bear containers

[SherpaKroto]

I wonder how good my food would be after a bear has played with my Ursack for 30 minutes? I'm going with the Bear Vault. I'm also pretty good with hanging a bag (100% success - so far), but carrying a little over 2 lbs extra day to "stop, drop, and roll" my food is worth it. If I can guarantee that I'll wake up to food, I'm in. YMMV

 

[Jay H]

I would think the hardshell case would be more protective, but the Ursack website did mention the one case in the ADKs where there was a failure, that the "odor" shield wasn't used. Not having seen one but have seen that mentioned in another forum, I've kept a wandering eye over there..

Jay

 

[porky]

Ursack failures

As I've posted before on these forums, my friend, Ted Duggan and I
had two (count 'em!!!) two Ursacks destroyed at Duck Hole last
September, on the last night of our Northville-Placid Trail hike. A
medium-sized bear came around at about midnight and took fifteen
minutes to tear the bottom out of my Ursack. He chewed and drooled
all over the contents, rendering them inedible to us. After scaring
him off we relocated the remaining bag to the latrine, thinking that
the combination of the odor barrier that Ted used and the stench from
the latrine would confuse or discourage the bear. After we went back
to our hammocks, the bear returned and finished eating the contents
of my bag. He then located the remaining bag and tore it open in
about five minutes. Practice makes perfect, I guess. We walked out to
Lake Placid the next morning with empty stomachs.

I have zero confidence in the ability of an Ursack to resist a bear
attack. The device seems effective against smaller creatures,
however. My ridiculously expensive ($200) Bearicade canister has
survived two High Peaks bear attacks with nary a scratch and that's
what I use there from now on. I will consider using my replacement
Ursack in less bear-prone areas. I will, however, hang it in standard
counterweighted fashion when I do. Simply tieing it to a rock or
tree, in easy reach of a bear, as the instructions suggest, is asking
for trouble, in my considered opinion,

porky pine

 

[Mark]

I'll be using a bear canister in the bear prone areas of the high peaks. I've used an Ursack without incident, however that was in areas far off the beaten path.

Even an expertly hung bear bag does not mean you won't lose food. I hung my bag one night well off the ground and a good distance away from the surrounding trees. The bears didn't get it, but in the morning, we found a very happy red squirrel eating a freeze dried spanish omlet on top of the chewed open bag (still hanging in the air). He either shimmied down the line or just lept onto the bag. (Those suckers can jump a long distance!) If he had waited until we left for the day, he would have gotten everything.

I hate hanging bags anyway, so a bear canister is a no-brainer for me. If I'm in an area very unlikely for bears, I'll still bring the Ursack for the smaller critters.

 

[ADackR]

Re: Ursack failures

As I've posted before on these forums, my friend, Ted Duggan and I
had two (count 'em!!!) two Ursacks destroyed at Duck Hole last
September, on the last night of our Northville-Placid Trail hike. A
medium-sized bear came around at about midnight and took fifteen
minutes to tear the bottom out of my Ursack. He chewed and drooled
all over the contents, rendering them inedible to us. After scaring
him off we relocated the remaining bag to the latrine, thinking that
the combination of the odor barrier that Ted used and the stench from
the latrine would confuse or discourage the bear. After we went back
to our hammocks, the bear returned and finished eating the contents
of my bag. He then located the remaining bag and tore it open in
about five minutes. Practice makes perfect, I guess. We walked out to
Lake Placid the next morning with empty stomachs.

