Up or Down?

[Tom Rankin]

This was prompted by the 'Hiker Lost Near Isolation' Thread.

Speaking completely hypothetically, if you were 'lost', is it better to go up, or down?

Up requires more energy be expended, but could lead you to a summit with a known position, afford a better view of where you might be, or possibly to a trail.

Down could lead to water, trail, road, but also to just miles and miles of trees, with a limited view, possibly heading farther away from the searchers.

I suppose the answer, as always, is, "it depends!"

But if I was lost near Isolation, (a long walk to civilization), I might just head up, especially since the summit is open.

 

[Mohamed Ellozy]

I'd look at my GPSr and know, to within a few feet, where I am.

What if the batteries run out? Replace them with the spare batteries I always carry (spares for GPSr, spares for camera, spares for headlamp).

 

[eddie]

Start a fire - it is an attention grabber.

 

[freighttrain48]

Would you have a compass? If so and I was lost near iso I would travel east and sooner or later you would hit rocky branch and the trail. If I had no compass I would head up until I crossed the davis path.

 

[erugs]

Some of us feel more comfortable being "lost" than others do. Most of NE is close to civilization, so I feel confident. Less so in northern Maine, I suppose. When it is dark and gray and the clouds are hanging low, and I don't want to worry family and friends, I'm more cautious. I used to be afraid if I was alone...

I'm thinking of a friend who was benighted for two nights and nobody missed him. This friend lives alone, so that was not an issue, but not to be missed at work? My friend was determined to accomplish the task set out for. Later my friend made it to the road and got a ride back to the car on the other side of the mountain.

 

[DougPaul]

I suppose the answer, as always, is, "it depends!"

Agreed 100%...

But if I was lost near Isolation, (a long walk to civilization), I might just head up, especially since the summit is open.

Near Isolation is a region where it could make sense to go either way (depending on the details, of course...). Perhaps more important than the open summit is the Davis Path along the ridge--much easier to hit.

Doug

 

[Puma concolor]

The only time I've been misplaced pretty badly was when I bushwhacked down the wrong side of Doubletop (Catskills) in the clouds and fog. Who really needs a compass anyway? Wound up going down and then back up once I figured out where I was. No biggie really, just a longer day than I was expecting. As mentioned, it's hard to get really lost in the Northeast if you know or can figure out your landmarks.

Out west, it would be a bigger deal. Don't think I'd want to go back up unless I knew exactly what mountain I was heading up and how it would help me correct my error. Better to take your chances in the valley than to wind up both lost and on dangerous terrain with a T-storm approaching.

Just my two cents.

 

[una_dogger]

Depends. ;-)

Going Up to get a broader view and hopefully spot a road, trail
Or in general some familiar topography would be helpful in some situations. (and this has been my course of action once bushwhacking solo-- I wasn't lost per se, just needed a bit of visual info)

There are probably many good answers to this question that would be useful options to keep on mind.

Thanks for starting this thread, Tom , I would
Love to hear what others have done in a similar situation.

 

[erugs]

Early on in my adult hiking "career" and one of my first winter hikes, I joined up with a couple who seemed to be at my pace on Pierce. We thought we'd do the loop. Upon reaching the top of Pierce, some others told us that another group had just tried to do that but had given up when the lost the trail.

What did we do? Follow the footsteps of the group who had gotten lost until we came to their turn-around point. At my foolish suggestion, we turn sharp left and plunged our way through the snow. This worked out well for us, though, as we happened upon the trail and safely followed through with our last minute plans. Silly hikers, we.

 

[roadtripper]

I'm inclined to say DOWN most of the time, simply because its warmer at night.

 

[SAR-EMT40]

In my opinion the answer is neither. The correct answer is the direction you set on your compass based upon your planned escape bearing in case you really get screwed up. You aren't lost. You are in NH, in the White mountain national forest. You are north of a certain trail or southwest of another one, etc. All you need to know is your escape bearing to bring you to a known trail.

You go up if you want a better cell signal, you go down if you hope to follow water to civilization. If you want to stay found, use foresight to plan for an escape bearing to a known location to help you get back to where you want to be.

JMHO,
Keith

 

[cushetunk]

If you're so lost that all you can do is go uphill or downhill, there is no reason you should head uphill. What happens when you reach the top of a small wooded knob? Now you can only go downhill. Which way do you go? Then, when you find more uphill to go, do you go back to climbing? Now what direction are you going? And, what if there's no trail or view up there?

While you might get lucky, you might also wander endlessly in circles and get way more lost.

 

[nartreb]

The two big factors are weather and terrain.

Going up will usually expose you to more wind and cloud, and take you away from useful shelter and firewood.

Going in any direction risks encountering impassible terrain, but going down is particularly difficult in flood conditions. I wouldn't have appreciated it at the time, but after I visited the Great Gulf after a well-known incident one recent spring, I'd say if you're in the Great Gulf during spring melt, wait for good weather and go up to the ridge. You're not likely to make it out any other way.

Being "lost" is irrelevant. Knowing how to get from your current (not precisely known) position to a place where you're likely to find what you need (shelter, water, a path out) is a combination of experience, prior knowledge of the area, basic navigation, and trial and error.

