MSR Whisperlite Stove

[bikehikeskifish]

2) The Nova's regulator is attached at the burner as opposed to the tank on the Whisperlite. This seems to create far superior flame control in YouTube videos I watched. One reviewer pointed out though that because of that when you turn the stove off the remaining fuel in the line can't burn out/evaporate. Is simply holding the line up and letting it drain back into the tank sufficient to get gas out or will it be dripping out - in particular once it is back in my backpack? Not sure if fuel lines on these things have some sort of valve mechanism like the hose on a hydration bladder that close the line when it is unplugged or if they are just open.

The Whisperlite does not burn all the fuel in the line when you shut off the regulator at the bottle. You can depressurize the bottle and then let (most of) the fuel drain back, but I generally burn off the fuel in the line at the line end, after unplugging it from the bottle.

Tim

 

[DayTrip]

In addition to my SVEA I also have the Primus OmniFuel which I choose over the NOVA and Whisperlite. I have too many stoves...

https://www.primus.eu/shop/primus-omnifuel-P328989/

https://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2011/03/stove-of-week-optimus-nova.html

https://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2011/10/stove-of-week-msr-whisperlite-universal.html

https://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2011/03/stove-of-week-primus-omnifuel.html

https://adventuresinstoving.blogspot.com/2012/03/primus-omnifuel-vs-msr-whisperlite.html

I noticed that a lot of the stove reviews (for MSR, Optimus and others) go back to 2012 or earlier. A lot has changed for many of these stoves since then. I generally try not to place too much weight on reviews for anything unless I see a common issue over and over, which usually means the issue is legit. YouTube is nice because you can see it for yourself, even if the reviewer is "slanting" the review one way or the other.

I think I've slowly come back around to a white gas stove and the basic Whisperlite. Dependable design made for what I'm using it for. The SVEA 123R probably is
a more dependable and simple design but has the shortest burn times/smallest fuel capacity and is the slowest stove I have seen, not a good combination. The Reactor is basically a variant of my JetBoil and given how expensive it is I don't really want to plunk down that kind of money for the "same thing" I have and the related concerns I have now, even if maybe it does perform better. And that Nova stove really seems to be the same stove as the Whisperlite with better materials and some better design elements. It was slower than the Whisperlite in videos I watched, but not prohibitively so. That premium in price may be worth it.

 

[peakbagger]

My read on whisperlight's is they arent cheap construction, its a proven design that has been on the market a long time. Parts are readily available for 30 year old stoves and barring major abuse are infinitely rebuildable. Nothing wrong with "plastic" components on the fuel system. with the exception of design flaw on the early Dragonfly pumps I havent heard of many pump failures except for folks who dont check the O rings or expect the leathers will last forever without lubrication. Even a metal pump has O rings. It was optimized to put out a lot of heat in short time, if you want to do "gourmet" cooking with turn down go with a gas stove or if its large group, a MSR Dragonfire puts out plenty of heat with excellent turn down. The trade off with a whisperlight is it was optimized for the demands of a small group. It works for two folks but is actually is better with a group of 3 or 4 which was a typical winter party. For solo or a couple I expect the Svea's are the right size but up the group size and the output and fuel capacity is not enough which can lead to flare ups due it being pushed past its capacity.

In the ancient history of VFTT when we had the Gatherings, I traditionally did large pots of spaghetti and my stove of choice was either a 2 burner coleman or my Dragonfly.

Back when I was assisting a local scout troop we were in the market for white gas stoves, we looked at several brands and eventually picked whisperlights as they were the simplest. We trained many 11 year olds on how to run them and maintain them and they held up for 10 years of use and were probably running long after I stopped assisting them. A lot of other scout troops made the same choice. I even had a few scouts who picked up the trick to simmering.

 

[DayTrip]

So I did go ahead and get an Optimus Nova stove. One thing I had not thought of with a gas stove - when you take the fuel pump out of the fuel bottle to pack up camp I assume it is covered in fuel. How do you clean/wipe for storage in the backpack? Does the residual fuel evaporate if you just let it sit for a minute before packing? Store in a Ziploc bag and clean at home?

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Can you leave the pump in? I do with the Whisperlite. White gas is definitely a messy option.

Tim

 

[peakbagger]

The fuel evaporates but many folks pack stoves in outside pockets.

 

[skiguy]

So I did go ahead and get an Optimus Nova stove. One thing I had not thought of with a gas stove - when you take the fuel pump out of the fuel bottle to pack up camp I assume it is covered in fuel. How do you clean/wipe for storage in the backpack? Does the residual fuel evaporate if you just let it sit for a minute before packing? Store in a Ziploc bag and clean at home?

