altimeter advice

[bryan]

i am in the market for an alitimeter and have done a bit of research, but was looking for general advice or feedback before. i'm looking to keep price under $200 if possible, but still find a reliable instrument. my main question at the moment is whether to go digital or analog. the digital models tend to have extra features i would never likely use. i'm really just looking for something to give me an elevation reading.
experiences or suggestions appreciated.
thanks.

bryan

 

[Toe Cozy]

One little opinion

I'm sure there are many more experienced altimeter users than me. I just got mine in the spring. It is digital. It probably has more features than I care about. I don't use the chronometer or the alarm (it's way too quiet). But it's easy to use and it clips on and off of stuff easily. I didn't do too much research ahead of time (which is unusual for me and gear purchases) but I knew someone who had one and it seemed fine for her. It was on sale for $99 at Campmor when I got it.

I like it. It works fine. I use it quite a bit for the time, temperature, barometer changes, and lots for the alitmeter. So, I give it a thumbs up. High Gear Alti-tech 2, here's a link to EMS, campmor doesn't seem to have it anymore

 

[BIGEarl]

You probably already checked the thread, but in case you missed it here is a discussion that went into the digital versus analog discussion plus quite a number of specific products.

http://vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9075


I ended up with a Thommen 21,000 Ft. unit and love it. It works great, and is very accurate, and no batteries. I picked mine up on eBay, along with a second one that became a gift. I believe Thommen is generally considered a top-shelf product. You should be able to stay within your budget on eBay.

The Altimeter Store (http://www.thealtimeterstore.com) is one place where you can shop all types.

I'd buy another without hesitation.

Good luck.


Edit: Mine is a Thommen TX18, good up to 21,000 feet

 

[dms]

I ended up with a Thommen 21,000 Ft. unit and love it. It works great, and is very accurate, and no batteries. I picked mine up on eBay, along with a second one that became a gift.

I'd buy another without hesitation.

Couldn't agree more! Used my trusty Thommen for 20+ years while doing the 3k's, I think it's more accurate than the digitals, including the altimeter which is part of my 60CSx, it doesn't need batteries, just a gentle tap to set the needle every so often.

 

[onestep]

Another Thommen user here!

My first Altimiter was digital, lost it to the spruce gremlins between Oz & Black. Then I picked up my Thommen and have never looked back!

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Earl,

Do you actually use the altimeter? For what? In your case, I could see something which measures net elevation gain, something you're quite fond of . How does +/-30 feet compare to GPS? +/-30 feet means either summit of Owl's Head works

Tim

 

[Toe Cozy]

This Thommen talk has me intrigued. Perhaps I should have done more research before my purchase. Well...I bet what I have now won't be my only altimeter...just my first. See, I was satisfied with what I had until all you crazy people started putting other ideas into my head. Sheesh!

 

[dRitter]

not to poke a skunk with a stick, but by the time you spend the cash on 2 altimeters you could've bought a GPS that contains an altimeter

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

You probably already checked the thread, but in case you missed it here is a discussion that went into the digital versus analog discussion plus quite a number of specific products.

http://vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9075

I ended up with a Thommen 21,000 Ft. unit and love it. It works great, and is very accurate, and no batteries. I picked mine up on eBay, along with a second one that became a gift. I believe Thommen is generally considered a top-shelf product. You should be able to stay within your budget on eBay.

The Altimeter Store (http://www.thealtimeterstore.com) is one place where you can shop all types.

I'd buy another without hesitation.

Good luck.

Edit: Mine is a Thommen TX18, good up to 21,000 feet

I really like my old Thommen, which was good to 15,000 ft, but it seemed to behave erratically above 12,000 ft for the first time in Colorado last summer. My Thommen survived a couple months buried under snowbanks in my driveway two winters ago (it even might have been churned up by a snowblower), so it does not owe me anything, and I will buy another one in a heartbeat. Thanks for the link.

 

[psmart]

I've used a Thommen for many years, and I love it. However, I'd be hard pressed to spend $200 for a Thommen today, since that will nearly pay for a decent GPS that has comparable elevation accuracy, without having to worry about changes in barometric pressure.

Yes, I love to be battery-free, but when I need accurate elevations I carry my Garmin 60csx. It uses a combination of 3D satellite position, combined with a barometric sensor, to provide very accurate elevations without having to make manual adjustments for pressure changes. With a traditional altimeter, the pressure change over a few hours can degrade the accuracy from 20 feet to 100 feet or more, and you won't know how much you're off until you reach a known elevation and reset the altimeter.

