A bunch of rescues last weekend

[B the Hiker]

Alas, one fatality, but it was someone rock climbing alone.

I was out recently with a friend who hikes a LOT, and it struck me how much hiking muscle one develops over time. When I first started, many moons ago now, I used to roll my ankle something terrifying. Now, even as I'm getting older and slower, I do fee like my legs and ankles can take a lot of burden and still keep me upright where earlier I would have fallen and gotten injured. That isn't bragging! Rather, I think it's just simply that if someone does something long enough, she or he builds up the ability to take what is tossed at her or him better than newcomers.

In any event, I do wish more folks would hike with the AMC and avoid the problems we read about over and over of people starting too late and/or getting lost.

Rescues: http://www.wildnh.com/Newsroom/2014/Q3/SR_Multiple_Weekend_Rescues_071414.html
Climber fall: http://www.pressherald.com/2014/07/14/scarborough-rock-climber-dies-in-new-hampshire-accident/

All the best,

Brian

 

[TJsName]

The 2nd incident is what happened to a couple of kids we ran into on Memorial Day. They missed the Greenleaf trail and were heading down the Garfield Ridge. My group was able to get them off the mountain without issue thankfully, but it could have been a lot worse give the weather. They only turned around when they started climbing again, and they caught up to us and asked us where 'the trail head' was. I would guess incident like this (near hits) are even more numerous than actual rescues.

 

[B the Hiker]

I managed to catch a group as well. I know there is a desire to minimize signage, but I do think that that particular trail needs a sign making it very clear where people are going. I suspect that hundreds of people go down that wrong trail annually.

Brian

 

[sardog1]

This picture is why I became a dog handler and not a ground pounder. If you look closely, you can see their arms lengthening, while their teeth are slowly ground down and another part of their anatomy is constricting more or less involuntarily.

http://www.wildnh.com/Law_Enforcement/images/Andrew_Koert_Rescue_071214_Franconia.jpg

 

[RoySwkr]

In any event, I do wish more folks would hike with the AMC and avoid the problems we read about over and over of people starting too late and/or getting lost.

One reason that I rarely hike with the AMC is that makes me subject to decisions made by a leader or consensus that may be less optimal than those I might make myself. People do get lost, injured, and even killed on some AMC trips.

 

[NHClimber]

The climber was Brian Delaney, a long time MWV climber. He was not free soloing but instead solo toproping, which is quite safe as a general matter. Unclear what happened but seems he had topped out on the Barber Wall on Cathedral and was preparing to rap. Condolences to the family.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Not to mention feeling pressure to continue so as not to turn the whole group around when I might have done so were I not subject to such strict rules.

Tim

 

[DougPaul]

One reason that I rarely hike with the AMC is that makes me subject to decisions made by a leader or consensus that may be less optimal than those I might make myself. People do get lost, injured, and even killed on some AMC trips.

IMO, organized groups with competent leadership are generally good for beginners (who presumably make more rookie mistakes and (knowingly or unknowingly) take more rookie risks).

Experienced hkiers can pick and choose without incurring unjustifiable risk. (Or at least if they do something risky, they understand what they are getting into.)

Doug

 

[wardsgirl]

I think that a competent solo hiker is less inclined to take risks that would put them in danger, than would a hiker who relied on the assessment of a group leader in most all circumstances.

 

[miehoff]

Alas, one fatality, but it was someone rock climbing alone.

In any event, I do wish more folks would hike with the AMC and avoid the problems we read about over and over of people starting too late and/or getting lost.

I have never hiked with the AMC, I start late all of the time; totally alone, winter and summer, and I take chances. Isn't that what adventure is all about? The last thing that I would want is for someone to tell me how to spend my time in the woods. Yikes!

 

[Driver8]

I was out recently with a friend who hikes a LOT, and it struck me how much hiking muscle one develops over time. When I first started, many moons ago now, I used to roll my ankle something terrifying. Now, even as I'm getting older and slower, I do fee like my legs and ankles can take a lot of burden and still keep me upright where earlier I would have fallen and gotten injured. That isn't bragging! Rather, I think it's just simply that if someone does something long enough, she or he builds up the ability to take what is tossed at her or him better than newcomers.

