Appalachia Parking Area - The New Lafayette Place?

[TJsName]

I really don't get your point here. Yes I am obviously one of the cars each Saturday at Appalachia. But in 2012 I'd be 1 of say 40 cars on a SAT AM (my "normal" if you want to describe it that way), then 1 of 45 a year later, 1 of 56, 1 of 72 and 1 of 90 cars now. For the same time on the same day of the week at the same time of the year the amount of cars in the lot has grown substantially. There are clearly many more cars parked at trail heads now compared to when I first started hiking. Whether or not my "sample" reflects the latest blip in a long up trend, a reversal of a decade long decline, etc I have no idea. All I know is that it has grown dramatically in the last 6 years and I see the impact on trail conditions.

For not getting my point, you described it well, just go backwards in time. I started hiking seriously in 2001. So, I was car 1 of 30. To everyone before me, I was adding to the volume. To me, 30 cars was 'normal'. For everyone after me, they are driving up the volume.

 

[sierra]

What Appalachia could use is a bathroom. Too many people visit that lot to ignore.

I've never found parking on the road to be a problem as RT 2 has plenty of sight and shoulder through there. Once Madison Hut closes, the lot opens up.

On a related note. They trucked in a bathroom to the Osceola trailhead. Not a bad building, although it was out of TP, I had to go catch a rabbit.

 

[Will]

As for the future of hiking, I'm hoping that this wave of new hikers leads to a wave of new volunteers and trail maintainers.

I say we have rigorous training for a hiking license. Those who fail the training or choose not to undergo it can still hike all they want, but we open up unbadged-hiker hunting. Bag limits and other details would obviously have to be worked out.

 

[TCD]

I think this touches on an important point. Whenever someone starts hiking, to them everything seems normal. It's only when others join after them that they see any issues with the increased volume that they themselves we're just a part of. It's really an allegory for xenophobia: all these new hikers coming in and stealing our parking spots! Except in both cases it's not a zero-sum game, which is why I welcome anyone and everyone to hike!

This is clear, obvious and correct. Same exact situation in the Adirondacks, where I started hiking in 1984.

The division here in the ADK High Peaks is starting to clarify between two general camps:

1. More hiking is good. It's good for the physical and mental health of the hikers (especially families with kids), it's good for the economy, and it's good for the resource, in that it helps develop a constituency of people who care about the trails and other facilities. (This is the camp I am in.)

2. More hiking is bad. I want my solitude, even on Saturday on the most popular trails, the way it used to be. These hikers cause erosion and SAR events. I've got mine, and I want regulatory action to chase all these new people away.

Now these read like extreme, end of the spectrum portrayals. But I have friends here who fall solidly into all the aspects of either camp 1 or camp 2, and actually express these positions just as I've written them.

Naturally this is causing a lot of trouble here in the High Peaks, and it will continue to cause trouble until it settles out. My biggest worry is that it will take a terrible event to break this logjam. The event I am worried about is someone getting killed by traffic because of inadequate safe parking being provided for the number of vehicles that are coming. As I said on another thread though, it's just like when everyone in a village knows that a certain intersection needs a traffic light, but it doesn't get installed until someone gets killed. Sometimes common sense has to be paid for with a life.

 

[Hillwalker]

I say we have rigorous training for a hiking license. Those who fail the training or choose not to undergo it can still hike all they want, but we open up unbadged-hiker hunting. Bag limits and other details would obviously have to be worked out.

Sounds good to me. We have a tourist trapping season here in Maine. We use Lobster for bait.

 

[jfb]

The parking situation is just as bad in the Berkshires. Real bad, and the trails are very crowded. And there's no views. No reason to hike around here at all.

 

[NHClimber]

I say we have rigorous training for a hiking license. Those who fail the training or choose not to undergo it can still hike all they want, but we open up unbadged-hiker hunting. Bag limits and other details would obviously have to be worked out.

Only a matter of time. Population growth coupled with the fact that .gov will see another licensing revenue stream.

 

[peakbagger]

The big secret is drive an extra 1 hour. Trailheads generally have plenty of room and far fewer people. I rarely see crowds north of RT 2 except Cabot and Waumbeck . Evans Notch area is fairly quiet except for the Baldface Circle loop. The Baldface Circle loop is unusual in that most folks hike it Clockwise so even if its busy day, most folks are heading the same direction so you don't see the crowds.

 

[Tim Horn]

If you don't want to hike with others go where they ain't. The most people I have seen on a hike this year has been 8 in one day but I am certainly like Peakbagger in that I am willing to drive more to get my nature hike in.

When I was schlepping the Presi and Pemi area it was 1999 - 2000. Even then to avoid the crowds we would arrive on Friday night late and hike in and set up a quick camp in order to get a legit parking spot and a jump on the crowds in the morning. That way we only ran into folks after a nice mornings hike. Yes there are a lot more hikers today but really only in a few high impact areas.
When you get completely bugged by the crowding go to Baxter and hike the Travellers or any of the secondary mountains. Everyone goes to Katahdin while one of the best hikes you can do in NE (travelers loop) is seeing 5 or 6 people a day. Like they say, hike your own hike. If you want solitude you can find it. Just not in the Presi's.