I'd just leave the pump in the bottle. It does look like it comes with it's own sack but you might want to wrap it in another stuff sack. I usually bring a pair of thinner gloves for handling my white gas stove. You can store them in the same bag as the stove along with a rag. Any which way your going to deal with some residual gas when handling the pump.

 

[DayTrip]

Can you leave the pump in? I do with the Whisperlite. White gas is definitely a messy option.

Tim

I didn't see any specific warning in manual not to and the Nova filter assembly has on on/off knob at the pump so I wouldn't think it would leak. Instructions all have the stove being completely broken down for storage so I guess I just assumed there was a reason for it like the filter seal wasn't as reliable and leak proof as the cap, etc.

 

[DayTrip]

The fuel evaporates but many folks pack stoves in outside pockets.

All of the stove literature, videos, etc always highlight that the stoves pack down inside their cook pot. Obviously that saves space but isn't that a bad idea? If drops of fuel drip out I'd assume you don't want it leaking onto the cook surface you'd be drinking and eating from. Another thing I thought of after receiving the stove

 

[DayTrip]

I'd just leave the pump in the bottle. It does look like it comes with it's own sack but you might want to wrap it in another stuff sack. I usually bring a pair of thinner gloves for handling my white gas stove. You can store them in the same bag as the stove along with a rag. Any which way your going to deal with some residual gas when handling the pump.

View attachment 6090

Yah the stuff sack is pretty decent. Unzips and has a draw string and it has multiple compartments in it to organize stuff. That's a good tip putting some stove specific gloves and a rag in there.

 

[JoshandBaron]

All of the stove literature, videos, etc always highlight that the stoves pack down inside their cook pot. Obviously that saves space but isn't that a bad idea? If drops of fuel drip out I'd assume you don't want it leaking onto the cook surface you'd be drinking and eating from. Another thing I thought of after receiving the stove

Between cooking, cleaning, and the nature of white gas, it'll evaporate long before it ever reaches your lips but I put everything in a plastic ziplock before it goes into the pot anyway.

 

[DayTrip]

Another question: for a multi-fuel stove can you mix fuel types or do you have to drain and clean to switch? The Nova has a universal nozzle so you don't need to physically switch nozzles when changing fuel types unlike the MSR models. So I'm imagining this hypothetical scenario: you have about 2 oz of white gas left in fuel bottle. You luckily find a small general store that doesn't have white gas but does have kerosene. So can you just pour the kerosene in with the white gas or do you need to use up the last 2 oz of white gas and then add kerosene. I assume you shouldn't mix (but I've seen forums suggesting it can be OK) and this scenario would be highly unlikely for me but I was curious, more for safety reasons than performance.

 

[egilbe]

I would think it's no problem mixing. Kerosene is cleaner diesal. Diesal is sludgier gasoline. Not much difference between petroleum types.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

I didn't see any specific warning in manual not to and the Nova filter assembly has on on/off knob at the pump so I wouldn't think it would leak. Instructions all have the stove being completely broken down for storage so I guess I just assumed there was a reason for it like the filter seal wasn't as reliable and leak proof as the cap, etc.

It better be more reliable because it is under pressure.

Tim

 

[DayTrip]

It better be more reliable because it is under pressure.

Tim

Just to expand on this thought, is there any reason not to just keep it set up like this all the time? (i.e. just leave the fuel filter screwed into the fuel tank at home, in the car, on the trail,etc). When you said you keep it in the fuel tank did you just mean on the trail or all the time? EDIT: I was thinking in terms of transportation laws while driving but also safety.

And yet another question - many people mention taking a disc of plywood or similar item to sit the stove on in the snow. Is there any reason to not use metal - in particular another pot or pan you already have? Does metal get too hot and create an overheating situation? The pot set I have has a pretty nice frying pan/shallow pan with it (which I tend to put my hot freezer bag in to eat out of anyway) so I was thinking I'd just flip it over and sit stove on it (my pot set came in a coozie type carrier which I could use to eat out of instead of pan lid). It can obviously take the heat but I didn't know if it would absorb heat and direct it upward. Would be a horrible idea with a canister stove but with the fuel bottle off to the side and maybe partially protected by a wind screen I'm thinking it would be easier because I'll already have that pan. Wouldn't need to drag along another item. Just curious.

