. I often steward at OBP/FW, and the sheer number of folks who point to their phones as their flashlights (15 minutes, tops?) never ceases to amaze me. :-/

Alex

 

[bikehikeskifish]

For on-trail, I primarily use my iPhone for all navigational purposes, which for the most part involves recording my tracks for future use. I have GutHook there in case I get whited-out. I don't bring the real GPS for trailed/peakbagging hikes anymore, but I do bring the Anker battery which while heavy will last me a week if I run the iPhone in low-power mode. I no longer bring a spare headlamp because the phone's light will suffice to change batteries. I do bring extra batteries. I haven't referred to a paper map for WMNF / peakbagging excursions in ages. I bring a map to cover my behind.

Navigating off-trail, I may still bring a real GPS. Bushwhacking from Boundary back to the parking area below Whitecap this winter, the folks with phones + Gaia were very helpful in locating our target old-ish logging road, which was on the map, but in the dark, the phone map is much more convenient than paper. The big negative with touch screens is mittens and moisture.

Tim

 

[alexmtn]

The big negative with touch screens is mittens and moisture.

I stash a stretch-tethered stubby touch stylus in my Mercury Mitt. Works great!

Alex

 

[DayTrip]

In thinking about device consolidation I considered 5 tasks:
- phone/text
- track recording
- on-map navigation
- GPS-based check-in/SOS
- photos

The lightest-weight approach to the above that I've been able to devise combines an iPhone SE, GAIA GPS software, a Spot3, and (for winter and multi-day trips), an Anker backup battery pack. In working with this combo, the chief tradeoffs I face are (1) having to be careful to protect the phone from water/condensation and drops--which exacts a convenience cost (but on the bright side, helps keep ZipLoc in business); and (2) the SPOT's one-way communication limitation. The

In using the phone plus GAIA for navigation, though it has its quirks, I find the user interface to be both comprehensive and drastically more ergonomic than that of any dedicated GPS unit I've seen, and the ability to work with a map on a bright/clear phone screen is truly enabling. And YES, you can download any map area you like for offline use while out of cell range. I like the variety of maps that come with GAIA, which includes the classic USGS topos, along with the ability to utilize any geo-referenced map image. If you spring for GAIA's $29/yr premium service, all your content automatically syncs to your account on GAIA's cloud for safekeeping and/or sharing, and you get access to a broader variety of base maps. The spatial precision (and accuracy), i.m.e. +/- 20-30', also is both amazing and drastic overkill for meeting my backcountry nav needs. All that said, I'm still learning--it's still less than a year since I succeeded in attaining sufficient emotional fortitude to override my map/compass purist side and endow myself with a GPS nav capability.

DayTrip, beyond this, two other recent developments to report.

First, there is now the inReach Explorer, which includes full map-based nav capabilities -- if this is what you have, vs. the lesser SE or predecessor model, then you already have the map-nav in addition to the beacon/communication capability. I opted in favor of Spot for weight reasons.

Second, [findme]Spot has released a potent competitor to the inReach.

Alex

I think before I plunk down some cash on a new unit I am going to give Gaia a serious test drive. My phone is pretty durable, has excellent battery life and has one of those LifeProof cases so it is fine in the woods (I've gotten it wet, dropped it on rocks, etc). I've actually started using my phone for pictures because it is better than my camera too. So I could do some serious consolidating with this approach. Only concern would be in Winter with gloves on using the touch screen. And of course if all you have is your phone for everything and it does break.....

As far as my InReach I have an older one without the navigation so that was another option I was thinking about. I can also link that to my phone via bluetooth which makes the messaging way easier. There are a lot of new antenna type products on the market now too which are intriguing but expensive. That would be the ultimate - an antenna that gets signal so your phone works like it does back in civilization and you don't need all the other stuff. Maybe in a few years...

 

[DayTrip]

Should go without saying -- but now that you've said it, we're covered both ways!

In a similar vein, I'm tempted also to mention a flashlight, especially since these days flashlights/headlamps are indeed electronic devices. I often steward at OBP/FW, and the sheer number of folks who point to their phones as their flashlights (15 minutes, tops?) never ceases to amaze me. :-/

Alex

I have several head lamps and my current favorite charges via USB, thus another motivation to get USB chargeable devices because it makes those Anker type battery charges more useful. I have one of those too of course.

 

[DayTrip]

I stash a stretch-tethered stubby touch stylus in my Mercury Mitt. Works great!

Alex

That is a pretty good idea actually. But a lot of cell phone apps use the "pinching" technique for a lot of functions though. Does you stylus do that?

 

[alexmtn]

That is a pretty good idea actually. But a lot of cell phone apps use the "pinching" technique for a lot of functions though. Does your stylus do that?

Ha! Perhaps there's a market for a scissors-like stylus! Until then though, I'm without pinch/stretch until I figure out a good way to attach styli to my glove fingertips or take my glove off. After I set it up upon initiating my hike, GAIA is usually able to meet all my needs sans pinch/stretch.

Alex

 

[DougPaul]

Are you using a compass rose display on the 62?

Absolutely not. As a volunteer and professional land navigation instructor (I am employed by NYS Homeland Security to teach land nav to law enforcement, and volunteer instruct for SAR and NYS outdoor Guides), I use a real compass for direction finding, and a GPS only as a supplemental navigation aid. I never turn on the magnetic compass mode in the GPS. During the Yukon River canoe races, I have one 60csx in front of me ( as bow paddler) running in map display mode, and another next to it displaying compass mode (speed, distance and direction to the next waypoint). if that is what you mean by compasss rose display, then yes, but direction is calculated internally from forward motion via GPS, not by magnetic means. Each 60csx at some point gets to stay on continuously for more than 24 hours with one set of lithium batteries. They probably could go longer, but I always change batteries daily. The few times I have attempted to use the 62, it was not in mag compass mode either. Of the 4 60csx units I have used in canoe racing and in SAR, each has performed identically, but the 62 is crap IMO. One does not have time to change batteries every 7 hours during a 1000 mile race in strong river current. During multiple days on SAR incidents I have had similar bad experiences with the 64.

The excess current is drawn by the compass rose display (no matter where the direction/orientation data comes from), not by the magnetic sensor. I measured the current drawn with the magnetic sensor on and off and got the same number. (ie the additional current drawn by the sensor was too small to indicate on my meter.)

Doug

 

[Nessmuk]

So tell me why I can have the 60CSX continuously display the GPS compass for as much as 24 hours on one set of batteries?