Baxter in Winter question

[ALGonquin Bob]

The following statement raises some questions that are not explained anywhere on that website:
The winter season in Baxter State Park runs from December 1 - April 1. Reservations for overnight use of Park facilities may be obtained from the Reservation Clerk at Park Headquarters, through the mail or in person, from November 1st to March 15th. All information requested (Trip Itinerary with the list of party members, Certifications of Physical Fitness for all Party members and Certifications of Training and Experience for both the Leader and alternate leaders along with the appropriate fee) must be received by the Reservation Clerk. The trip leader or co-leaders are responsible for gathering all certifications necessary for each party member. THE REQUESTED INFORMATION AND FEES MUST ACCOMPANY ALL RESERVATION REQUESTS

My question is what are "Certifications of Physical Fitness for all Party members and Certifications of Training and Experience"? Is there some form to fill out? Is this merely a letter from my doctor about my fitness, and a letter from me explaining my experience? (it's SO much easier hiking in New York!). Thanks
http://www.mainerec.com/baxter.asp?Category=102&PageNum=102

 

[Pete S]

I think there is a chance that the information you are reading and the link you posted is outdated. The current link to official information is www.baxterstateparkauthority.com.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

OK, but there is even less info on that site. Are there no longer any special regs or requirements for winter trips?

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

I found it - thanks, Pete.
http://www.baxterstateparkauthority.com/camping/win_procedures.html

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

(it's SO much easier hiking in New York!).

Probably easier hiking just about anywhere compared to Baxter State Park, but winter trips on and around Katahdin are still worth the regulatory hassle, in my opinion. Note: a rope and hard hats are required by all above treeline in winter on Katahdin, although I am not sure that anyone will be up there to check if you do a day trip via Abol slide.

 

[Tom Rankin]

Probably easier hiking just about anywhere compared to Baxter State Park, but winter trips on and around Katahdin are still worth the regulatory hassle, in my opinion. Note: a rope and hard hats are required by all above treeline in winter on Katahdin, although I am not sure that anyone will be up there to check if you do a day trip via Abol slide.

And I was told by someone else who went that the rope need not be climbing certified, just something for everyone to hold onto in case of white out.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

Climbing route and camp

I think I have my original question handled, thanks. Any recommendations on route and location for a base camp? The date is open, but possibly in January. Any other advice gratefully accepted.

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

I think I have my original question handled, thanks. Any recommendations on route and location for a base camp? The date is open, but possibly in January. Any other advice gratefully accepted.

What are your objectives? If Baxter and Hamlin, BSP requires you to spend the first night at Roaring Brook following your ski in from Abol Bridge before heading up to Chimney Pond, which makes for a good base for the those two peaks. If the four list peaks on the west side (Brothers, Fort, Coe) are your objectives, then you can ski in from the logging road west of the park boundary to Nesowdanehunck cabin, which makes a nice base. Other camping options on the SW side that can be accessed via ski from Abol Bridge include Daicey and Kidney Pond cabins. I think that a January day trip to Baxter and Hamlin from Abol Bridge via Abol slide would be a daunting undertaking given the short daylight hours.

http://www.baxterstateparkauthority.com/camping/wintercamping.html

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

Thanks. I'm interested only in Baxter, but might expand on that. I am not looking to do the NE115. Are climbers mandated to attempt Baxter via Chimney Pond only, or are there any other routes possible in winter. I'm not familiar with where the access roads are, or which ones are open in winter. I assume the approach is reasonable on showshoes, since I don't ski.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

I have plenty of questions because I'm in the process of forming a small team for this trip.

• Is there a recommended month for a winter attempt?
• Are there any annual winter events that would attract enough hikers to effect our ability to reserve camping accommodations in Baxter?
• Is it important to get my date request sent on November 1, or is there usually enough space that I can wait a while?

Otherwise, I'll just pick a date and work from there.

 

[Mohamed Ellozy]

• Is there a recommended month for a winter attempt?

The later in the season, the warmer the weather and the longer the days. Both my winter trips to Baxter where in March.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

The later in the season, the warmer the weather and the longer the days. Both my winter trips to Baxter where in March.

Interesting - I had considered late January. I have a different trip in March, but maybe early April...

 

[Mohamed Ellozy]

I have a different trip in March, but maybe early April...

April ain't winter

 

[Frodo]

I have done about a dozen trips to BSP in winter and here are a few answers to your questions:

You do not have to get your reservations in on Nov 1st. Doing it then only gives you a better chance of getting the spots and days that you want. This is highly recommended if you plan on sleeping in a bunkhouse though. If you prefer a tent site or lean-to, then this is not neccessary.