I have zero confidence in the ability of an Ursack to resist a bear
attack. The device seems effective against smaller creatures,
however. My ridiculously expensive ($200) Bearicade canister has
survived two High Peaks bear attacks with nary a scratch and that's
what I use there from now on. I will consider using my replacement
Ursack in less bear-prone areas. I will, however, hang it in standard
counterweighted fashion when I do. Simply tieing it to a rock or
tree, in easy reach of a bear, as the instructions suggest, is asking
for trouble, in my considered opinion,

porky pine

I will, however, hang it in standard counterweighted fashion when I do. Simply tieing it to a rock or tree, in easy reach of a bear,

please read the above bolded and colored sentence.

using a overloaded and stressed cable is not the answer. too often people follow others because they are put into a situation that is not in the "norm" and get comfortable seeing others take the lead... i'm not saying people here do that, but the numbers show that this happens.

i'm also not saying the canisters are the answer.... especially since there is a posibillity that next summer season any person who enters the easterne region will be required to carry such a device....

it'd be nice to have other options rather be forced to purchase an item outright..... but alas i understand, the goverment needs to baby sit everybody nowadays because people can't think for themselves.....

 

[Grumpy]

To quote (I think) Poor Richard . . .

. . . aka Ben Franklin . . .

"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure."

and to paraphrase ancient wisdom . . .

"In bear country, a fool and his food are soon parted."

The wise man probably would opt for using a canister these days, all things considered.

G.

 

[ADackR]

Re: To quote (I think) Poor Richard . . .

. . . aka Ben Franklin . . .

"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure."

and to paraphrase ancient wisdom . . .

"In bear country, a fool and his food are soon parted."

The wise man probably would opt for using a canister these days, all things considered.

G.

i know people are going to use the canisters but do we really need to be forced into it.....

there are other solustions!!! thats' why we have choices right....or should it be what everything seems to have come to,, the blind leading the blind......

 

[afka_bob]

who better qualified than the blind?

Heavy hiker traffic and bears getting used to people and their food makes for a situation that might require some babysitting (i.e., circumstances, heavy use, and some bad technique are forcing us into it).

I have a blind friend that I am quite sure could beat you in a footrace through the woods at night, BTW. Maybe he could lead you -- and thoughtlessness shouldn't be confused for thinking for yourself.

 

[Grumpy]

Re: Re: To quote (I think) Poor Richard . . .

i know people are going to use the canisters but do we really need to be forced into it.....

there are other solustions!!! thats' why we have choices right....or should it be what everything seems to have come to,, the blind leading the blind......

This is wailing and railing on about a regulation that is not in place, although it has been proposed and stands under consideration. In the meantime, the use of bearproof canisters for food storage in the High Peaks is strongly recommended and encouraged.

Consider this: Those who reject the canister recommendation may get away without incident, which would be a nice thing. But then, they may lose their food to bears, which is not such a nice thing on several counts.

First, their trips are disrupted. Second, it aggravates and contributes to the nuisance bear and litter problem. Third -- and for those of us who do not especially like the proliferation of rules, this may be the biggie -- it brings us all one step (incident) closer to justifying the imposition of a required bear canister regulation.

We do have choices. The hard part is using our heads and making the right ones for both the short and long term.

G.

 

[ADackR]

Re: who better qualified than the blind?

Heavy hiker traffic and bears getting used to people and their food makes for a situation that might require some babysitting (i.e., circumstances, heavy use, and some bad technique are forcing us into it).

I have a blind friend that I am quite sure could beat you in a footrace through the woods at night, BTW. Maybe he could lead you -- and thoughtlessness shouldn't be confused for thinking for yourself.

awesome, i love how any subject can be turned around into a personal attack.. sweet....

anyway, i' m not trying to attack anyone on this board... i'm just trying to get people to think outside of the box, or canister...pun initended....

i think it's bad news when we only have one choice in a matter and it's really not a choice at that.....

how about this one, let's ban all hiking in the high peaks from March 21 - June 21. no way around it, all trails will be monitered and tickets strictly issued if anyone tries to bypass this law. this way we could solve two issues, 1. Mud season and 2. the bear problem. think about it. this is the time that bears come out of their dens to forage for food. mothers have cubs which causes them to find food. where do they find the food easily, at the local lean-to dump. now, if nobody is in this area, wouldn't this ALSO cause the bears to go find other resources for food....

 

[Remix]

I purchased the heavy Garcia Machine Co. Backpackers Cache for $50 on ebay from the Whitney Portal Store. I don't know if they are still selling them at that price., but if they are not on Ebay I believe they have a web site.