I agree that this is a fine thing. I like to say that with more hiking experience, I get "smart feet." This could apply to my ankles, knees and the rest of my body for that matter, the eyes, ears and mind, too. I noticed on my Zealand hike week and a half ago that rocky descents which bothered me on hikes earlier in the year were coming more naturally with a few tougher recent outings under my belt on the year. That, plus just feeling a long stronger with more challenging outings is a very good feeling.

On the broader theme of the conversation, I am keenly aware of the need to know when to turn around and how to manage one's options in an evolving situation. I cannot conceive of making the mistake the party written up in the news article you reference, who went past the Greenleaf/GRT/FRT junction down GRT rather than Greenleaf. For heaven's sake, go on that tough, challenging, gorgeous, exciting White Mountain hike. But prepare! Study a map and a thorough route description before the hike, and bring a copy or two of both. The only hikes I haven't done that for are easy local hikes and hikes I've done before and know well. I'm not about to go climb a 4K or two without prepping mentally. Blows my mind that much of anyone would, but people do. Thank goodness for skilled S&R people.

Not to go on too much about it, but I will add that I'm always happy to be able to share some useful insight with less experienced, less prepared hikers I run into sometimes out hiking. Descending from Zeacliff to the hut on my recent return hike, I ran into four or five young 20-somethings, clearly, from what they told me, inexperienced and poorly prepared. They were about 1/3 mile below Zeacliff, and it was about 6:30 pm. They'd set up camp earlier somewhere other side of the hut, near the ponds and bogs, I gathered. Were carrying large, heavy frame packs. Were of average fitness. Asked me where the summit was and how long it would take.

Long story short, after asking a few questions about their pace and taking in their level of experience and preparation, I steered them to the cliffs as a destination, then to descend back to their tents. Explained that attempting the summit, at that hour, was a very bad idea, as they didn't want to descend this stretch to the hut in the dark, much less the ladder and scrambles on "Zeacliff Pond Peak" in descending darkness. They took my assessment to heart, were excited at the prospect, if you will, of the prospects on Zeacliff, and, I expect, probably executed the plan I encouraged them on to a T. I advised that they should give themselves plenty of time to get down to the flats in the light (they did have flashlight and headlamps), that the hut was a big asset for safety and refreshment they should leverage, and bade them a safe and enjoyable trip.

I'm glad we met up. They probably had a good experience where, but for our bumping into each other, they might not have. If one hasn't planned sufficiently, or has gotten in over one's head, as has happened to me a time or two even with my best laid plans, it's always a good thing to meet an experienced fellow hiker who can lend a hand or some sound advice, and it's a good feeling to be able to pass that favor on to others when they can use it.

 

[Raven]

I agree that this is a fine thing. I like to say that with more hiking experience, I get "smart feet." This could apply to my ankles, knees and the rest of my body for that matter, the eyes, ears and mind, too. I noticed on my Zealand hike week and a half ago that rocky descents which bothered me on hikes earlier in the year were coming more naturally with a few tougher recent outings under my belt on the year. That, plus just feeling a long stronger with more challenging outings is a very good feeling.

On the broader theme of the conversation, I am keenly aware of the need to know when to turn around and how to manage one's options in an evolving situation. I cannot conceive of making the mistake the party written up in the news article you reference, who went past the Greenleaf/GRT/FRT junction down GRT rather than Greenleaf. For heaven's sake, go on that tough, challenging, gorgeous, exciting White Mountain hike. But prepare! Study a map and a thorough route description before the hike, and bring a copy or two of both. The only hikes I haven't done that for are easy local hikes and hikes I've done before and know well. I'm not about to go climb a 4K or two without prepping mentally. Blows my mind that much of anyone would, but people do. Thank goodness for skilled S&R people.

Not to go on too much about it, but I will add that I'm always happy to be able to share some useful insight with less experienced, less prepared hikers I run into sometimes out hiking. Descending from Zeacliff to the hut on my recent return hike, I ran into four or five young 20-somethings, clearly, from what they told me, inexperienced and poorly prepared. They were about 1/3 mile below Zeacliff, and it was about 6:30 pm. They'd set up camp earlier somewhere other side of the hut, near the ponds and bogs, I gathered. Were carrying large, heavy frame packs. Were of average fitness. Asked me where the summit was and how long it would take.

