The Trail is Now Packed

As most of us are now aware, the greater White Mountain region received the first big snowfall of the season on Valentine's Day.

All of us looking to hike to specific peaks, vista's, favorite locations, are eagerly looking for trip & trail condition reports to learn where others have hiked to.

Back in January of 2002 I headed to Isolation via the Rocky Branch route.
It was the 1st Saturday of the month, and I had read that a group had hiked this route the weekend before. We hadn't received any additional snow since their hike, but the Whites had seen quite a few windy days in the interim. I started out mid-morning, and found a few cars in the parking area, and tracks in the snow on the trail of those that had started earlier on the same day. I caught up to a group of 5 on the last section of the Davis Path just before the Isolation spur trail. They didn't have snowshoes. I had started quite a few hours after these folks, and they were really tired. We did the usual exchange of information, and then when I asked why they didn't bring their snowshoes I was told "We read that the trail was all broken out last weekend". What they found on this particular day was most of the trails were heavily drifted back in. My round trip excursion took 6 1/2 hours in snowshoes. Their's was an epic, and they were thoroughly exhausted.

Sunday night & Monday of this week the Whites had fairly strong winds. Light snow is in the forecast for Thursday, with windy conditions again on Friday.

Please don't assume that because you have read a report of folks snowshoeing certain trails, that the trail will retain that snowshoe track. The treadway conditions change daily / regularly.

There have been very easy / nice trail conditions for most of this Winter, and most of the last two Winters as well. Hikers have been able to bareboot on trails deep in the woods, where barebooting has not been the norm in previous Winters. The snow storm of last week, really wasn't that big of a storm historically. More importantly, the snow was extremely dry & light, and more typically NE snow is wet & heavy, so we were very fortunate indeed.

For everyone out on the trails, please be considerate and use your snowshoes. If we all do, the trails will form a super hi-way smooth base that will last well into Spring. It's so much more pleasant to hike on a smooth trail than one that resembles a Moose Dance Party.

Cath said:

Please don't assume that because you have read a report of folks snowshoeing certain trails, that the trail will retain that snowshoe track. The treadway conditions change daily / regularly.

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Thanks for the post. Today is the first day that I have not been in the woods somewhere in NH or VT since and including the Day of the Valentine's storm. It is amazing the variability of the snowpack from region to region. Even though it has not been reported there have been "Cells" that have produced enough snow combined with the wind that have certainly drifted in Trails that were broken out early after the Storm. Have fun, play safe, and clean up after your done.

I will admit I prefer wearing my crampons over my snowshoes, especially on a steep descent. I will, however, switch to my shoes if I begin to posthole. I hiked East Osceola on Sunday and the trail was nicely packed until a group of five back country skiers came through wearing ski boots. They had no traction on their boots so they kicked stepped their way up the trail leaving gaping holes everywhere. The trail was a mess by the time they reached their jump off point. I realize they had ever right to be on the trail as I did, I just wish they showed a little more consideration by leaving the trail the same way they found it.

I don't know. From a skier perspective, I hate the 3-foot deep troughs that are 18" wide. It's impossible to turn, and can be down right dangerous.

I think it depends on your perspective when you say "showed a little more consideration by leaving the trail the same way they found it". I'm personally not a big fan of the trough, and would rather see efforts made to widen the trail more than harden the U-shape. So, if we'd really rather see that, then I guess I wish the trail was completely unbroken so I can have my powder on the way down.

My mistake, I should have clarified. They were not skiing the trail, they just used the trail to get to a point were they were going to bushwhack to some gully between East Osceola and Osceola.

IMHO, postholing is inconsiderate and foolish. You never know how packed a trail will be. Always, always, always bring them along and keep the trail nice and consolidated (and safer!) for others.

The guys I saw on Valley Way were miserable and moving terribly slowly. I didn't need to admonish them, they had learned their own lesson. They left their snowshoes in the car, and it cost them hours of extra effort and they never got to camp or summit a peak all weekend.

There was one fellow that commended their "effort and determination" to make it to the hut in under 7 hours without snowshoes. THAT is the guy I wanted to smack. Then he proceeded to crow about how sweet his camping spot was - out of the wind 10' behind the hut! What an idiot.

albee said:

What an idiot.

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Wow, that's hardcore.