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

I've used a Thommen for many years, and I love it. However, I'd be hard pressed to spend $200 for a Thommen today, since that will nearly pay for a decent GPS that has comparable elevation accuracy, without having to worry about changes on barometric pressure.

Yes, I love to be battery-free, but when I need accurate elevations I carry my Garmin 60csx. It uses a combination of 3D satelite position, combined with a barometric sensor, to provide very accurate elevations without having to make manual adjustments for pressure changes. With a traditional altimeter, the pressure change over a few hours can degrade the accuracy from 20 feet to 100 feet or more, and you won't know how much you're off until you reach a known elevation and reset the altimeter.

Interesting consideration. Now I will need to look into my next altitude instrument more carefully. Here is the direct link to the Paulin altimeter that I used to measure Owls Head; price still about $1000.

http://www.thealtimeterstore.com/survey.html

 

[BIGEarl]

Earl,

Do you actually use the altimeter? For what? In your case, I could see something which measures net elevation gain, something you're quite fond of . How does +/-30 feet compare to GPS? +/-30 feet means either summit of Owl's Head works

Tim

Tim,

I use the altimeter on every hike (except last week on Cannon - traveled light). In dense cover (such as on Owls Head) GPS can have problems - as has been discussed in many threads. I really can't speak to GPS questions because I don't have one and can't offer anything first-hand. There are many GPS experts around here and I'm not going to try to B.S. my way past any of them. In reality, +/- 30 feet is fine for my use. When you consider the error tolerance in the maps that are available, +/- 30 feet is probably a much smaller issue.

With a good trail map and an altimeter like mine I can always find my location within a very small error. My hike planning process includes creating a set of notes identifying various locations (trail junctions, stream crossings, summits, etc.) which I use to check calibration. The altimeter helps motivate me on long ascents. When I get under 1000 feet vertical to go I feel much better, under 500 feet - great! People that have hiked with me have experienced the same kind of motivation. I also track my location on the way out to temper abuse to my knees and hips.

My notes include the following data for each location: absolute elevation, incremental elevation gain, total elevation gain, incremental distance, and total distance. At any point I know where I am in the hike and what I have ahead of me.


Yes, I use the altimeter quite a bit.

Earl

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

I've used a Thommen for many years, and I love it. However, I'd be hard pressed to spend $200 for a Thommen today, since that will nearly pay for a decent GPS that has comparable elevation accuracy, without having to worry about changes in barometric pressure.

Yes, I love to be battery-free, but when I need accurate elevations I carry my Garmin 60csx. It uses a combination of 3D satellite position, combined with a barometric sensor, to provide very accurate elevations without having to make manual adjustments for pressure changes. With a traditional altimeter, the pressure change over a few hours can degrade the accuracy from 20 feet to 100 feet or more, and you won't know how much you're off until you reach a known elevation and reset the altimeter.

The Thommen TX18 (good to 21k) is $340 new at the link below, so more food for thought. But, as noted above, a good barometric altimeter is also useful for forecasting storms, when one is holding elevation, such as in a snow cave bivi high on Denali.

http://www.thealtimeterstore.com/thommen-tx18.html

 

[Orsonab]

A convert

After cursing my admittedly cheap ($125) and cheerful Garmin Geko GPS for twelve months, I dumped it on eBay and bought a High Tech Alti Tech 2 from EMS. I've been very happy with it for the last three years. I love the fact that I don't have to worry about battery management (change batteries once a year) or finding a satellite, etc. The altimeter combined with a map tells me what I want to know and has also vastly improved my map-reading skills. On the down side, I do find that I have to calibrate the altimeter fairly regularly, especially in changeable weather. And by frequently...I mean that I've got in the habit of checking it at every other junction or so. I'm sure if somebody gave me a $300 GPS I'd be equally happy but until then...

As an aside, I have no experience with the analog altimeters though I suspect they are more accurate then the digital but, of course, more expensive....

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Thank you Earl. I have yet to find myself wishing for either a GPS or an altimeter. I can see where it could help with location on a map, but like others, I would be hard-pressed to spend that much money on a device which does not include GPS. Granted, they aren't 100%, but they are close.

I usually approximate my position by either landmarks described in the "the book" or turns on the map, etc. As I have never ventured off trail (except to take care of business) I don't see a use for one. Motivation is never a problem for me. I put myself in gear at the trailhead and stop when I see either a photo op or the summit cairn.