 

[DougPaul]

There are two basic issues if one is lost:
1) figuring out where you are or getting to a known place. This can be very easy if one has a functioning GPS.
2) getting out to a safe place (ie a trailhead or road)

#2 the goal and #1 is a means to that end. They may or may not be accomplished by traveling in different directions.

Doug

 

[Raven]

If I was at the point in the Northeast where I said, "OK, I'm really lost," I would first follow water down hoping it crosses some road or trail. I'd want to keep the water source close by if possible. Otherwise, I would pick a compass direction and walk in that direction for as long as I needed to in order to get to a road.

 

[Elizabeth]

Follow the dog

The two "lost" instances I am most familiar with - in both cases the lost people were really close to a trail or road in pretty benign territory. In both cases if they had just gone downhill a short distance, they would have found their way back to safety quite easily. Instead they chose to stay put and wait to get rescued (one situation) or go uphill - farther from the direction they had come - to get better cell phone coverage (the other). I'd say go downhill in most situations if you do not otherwise have means to know where you are.

Map and compass and/or a good sense of direction have generally got me back to the trail in my own "lost" situations. (I've been temporarily unclear about my exact whereabouts, rather than really LOST.) In those situations, up or down are not the issues, as others have mentioned.

If it is getting dark out and I have forgotten to bring a light, I follow my white dog (unless there is snow on the ground, in which case I follow my brown/red dog).

I have also been in a situation (on Isolation, actually) where the map wouldn't have helped much and it was too cold and windy to get out the compass. Blowing snow obliterated the trail. I tried heading down and got stuck on a ledge. Followed my brown/red dog across and then down to the trail. (This was the same day that another experienced hiker ended up overnighting on Jackson because of losing the trail to blowing snow.)

 

[Kevin Rooney]

Like Mohamed, I'd look at my GPS.

Having said that - without the GPS, it would depend, beginning with whether I was in forest in the East or the mostly spaces of the West. Generally speaking, following water downward usually works for me in the east, as there's nearly always an outlet.

 

[Tom Rankin]

Wow, a lot of good posts already!

Let's say you have no GPS, no compass. I know - not prepared, but this happens too often as we all know! Let's not debate that, just assume it has happened.

Keep 'em coming!

 

[Nessmuk]

Wow, a lot of good posts already!

Let's say you have no GPS, no compass. I know - not prepared, but this happens too often as we all know! Let's not debate that, just assume it has happened.

Keep 'em coming!

Well then in your unprepared hiker scenario, lets assume lost hiker decides to climb up high in the hopes of a view to something recognizable in the distance. Maybe they will see something, maybe they have just expended much energy for nothing with no views at all. Let's say something such as a pond they think they might know is seen a mile or more away. Without compass or other direction maintaining method, so what? How are they going to stay on course to what they saw upon descending through dense woods? Almost impossible, unless the sun is out and the object is a very broad target.

In most cases the proper answer is to stay put, conserve energy, and keep your head well enough to set up shelter and signals. There was an itinerary left behind with a responsible person, wasn't there?

Just having a GPSr may not be enough. Given what I have seen of many people's inability to really understand how to use a compass with map, I suspect many also would not do the preparation work with GPS to completely understand it either. If I am lost off trail but I have the geographic coordinates accurate to within a few feet of where I now stand, so what? Unless I also have coordinates of where I need to go in the GPSr, AND I understand what may lie between me and it AND how to navigate the distance, I'm still in trouble.

Rangers have told me that most people they search for will travel downhill... although there is a tendency recently for people to travel uphill in hopes of receiving a better cell phone signal.

Last fall I lead a search team for a lost hunter. His son had left him to stay put while the son made a wide sweep around the terrain, which was relatively flat. The father, experienced and relatively healthy, for some reason decided to take off on his own toward the west. Had he gone east he would have intersected the road they came in on less than 200 yards away. Instead he ended up crossing a beaver marsh, evidently getting soaked in the process. There was no reason to have crossed the marsh, as they had not crossed it on the way in. That night the temperature dropped into the 30's. We found his body 2 days later after a search involving over 100 volunteers in an expanding grid. The coroner estimated that he likely perished of hypothermia on that very first night. He was less than a mile from his last known position. The next road in that direction was another mile or more further, much farther had he wandered south.

 

[cushetunk]

Had he gone east he would have intersected the road they came in on less than 200 yards away. Instead he ended up crossing a beaver marsh, evidently getting soaked in the process. There was no reason to have crossed the marsh, as they had not crossed it on the way in.

This brings up an excellent tangent, which is that the biggest fear I have is not getting lost in terms of the macro-terrain, but the micro-terrain. It's pretty easy to know which drainage you're in or which ridges are nearby. But at a small scale it's remarkably easy to become turned around in dense woods or fog, get confused, and do something foolish like what Nessmuk describes. Heck, I've nearly done it myself, and was surprised at how fast panic and irrationality started setting in even though I knew where I was in the big picture.

Sorry for the thread hijack.

And despite all the good points brought up, I still think the answer to this hypothetical "academic" question -- of using a single terrain feature, with no reference to anything else, to get out of the woods -- is walking downhill.