How anyone could have rationalized NOT bringing snowshoes after such a large snowfall is beyond me. I know some folks like to push the gear limits but why take chances?
Winter hiking is not such a minimalist sport rather one should be confident that they CAN indeed carry the extra gear. The extra weight is good conditioning if nothing else.
To keep my post on-topic though I will say that Cath is right on and I feel somewhat inclined to add a disclaimer to my North Brother post..."Use of this beta good for 48 hours or next snowstorm, whichever comes first."

Regarding modes of travel in the snow, skinning & skiing is indeed one of my favorites too.

I've used skis for Cabot, Tecumseh, Carter Dome, Garfield, Bondcliff, Galehead, Hale, Monroe, Adams, N. Tripyramid, Moosilauke, Cannon & Wildcat D (via the slopes...) Owl's Head to the base of the slide, Carrigain to approx 2800' (tho I've seen tracks further up trail ), Hancocks to the base of the loop....... I think that's all so far. There are folks out there that look to ski all of NH's 48.

I've skinned up the hiking trails, but I certainly don't get any style points for my skiing descent along / within the hiking trails. When the snow is soft & the powder dry, it's much more forgiving, and I agree if the snowshoe trough is deep and firm, it would be a risky ski within it for me. But the trails are hiking trails, and if I can't handle the conditions of the trough, I won't go with skis. Fresh tracks are the best with skis, and I think for snowshoeing too (I LOVE to break trail).

When there was a minimal trough, I had a 40 minute ride from the base of the Bondcliff rock scramble back to the Wilderness Trail, and a 60 minute ride from the summit of Garfield to the Winter parking area (10 minute miles ).

The main point of this thread is
the trails don't remain packed out. Winds transporting snow, often have the most reoccurring affect.

A friend & I "packed out" the C/M trail to Moriah one Sunday in 2005. Two days later, Kevin & Brutie choose that trail based on my tip that we had snowshoed that trail. I joined them about 90 minutes into their hike, and the track from Sunday was completely obliterated. It took us many, many hours to get to the summit that day, shoeing through Fluff and tons of firm drifts.

Thanks, Cath, this was a very informative post and a gentle reminder. We certainly can't force others to do so but communicating the importance of snowshoes over barebooting as you have serves to educate those who may not understand the impact they are having on others.

Kindness in words and leading by example go much further than anger or harsh criticisms, I'd venture to guess the folks you ran into Albee were just way back on the learning curve..we've all been there, and maybe we haven't exerted such a strong negative impact on a trail as you've described, but we've all had to learn somehow...and I know for myself that I've learned more from those who've shared thier trail wisdom with me kindly than anyone who's chosen to chew me out instead.

I recall reading a few weeks back a post regarding "how deep to use snowshoes". IMHO it is as has been said here, more considerate of others if we can use our snowshoes to create a smooth, well packed trail for all to enjoy.

FWIW, while hiking in the Daks High Peaks Wilderness this weekend, I noticed that the regs there require snowshoes or skiis on trails in winter.

Michael, I have to admit that I will actually take my crampons and snowshoes while cross country skiing, not that I expect to use them, but I take them to add to my overall training/conditioning! But hey..that's just me..

I find that even on a packed trail, snowshoeing is much easier than barebooting if the feet slip even a tiny bit, like walking on an inclined beach. I don't understand the idea that barebooting is more comfortable unless the snow is too deep. On snowshoes, even in the trough, the step is even and stable. Why do people try to do without them?

Occasionally, I've found a well-packed trough that is too skinny Now that's a PITA! So, I purposely break a nice wide trough by keeping a few inches b/w my snowshoes.

Happy Trails

forestgnome said:

I find that even on a packed trail, snowshoeing is much easier than barebooting if the feet slip even a tiny bit, like walking on an inclined beach. I don't understand the idea that barebooting is more comfortable unless the snow is too deep. On snowshoes, even in the trough, the step is even and stable. Why do people try to do without them?

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I find that they save energy if you are sinking in more than an inch or two.

I have found that the reason for not using them is sometimes that they do not know how to use them effectively (perhaps more of an issue with some of the older designs), they are trying to save money, or trying to save weight (not carrying). IMO, if you are out there without the proper equipment, then you should rethink whether you should be out there.

Doug

Cath, I have to take issue with something in your post. I've seen you "break" trail. It was more like you floated over it. As I recall we said you were denting trail. When you top out over 200 lbs, then you can say you were "breaking" trail.