 

[egilbe]

I use the aluminum shield that came with my stove. It reflects the heat, but also warms up and melts the snow underneath it. I keep an eye on it when melting snow so it doesn't tip. Plywood is a fairly good insulated and stable base for the stove.

 

[DayTrip]

I use the aluminum shield that came with my stove. It reflects the heat, but also warms up and melts the snow underneath it. I keep an eye on it when melting snow so it doesn't tip. Plywood is a fairly good insulated and stable base for the stove.

I went ahead and tried it yesterday in my yard and it was fine. Stayed nice and cool and provided a very solid base. Used a windscreen I had purchased instead of the included one. Slightly heavier but much more convenient to use. I regularly touched every thing with a bare hand to make sure nothing was heating up at all. I left the whole set up in my garage last night so I can try again today under colder conditions to see how the stove performs.

And of course, I thought of another question: should I be putting something under the fuel bottle as well so it doesn't get colder? I just left it in the snow and it seemed fine. I assume because you can pump the tank during use that even if the cold contact reduces pressure it is not a huge deal. But for ideal performance should I put it on a coozy or a glove or something?

 

[egilbe]

Wrap your fuel bottle with duck tape or something similar. If it's cold, the bottle will cause frostbite if you touch it with bare hands.

 

[DayTrip]

So I've run the stove 4 times now, once from room temperature conditions and 3 times from my garage (unheated) in 36-37 deg F temps and light winds and light rain on one day. Lit by lighter, match and fire steel. Did have 2 follow up questions now that I've actually used this type of stove.

1) Other than the room temp priming/lighting (which was flawless), every time I primed and let it burn down until flame was almost gone and then turned regulator on the flame did not initially ramp up and get strong. It got large and orange so I turned regulator off and let that burn down until almost out (it was pretty large in some cases), turned regulator on again when it was nearly out and it fired right up. I assume this is because I did not use enough fuel to prime so it burned off without sufficiently heating burner? I've been turning regulator on to same place and counting to 2, then turning off (per the manual). Next time I light I plan to count higher before lighting. I assume this is the "variable" part of priming that is temp dependent and that requires the practice. The definition of "almost out" is pretty vague too. I guess that also requires practice to judge how big of a flame it takes to light.

2) When I'm all done and packing everything up the plunger in the fuel bottle (I've been leaving it installed per conversation earlier in this thread) stays in the up/out position and has enough pressure to prevent pressing in and staying in. I've tried unscrewing the filter from the bottle slighty to "burp" the air out of it as well as opening slightly the on/off knob on the filter and neither relieves the plunger pressure. When I unscrew a little fuel drips out of the threads too. Is that normal? Seems like a bad thing having the plunger extended where it could get bent and not work properly. Is there another way to do this other than the obvious removing of the filter from the bottle? Several people indicated they leave filter in bottle while in backcountry so curious how they handle this situation.

Appreciate any feedback on these items. Thanks.

 

[hikerbrian]

Hi Daytrip,

1. An initial yellow-orange flame when you first crack the regulator is normal (assuming your new stove behaves the same as a Whisperlite). To minimize issues with this initial flare up, when I'm first starting it, after priming flame has mostly died down , I always just crack the regulator for as short a time as possible and immediately close it again. This usually results in a manageable yellow-orange flame that dies down in a couple of seconds. I repeat this 'burping' process once or twice, and usually the second or so time I burp it, the flame comes out blue. People seem to have problems with this initial step. The initial flame is yellow orange, and they seem to think if they open the regulator MORE that it will improve things. That's when fireballs erupt. Also, the initial flare up is worse if you don't prime the stove well enough, but it doesn't really sound like that's the problem here. FYI, I've always found that it's better to over-prime than under-prime. If you over-prime, you get a bit more of the yellow orange flame while you're priming, but I always found that completely manageable, as long as I had the wind screen set up. On the other hand, if you under-prime, you're definitely going to get a substantial flare up when you first burp the regulator, and it'll take quite a few more burps before your flame is blue, because the stove won't be up to temperature yet. Again, this is where I see people have problems/fireballs.

2. I always removed the pump from my fuel bottle. I found the plunger would sometimes extend, making it vulnerable to breaking. Actually, for one or two trips I left the pump in the fuel bottle, having seen others do it, and on one occasion I broke a chunk off. It was still serviceable, but I thought it riskier to keep the pump in the bottle than to detach it and keep it separate, usually near the top of my pack where it was less likely to be damaged. It takes almost no time to put the pump in, so I didn't think that time savings was worth the increased risk of damage to such a critical piece of gear.