I put some reflective tape on it in case I have to go looking for it, as well as my c*ll ph*ne number under clear duct tape.

Haven't had the opportunity to test it yet , but the bears in this area are hitting up the bird feeders pretty good, and there is scat on the local trails.

 

[afka_bob]

ADackR,

Just as you were aiming your ire at a group (government, the public, people who use stuff sacks, etc.), so was I. If you are in that group, well, there it is, feel free to exercise your right to feel personally attacked.

Crowds in the mountains are a fact of outdoor life. Something has to give. Increasingly, anyone who really wants to get away from it all will have to just, well, go away.

The lands we are talking about are not wilderness, regardless of the designations given. They are public lands. If a substantial part of the public is really going to use them, there will have to be some sort of system to keep them and their resident wildlife from being overrun and destroyed -- or from becoming nuisances that have to be destroyed.

It is different then when Natty Bumpo ran around out there or when I started doing this twenty-five years ago; some will look back on now as the good old days as it gets even more crowded and restrictive.

 

[ADackR]

Just as you were aiming your ire at a group (government, the public, people who use stuff sacks, etc.), so was I. If you are in that group, well, there it is, feel free to feel personally attacked.

ahh, but mine was only to show what people were going on and on and on about and i didn't go after one post... didn't peakbagger not just point this out also when a mere 20% of the board looked at Darren's Brain Tumor thread.

like I said earlier , I'm just trying to open up people's minds to think about situtations and issues and how to find a solution....

back to your comment, is it not the same thing people do at school board meetings, town board meetings etc.. to try an open up thought... sometimes you just have to through out that shock to get peoples attention... again, everyone is to quick to go for one open path....but, we are a socitey of instant gratification and quick and easy results...

i have no i'll feelings towards anyone, i just like to have converstation....it opens up thought....

 

[afka_bob]

ahhh! Thank you -- I will sit back and be enlightened.

 

[ADackR]

ahhh! Thank you -- I will sit back and be enlightened.

you see that's the problem, too many people sit back and listen...



















yes, i know you were being facetious..but isn't that what everything is now....

happy hiking....

 

[afka_bob]

When I can snatch the pebble from your hand, may I then go?

Oh, wait -- I'm already highly skilled in kung fu!

Nice use of white space, BTW, and, of course, as it was never my intention to open minds (unlike others (here, I deliberately do not single you out (see "personal attack" discussion above)!) I am often unable to tell if my mind is open or closed, so it would be foolish of me to try to open others') I salute your efforts.

There doubtless are many paths to the same destination (careful, I'm about to get all existential on you) but in the fragile terrain of these mountains, multifarious paths may yet scar the landscape beyond recognition.

Hey! If you can grab the pebble from me, you can go!

 

[ADackR]

When I can snatch the pebble from your hand, may I then go?

Oh, wait -- I'm already highly skilled in kung fu!

no idea where that is quoted from..

BUT

it does look like you picked to wrong day to start sniffing glue.

ariplane 197? or 198? and not exact quote....

i can edit like you,

it was fun, you know the banter we had going... let me ask you this, do you accept failure well??? not saying you lost or I lost but in general.. i know you understand what i'm trying to do but it almost seems fruitless from one thing to another trying to get people to understand to get out from under a rock.

for instance, here at work people bitch 364 days a year at management(under there breaths) and then one day Corporate gives them the avenue (with anonymitySP??) and NOBODY wants to take it and run with it.. i just don't understand, i feel like with constant failure people just shut down,,

comments???

 

[Mike D.]

Wow, just wanted some input on opinions on the best containers, dont care if its required or not, i like to wake up w/ my breakfast intact.

 

[afka_bob]

... do you accept failure well???

[Shuffling nervously and looking down at feet]

Uh, no.

P.S. to Mike D.: Learn to eat pepper spray -- bears hate it, so you shouldn't have to put it in a heavy bear canister.

 

[Oldsmores]

(heavy sigh): Another useful thread gone to hell...