Actually, with the exception of identifying visible peaks, I've never felt / had the need to pull out a map or a compass. I almost always stick to a plan, and most plans include a set of deviations from the main plan -- i.e., how much further to add Jackson or Monroe when doing Pierce + Ike.

In deteriorating atmospheric conditions, wouldn't the altimeter be of dubious accuracy?

Tim

 

[NewHampshire]

Earl,

Do you actually use the altimeter? For what? In your case, I could see something which measures net elevation gain, something you're quite fond of . How does +/-30 feet compare to GPS? +/-30 feet means either summit of Owl's Head works

Tim

With a good altimeter (GPS based or "O-natural"), USGS topo map (or similar quality topo map), and a good baseplate compass...and of course the ability to use them, a skill easily learned...will allow you to freely navigate ANYWHERES in the backcountry, trail or bushwacking. Indeed, I have seen Earl's "baby" (quite impressive a piece of equipment I must say) on the Isolation hike we did. Given a lack of trail junctions, knowing your elevation givs one a good "close enough" showing of your location. Is it necessary...no. Staying on trail one would be able to get away with just a simple AMC trail map. Do you even need one for bushwacking? No, map and compass suits many. But as usual.........we hikers are gear junkies, and any new "toy" is fun to "play" with .

Brian

 

[albee]

I have a High Gear Aerial wristwatch-style altimeter and I am very satisfied with how well it works. It is easy to reset if the barometric conditions change significantly over the course of a full day's hiking. I sometimes recalibrate it when I get to a summit with a known elevation or highest contour line, but often times I take a mental note that it was 40 feet low (or whatever) at the last summit, so to expect it to be off by that much at the next checkpoint. How accurate do we really need them to be? As long as I am within 50 feet of the actual elevation, I find that it is useful enough info.

I used to use a Garmin GPS when I did geocaching, but I got real frustrated when it wouldn't give accurate readings under heavy tree cover... and I'm mostly under heavy tree cover when I'm bushwhacking. If you buy a good one you will learn its strengths and weaknesses, but I have grown quite comfortable with my altimeter watch.

I would trust the High Gear Alti Tech as well, and I have heard nothing but good things about the Thommens. I got my Aerial at the REI garage sale for $42 and it works like a dream... sometimes if I calibrate it accurately at the base, I will be off by less than 10' at the summit - always nice to know when you're getting close, and always a pleasant surprise when you get there before you should!

You can get any of the High Gear models that I mentioned for between $90 and $110 on eBay or other online retailers. My offer still stands if you want company on an upcoming bushwhack!

 

[BIGEarl]

.......

In deteriorating atmospheric conditions, wouldn't the altimeter be of dubious accuracy?

Tim

None of these tools are of any value if they are not used properly. My hike notes that I prepare before the hike provide a large number of locations where I can check, and correct if necessary, the calibration. I try to have a calibration point at least every thirty minutes (+/-). This is part of the proper use of the device. These locations don't move with a change in atmospheric pressure. (if they do, elevation is not your biggest concern. )

On the other hand, if you're stationary - in a tent or hut overnight, you can make note of your elevation before going to sleep. In the morning, if you find the elevation now shows you to be much higher than when you went to sleep it would probably be a good idea to keep your rain gear near the top of your pack.


As far as the cost of the unit is concerned, I purchased mine on eBay for ~$90. It was, and still is, in like new condition. The second one I purchased cost ~$105 and included a leather case. It too was in like new condition when I purchased it.


In case you're interested in learning a little more, William J. Peet II wrote and published a book called "The Sportsman's Altimeter/Barometer". This provides information related to off-trail use for navigation, weather forecasting, usage techniques under various conditions, and selection. This document may provide you with new information that you may even find interesting.

 

[cbcbd]

I have the High Gear Alterra, which is a Barometer, Compass, Altimeter dealy. It retails at $170 and is the watch version of the Altitech. It works as well as more expensive Suunto watches.

It's great for adding to your map/compass for navigation and although you do need to calibrate it once in a while, especially with changing climate, it's just the nature of barometric altimeters. Plus, it'll last longer than your GPS batteries and you won't always have enough satellites to get altitude with your GPS.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

A quick scan of the "what's in your pack" threads does not reveal the word altimeter. It could be that the GPS serves that function. If one assumes that one goes hiking in the Whites, stays on trail, and doesn't press on in deteriorating conditions, is there a situation where an altimeter (alone, not in a GPS) is genuinely helpful? The only one I can think of is it might give you a pretty good hint as to how far you have to go to a trail junction, or other landmark identifiable by a contour interval.

Thanks again. I enjoy learning this stuff!
Tim