Long story short, after asking a few questions about their pace and taking in their level of experience and preparation, I steered them to the cliffs as a destination, then to descend back to their tents. Explained that attempting the summit, at that hour, was a very bad idea, as they didn't want to descend this stretch to the hut in the dark, much less the ladder and scrambles on "Zeacliff Pond Peak" in descending darkness. They took my assessment to heart, were excited at the prospect, if you will, of the prospects on Zeacliff, and, I expect, probably executed the plan I encouraged them on to a T. I advised that they should give themselves plenty of time to get down to the flats in the light (they did have flashlight and headlamps), that the hut was a big asset for safety and refreshment they should leverage, and bade them a safe and enjoyable trip.

I'm glad we met up. They probably had a good experience where, but for our bumping into each other, they might not have. If one hasn't planned sufficiently, or has gotten in over one's head, as has happened to me a time or two even with my best laid plans, it's always a good thing to meet an experienced fellow hiker who can lend a hand or some sound advice, and it's a good feeling to be able to pass that favor on to others when they can use it.

Sounds good they took your advice.

I used to give occasional unsolicited advice in the mountains but was met with enough negative responses that I stopped. I will still make a friendly comment when kids are involved but beyond that, I will be happy to help anyone who ASKS me for it.

A group of scouts was climbing Ammo Ravine a few years back in the fall. One of the kids was heavier and working harder than the rest to keep up. His leader was pushing him pretty hard....the "dig down deep" kind of nonsense best left for adult athletes IMO, and not young teens. The kid was struggling and clearly was going to do whatever he could to save face and not give up in front of his friends. I mentioned very quietly in passing to the leader that the boy looked like he could use some sugar. It was made clear it was none of my business. Clearly the leader knew what he was doing and was not interested in advice.

It's a tough question as to whether to give advice. If someone is about to get hurt, I'll step in obviously and if kids are involved, I'll say something. Beyond that, not so much these days. I get unsolicited advice as well occasionally too. Like Miehoff, I hike solo throughout the year and don't pay much attention to start times. I also have what I need to do that comfortably. I don't mind advice it if it's delivered well however and don't take offense when it's given.

My thoughts go out to the climber's family. I hiked the loop around Echo Lake Monday and was unaware the accident had happened over the weekend.

 

[TCD]

More complete article on climber Brian Delaney. RIP...

http://www.conwaydailysun.com/newsx/local-news/114669-accident-071414

 

[hikerbrian]

So sorry to hear about the passing of Brian Delaney, I'm sure he will be missed dearly, and my condolences go out to his family and friends. Just such a bummer.

FWIW, the closest I ever came to getting into serious trouble in the mountains was on an AMC trip led by someone who lacked a couple of key skills. That is not to bad mouth the AMC or to dissuade others from joining AMC trips. Just saying it's not a panacea for safety, especially the more advanced trips.

I have to admit, stories such as Mr. Delaney's fatal fall really make me question whether I should teach my kids to climb or sell all of my trad gear. This has been an ongoing debate in my head since my oldest was born 5 years ago.

There is wide variability among VFTT contributors on when/if to offer advice to other hikers. A couple of years ago I was returning towards the Highland Center after backpacking the Southern Presis by myself on the last weekend of winter. It was a little after noon and a group of 5 or 6 college kids with Zena and Thor outfits were heading on up the Crawford path with sleds and blow up tubes in tow. I asked them where they were headed and they replied, "We're sledding Tuckerman's!" "Wow!" I said, "Long day... Well, have fun!"

So you know where I stand on the issue.

 

[Driver8]

Sounds good they took your advice.

I used to give occasional unsolicited advice in the mountains but was met with enough negative responses that I stopped. I will still make a friendly comment when kids are involved but beyond that, I will be happy to help anyone who ASKS me for it.

Agreed. In this case, the group directly asked my advice. "How far to the summit?" quickly became an interactive exercise in which we figured out, together, what probably made sense for them given the time left in the day and their pace. I presumed a bit when I went to so far as to suggest that their packs were awfully big and they might do well to go lighter. They groaned in agreement at that - unsolicited advice, perhaps, but not unwelcome. The advice I gave them about the hut as a resource might seem gratuitous, but my sense of them was that, feeling in over their heads as they appeared to be in that moment, it would be helpful for me to reorient them. It was not that they were incapable of understanding that the hut and croo were there for them in those ways, just that reminding them would recenter them and help them feel more grounded and secure in the situation. I'd help them again in just the same way presented with the same situation.