A small group is risky. You need a minimum of four to go above treeline and if you plan for that and someone bails, the trip is over. I would recommend booking a group of 6 min.

Best month? Well that just depends, they all have their pro's and con's. Less trail breaking usually in Jan, but it can also be too rocky to pull sleds. February is awesome for skiing. March is a good month with more daylight, but the skiing can be sketchy... April is out because the park is closed to campers from April 1st to May 15th.

There are no annual winter events in BSP. It's actually quite remote and your team will likley see only a few other people.

If you are only looking to climb Baxter, the most scenic route is from Chimney Pond, but it takes 4 days min. Another option is to climb it via the Abol Slide (which can be done in a LONG day hike), if your group is in excellent shape. You can also break it up into one or 2 nights, but it is definitely shorter than doing it from CP...

Good luck on your trip! BSP is a special place to visit in winter and well worth all of the regs...

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

Great, thanks. The park is closed April 1 to May 15?! Does it thaw that early? back to late January, I guess. Glad I asked, I didn't see that on the website. I'm aware of the group size requirements - I consider 4 to be a small group!

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

April ain't winter

I just want snow, and don't care about the official season. Since we can't climb there in April... no problem!

 

[giggy]

Can't add much - Frodo's post has the meat of the deal there.

If you just trying to "bag" baxter - maybe the Abol trip is your cup of tea. I have done that twice in winter as a day hike. Its about 20 miles. I would say its harder than a bonds traverse. The slide is "steep" and I would def call it a borderline mountaineering route. people do it in snowshoes, and poles and to each their own, but I think its smart to know how to self arrest on this route. there are places where a fall would send your for a ride.

You need good weather for anything above treeline - while 1000 feet smaller than the pressies - I think it commands more respect in winter. No matter how you slice it, your esposed a long way. Wands are not a bad idea if weather is dicey.

Coming from CP - which is an awesome experience and probably the coolest thing I have done in the northeast, the routes to baxter in winter are tougher - don't get me wrong - dobale for sure by anyone with winter skills, but again, your looking at more "mountaineering" vs winter hiking up this way via saddle or cathedral, of dudly via knife edge.


and i can't stress the group thing that frodo's says... its lots of planning and commitment - it would suck to be stuck with 3 people on summit day and have to bail due to people bailing. have a decent sized group - b/c people will bail (sick, whatever)...

hope this helps. not saying its the eiger or anything, just little different than the other sutff in the NE...

have fun - the place is the best in NE - esp in winter.

 

[spencer]

Frodo covered most everything but I thought I'd chime in to reinforce what Giggy said about the Abol Slide trip.

It has only recently been opened up as a "legal" option for climbing Baxter in one day. People have done it for years but now it is officially allowed. It is becoming an increasingly popular option for peak baggers. With that comes the risk of people taking Katahdin in winter less seriously.

There are people on this board and elsewhere that did the trip, had "easy" experiences and will tell you that you can do it without too much trouble... you can do it without mountaineering experience... you can do it without an axe and crampons, etc. They may not know it but they got lucky.

I've done the trip many times and can tell you that if everything aligns nicely, those statements can be true. However, it is much, much more likely that conditions, weather, time, group dynamics, etc. will NOT align that nicely.

Having seen the increase in numbers doing this trip the last few years, I am very worried that the general hiking community will not adequately respect this trip and foolish accidents will follow.

I think the underlying challenge of this trip is that it incorporates a few distinct types of terrain.

To be clear, the trips involves:

1. ~ 5 miles of skiing on tote roads
2. ~ 1 mile of snowshoeing in potentially very deep snow through the woods
3. ~1.5 miles of potentially icy slide climbing, which can avalanche
4. ~ 1 mile of cramponing across the Tableland in potentially arctic conditions

and that's the easy half...

 

[Tom Rankin]

To be clear, the trips involves:

1. ~ 5 miles of skiing on tote roads
2. ~ 1 mile of snowshoeing in potentially very deep snow through the woods
3. ~1.5 miles of potentially icy slide climbing, which can avalanche
4. ~ 1 mile of cramponing across the Tableland in potentially arctic conditions

and that's the easy half...

ok, I'll byte! ( )

What's the hard half ?

 

[peakbagger]

Pure speculation is the harder half is rationally deciding on a given day to not go or turn around if Spenser's listed conditions are beyond the groups actual abilities despite having spent a considerable effort in getting there. Sounds easy in hindsight, but its a source of many accidents and it can be real tough to say, well there is always another day.