I think DougPaul nailed it when he mentioned people don't want to pack the extra weight. The way I see it, snowshoes are an essential part of the winter pack. Sure it sucks to carry excess weight but that's part of the game. If you don't want to play, then stay home.

Thanks for the reminder Cath.

Does take time to learn

Interesting and all good to know!

While working on I-91 around Wells River in '75 and being the only one staying in the area during the week in a motel...I noticed a neat looking roundedtop mountain across the river It was May, it had snow on it and found out it was Mt Moosilauke. So...after work I'd head over and found the Beaver Brook Trail. I started up, got into the snow(in my work boots) and turned back before dark...carrying nothing.

Next time I found and followed the Old Carriage Road up aways before heading back(I'd tie my jeans over my boots with the long laces to keep the snow out).

Third time I again headed up Beaver Brook and was determined to Summit!!! From the summit I watched the sun setting over Camel's Hump and started running back! Got out about 9pm...in the dark! Thinking about it after, I figured "that wasn't very smart"!

Then I found out about the White Mountains and even bought a '72 WMG. Sooo...I started climbing mountains after work for something to do(I didn't drink or do drugs).

Turned out I climbed all the NH 4K's before the end of the year

Climbed Killington Feb '76...still in work boots and jeans and carrying nothing. Did Ellen & Abraham a few weeks later. Snowshoes??? What are they??? Carry supplies??? Yeah right!

Years later(after having been a runner & not a hiker), a friend and I did an "adventure run" going in the Wilderness Trail and over the Bonds. There were 2 folks by the Guyot Shelter cutoff in FULL WINTER GEAR...boy were THEY dumb We stopped @ Zealand Hut. Guy said he could sell us a flashlight, thought to myself I'd rather die than buy a flashlight for that price! We got out in the dark after quite awhile trying to find the trail(some dumb luck involved!)!

Jump to present day...and I'm still learning after having solo'd 78 of NEHH, but am no where near as knowledgable as I should be! I'm pretty concerned most of the time I'm "out there"! WAY more so than when with someone else(not a good thing)!

I generally always wear snowshoes right from the trailhead if there's enough snow. It seems way easier to me, besides I'm pretty lazy and don't want to carry them

Also, others have their own interest and love to be out and about doing their own thing. I'm fine with that, even if it might make things a bit less "comfortable" for me.

Sooo...looking back, each time I went out...it was the right thing...for what I knew @ the time! Pretty scary huh Bet each of you have some "interesting" stories from the past

I think I accurately represent an "enthusiastic newbie". I've learned an awful lot from VFTT in the past 7 or so months, and I've learned a lot from actually going out and trying things.

I can say this -- Every purchase I make at EMS is frowned upon by the family CFO. I endeavor to make use of what I already own first, and if that fails, consider a new purchase. I've been eying a new pair of 'shoes (I have 30" Tubbs, which besides being not technical or aggressive enough for the whites, are too wide for the skinnier-shoe-made packed out trails) but the MSR Denalis have yet to go on winter clearance. And the CFO will respond with "Why do you need another pair of snowshoes?"

I bought a pack, bladder+hose, 1 pair of hiking shorts, a few techwick shirts, and new boots. Eventually I bought poles. When it got cool out, out came the cycling tights and long-sleeve jerseys. Ski hats, cycling hats, etc.

My point here is that the average board member here is far more knowledgeable about and spends far more of their disposable income on hiking and related equipment than the average hiking enthusiast. Until you know what you need and how well it works, it doesn't make sense to buy a lot of fancy and expensive stuff. I learned this from cycling, and shortly thereafter from skiing, and it's true again for hiking.

The CFO also finds it very odd I spend this much time reading and writing about it

Tim

dug said:

I don't know. From a skier perspective, I hate the 3-foot deep troughs that are 18" wide. It's impossible to turn, and can be down right dangerous.

I think it depends on your perspective when you say "showed a little more consideration by leaving the trail the same way they found it". I'm personally not a big fan of the trough, and would rather see efforts made to widen the trail more than harden the U-shape. So, if we'd really rather see that, then I guess I wish the trail was completely unbroken so I can have my powder on the way down.