I've been happy to be helped and advised a few times along the way and happy to be of some assistance with similar frequency. Ran into a trio of young men, who very rarely hiked, who'd gotten lost in the maze of trails at Sleeping Giant in Connecticut at dusk in the fall of 2012. They were calling for SAR as I got to them. We were about a mile and a half from the eastern main trailhead where my car was. They were all fine, just lost, all reasonably fit. I led them to my car - we checked with SAR a couple of times, and I explained we had flashlights and I knew the trails well. Turned out half of the trail we were on was new to me and harder than billed in the cursory guides available for the park. It was good not just for them, but also for me, that we met up - there were a couple of small scrambles for which it helped to have someone holding a flashlight for me. SAR was relieved not to have to go tromping into the woods and welcomed us when we got to the trailhead.

Another time I can think of was on Pico spring of last year. Ran into a group of Harvard B School students, avowedly very inexperienced, just on an outing for the day, who made the summit-vs-valley weather judgment mistake: it was over 60 at the Inn and around 40 at the summit. They were at about 3500', just at the turn onto the ski slopes up Sherburne Pass Trail. Wearing shorts. The bits of guidance I was able to give were how far to the summit and how to get there, per the maps and trail description, and, to one of the kids who was shivering cold that it would help him a lot if he took the jacket tied around his waist and put it on. Chuckle. He went from mildly hypothermic to plenty warm in short order.

 

[Hillwalker]

Add one more to the list: SELF RESCUE - Since June 16th I have been spending bits and pieces of time hiking with a young lady whom I worked with on the AT Boundary in the Mahoosucs in 2007. We were part of a four person team that cleared and remarked the two AT boundary swaths from the NH/ME line to Gentian Pond. Anyway, this is the year that she finally gets to do her Southbound hike on the AT (MEGA). I re-supplied her at Jo-Mary Rd in the 100 mile, spent two nights hiking with her in the Bigelows and met her at Piazza Rock etc. Anyway this time I hiked in to Speck Pond from the Success Pond Rd and met her at the Speck Pond campsite where we spent the night. Early last Sunday morning we broke camp and hiked down Mahoosuc Arm in the rain. Inside the second tunnel heading West in the Notch I lost my footing on a ledge and fell about 6 feet to the floor of the abyss managing a nice "Granite" Face Plant. Bleeding profusely, but with nothing broken we continued through the Notch scaring oncoming hikers as we went. It took us about an hour and a half to get through and arrive at the Notch Trail intersection where she was to continue up to Full Goose and onward. Instead she insisted on accompanying me back down to Success Pond Road and go with me to the Hospital in Berlin where I could get my two big facial cuts sutured. I then took her to my cabin where we ate Pizza and drank LTB. The next morning I drove her back to the Notch trail where she continued southbound.

No, she is not a romantic interest. She is 32, and I am almost 75. Just a really good friend and former coworker. Who really Orks Cows anyway? As I understand, cow orking is tipping cows with one hand behind your back. Any cow tippers here? Hi dr_wu!

 

[bikehikeskifish]

How does one be sure that the advice given during a chance encounter is sound?

Think about that.

Tim

 

[TJsName]

How does one be sure that the advice given during a chance encounter is sound?

Think about that.

Other than following the person(s) until they are out of the woods? Maybe get a phone number or an email address.

 

[Driver8]

How does one be sure that the advice given during a chance encounter is sound?

Think about that.

Tim

How is one sure of anything? The welcomeness of an offering of advice is one measure among many.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

How is one sure of anything? The welcomeness of an offering of advice is one measure among many.

I don't doubt people are genuinely trying to be helpful. I have met enough people who were wrong about which trail they were on, or which one they wanted to be on, and how far / how long it was to go. Unless you have gotten your information from a reliable source, book, map, research, it's unknown how good it is.

I can't even count the dozens of people who have pointed out the wrong mountains... although this one is not necessarily dangerous to themselves or others (or maybe it is, if you are trying to orient yourself on a map.

Tim