 

[richard]

Hike during the week. You can even do Lincoln,Lafayette. Take a vacation day.

 

[JoshandBaron]

If you don't want to hike with others go where they ain't. The most people I have seen on a hike this year has been 8 in one day but I am certainly like Peakbagger in that I am willing to drive more to get my nature hike in.

When I was schlepping the Presi and Pemi area it was 1999 - 2000. Even then to avoid the crowds we would arrive on Friday night late and hike in and set up a quick camp in order to get a legit parking spot and a jump on the crowds in the morning. That way we only ran into folks after a nice mornings hike. Yes there are a lot more hikers today but really only in a few high impact areas.

I always go in late Friday night, making camp around 0000 or 0100, and avoid the traditional 4k routes. It's not uncommon to not see anyone until I'm on my way out Sunday morning. If you're in a Wilderness that isn't on a Bonds traverse you really aren't seeing many people.

 

[egilbe]

I thought doing Franconia Ridge yesterday, there would be few people. I was wrong. There wasn't as many as the last time I hiked it last October on a Saturday, but still way more than I expected. Even saw one women carrying a 3 liter Poland Spring water bottle wearing flip flops just past the summit of Lincoln. She was taking shelter from the wind. I kept thinking "I see dead people". The wind only got stronger from that point.

 

[TCD]

I was bushwhacking in spectacular terrain today, rappelling to explore new climbing routes. Beautiful area; great views, nice day; 25 minutes from the car. Didn't see a soul all day. I wouldn't have minded seeing someone - everyone should be able to have fun. But people who complain about not being able to find solitude, just aren't willing to work (a little) for what they claim to want. I don't see anyone in the woods on most of my trips; probably 90%.

 

[Grey J]

Of the four hikes I did this year, the only place with any number of hikers was Moosilauke but even then, I am talking about 25-30 people all day with most congregated on the summit at roughly mid-day. That was on a Monday. We saw just 2 other hikers on a Saturday loop over the Percy Peaks but the overnight rain probably had an effect there. I ran into only 4 other hikers on my Wonalancet Range Trail, Walden Trail, Old Mast Rd loop on a Wednesday, although Ferncroft parking was full. I imagine everyone was doing Passaconaway and/or Whiteface. Then on Shelburne Moriah I saw just 10 people all day and 6 of those were thru-hikers coming down in the first half hour. That was on a Thursday. So the crowds are not everywhere all the time.

 

[ChrisB]

I thought doing Franconia Ridge yesterday, ... saw one women carrying a 3 liter Poland Spring water bottle wearing flip flops just past the summit of Lincoln. She was taking shelter from the wind.

I know! I always wonder what happens to folks like this. The flip-flop clad, the tee shirt / running short guys, the clueless and foolish.

But somehow most of them make it out OK. A little worse for wear maybe, but in one piece.

I look and them with grudging admiration... I NEVER could reach the ridge in flip flops. Or carry a 1 gal jug of water in one hand, or depart without my trusty day pack.

But they think nothing of it. And they usually succeed.

So who's the crazy one after all?

cb

 

[DayTrip]

I know! I always wonder what happens to folks like this. The flip-flop clad, the tee shirt / running short guys, the clueless and foolish.

But somehow most of them make it out OK. A little worse for wear maybe, but in one piece.

I look and them with grudging admiration... I NEVER could reach the ridge in flip flops. Or carry a 1 gal jug of water in one hand, or depart without my trusty day pack.

But they think nothing of it. And they usually succeed.

So who's the crazy one after all?

cb

The answer is that hiking in NH is not all that dangerous. If you go out on a decent weather day you're probably not going to get into trouble, no matter how ill equipped you are for the hike, as long as you don't mind being uncomfortable.

 

[psmart]

Thread drift: The problem is widespread. The Wonalancet parking lot is regularly overfilled, with a long line of cars parked along the road (to the dismay of the neighbors).

 

[TCD]

It's correct that the problem is widespread, both in NH and in the ADKs.

The parking problem:
>is driven at least to some extent by Government tourist promotion;
>has been obviously coming for many years, and is absolutely no surprise to anyone (any claims of "surprise" are straight up BS);
>represents a significant safety hazard to citizens;
>and cannot be wished away, or policed away.

And yet with this developing problem obvious for at least a decade, Government land management agencies have done nothing to address it. Heck, over here in the Adirondacks they are talking about *eliminating* parking spaces, which will make this issue worse.

 

[JoshandBaron]

There's plenty of parking if people would expand their hiking horizons. I've never had to park on the side of a road because of a full parking lot.

 

[TCD]

I never have a problem either. As I mentioned, I usually see no one on my trips.

But imagining that the bulk of people will change their behavior is exactly what I meant when I referred to "wishing away" the problem. It's not happening now, and it's not going to happen. A "wish" is not a good guide for policy.

This is very analogous to foot traffic on college campuses. On smart campuses, managers see where the traffic paths develop between buildings, and then pave or otherwise harden the paths that people use. On stupid campuses, managers imagine they can force people onto pre-conceived paths, and they vainly put up "Keep off the Grass" signs, which are taken down and laughed at by the users.