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The powder is in the glades, down in the hard woods and not up in the tight boreal. Skiing on narrow hiking (repeat, hiking) trails is always a dicey, ime. I've found that a snowshoe trough is less efficient on the flats and uphills because you loose the ski guiding tracks. But, a snowshoe trench is infinitely easier than an unbroken out trail. No question.

In terms of the downhill run, I see little difference between a snowshoe trench and rail road like ski track, at least when you're on a narrow hiking trail. In both cases, the trick is to stand on one foot in the trench/track while lightly feathering the snow out of the trench/track in a braking stem. "Schtem! Schtem like hell!!"

Dedicated bc ski trails are another matter. Snowshoe trenches and boot packs ruin the snow. But, the best snow is in the woods anyway.

forestgnome said:

I find that even on a packed trail, snowshoeing is much easier than barebooting if the feet slip even a tiny bit, like walking on an inclined beach. I don't understand the idea that barebooting is more comfortable unless the snow is too deep. On snowshoes, even in the trough, the step is even and stable. Why do people try to do without them?

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I find that the answer of what is easiest depends entirely on a mysticall combination of many different elements from snow type and age, recent traffic activity, trail aspect and such. I've seen many, many occasions where crampons were much faster and much less tiring than snowshoes. And I've seen conditions where bare boots were the fastest, especially on descents.

Snowshoes are tools. I find it best to avoid making universal generalizations about any of our tools. I find it very similar to discussions about beacons, axes, shovels and bivies. I've heard all of these pitched as "must haves", even in New England. IMO, in each case it depends on where and when.

dave.m said:

I find that the answer of what is easiest depends entirely on a mysticall combination of many different elements from snow type and age, recent traffic activity, trail aspect and such. I've seen many, many occasions where crampons were much faster and much less tiring than snowshoes. And I've seen conditions where bare boots were the fastest, especially on descents.

Snowshoes are tools. I find it best to avoid making universal generalizations about any of our tools. I find it very similar to discussions about beacons, axes, shovels and bivies. I've heard all of these pitched as "must haves", even in New England. IMO, in each case it depends on where and when.

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True. I meant in the situations where I see people with snowshoes on their backs while barebooting and I can see their feet slipping. Sometimes I read in trip reports that people didn't bother with their snowshoes because the snow wasn't all that deep. Awhile back, on Champney Falls Trail, I passed a party of about eight hikers. I was following their bareboot marks and you could see that every foot was slipping considerably. These people all had snowshoes on their packs, along with iceaxes, etc. They were also sweating like hogs No criticism here, just don't get it.

Happy Trails

Just a passing thought

I would like to interject one small thought that comes perhaps a bit from ‘the other side’. Two years ago Duffy and I were heading up Cannon on a very hard packed trail. I had checked the trail out at the trailhead and opted for my crampons as the snowshoes would have done nothing but give some traction and the crampons gave me better traction. I noticed as I went up that I was following someone wearing MSRs and another person wearing Stableicers. The MSRs were by no means ruining the trail, but they were digging it up more than either the Stableicers or my crampons which were by the way leaving only small pinpricks in the snow. I had almost reached the ridge without once postholing when I met the MSR person coming down. I gave him a smile and a warm greeting upon which he launched into a five-minute diatribe about how I was being inconsiderate and ruining the trail by postholing etc. etc. Quite frankly, I deal with people’s problems six days a week and hike on Saturday’s to get away from all that and his lecture was the last thing I needed. I simply said thank you and kept on walking. I latter passed the fellow who had been wearing the Stableicers. He had on his snowshoes. He obviously had received the same lecture. When I came back down, I noticed that on the really steep section that fellow switched back to the Stableicers, obviously to gain better traction. My simple comment would be, before putting the mouth into autopilot and giving someone a lecture out on the trail, at least be sure that he actually is messing up the trail.

I don't think anyone here is advocating lecturing people... I think the point of this thread is to raise awareness of the frustration and danger that postholing a trail will cause. In all cases, common sense and courtesy should prevail. If you're slipping on the trail and you need traction, by all means wear your crampons or stabilicers. If this slipping is combined with sinking in more than 2 or 3 inches, it is time to put the snowshoes on because the trail isn't in "hardpack" stage yet.

There are no set "rules" (unless you're in the ADKs) but we should all be considerate of others that use the trails. I don't admonish others on the trail because I don't want to sour somebody else's wilderness experience. But I will drop some simple advice if I can do it in a friendly manner.