Boots coming unglued?

[Wolfgang]

I wonder if anyone has had any experience or has heard about this one. I've had some boot problems this summer. It seems that after only a half dozen or so hikes the rubber toe rand and sometimes the sole, where it's attached to the side of the boot, started to separate. This has happened with several different brands.

I just found out today, after having another pair replaced, that I shouldn't be using any kind of boot treatment containing silicone. It seems that the silicone reacts with the glue and will cause the glue to break down.

I had been using "Camp Dry", which contains 13 percent silicone. Go figure.

Anyone know anything more?

Wolfgang

 

[DougPaul]

I just found out today, after having another pair replaced, that I shouldn't be using any kind of boot treatment containing silicone. It seems that the silicone reacts with the glue and will cause the glue to break down.

I had been using "Camp Dry", which contains 13 percent silicone. Go figure.

Anyone know anything more?

FWIW, I have used Sno-Seal (which contains beeswax and silicone) and have never had any such problems.

Doug

 

[peakbagger]

I expect that its the solvent that is in the silicone when it is sprayed rather than the silicone itself. I expect that getting anything to glue it back in place is not going to work as the silicone will prevent if from sticking. About your only chance is to rough it up with sandpaper and try barge cement.


As a woodworker, I have found out that silicone needs to be banned from the wood shop as it gets on the wood and works very effectively at preventing any finish or stain from adhering. Its a big couse of fisheyes.

 

[Rockledge]

I agree that the silicone itself is probably not the culprit. I also agree that repair will be difficult because of the silicone. A product that has worked well for me is Freesole (made by McNett) I repaired the toe rand on my boots using this and it has held up well.

Scrub the separated area well with a brush to remove debris, clean with denatured alcohol (isopropyl should work too), rough up both surfaces with sandpaper and hit it with alcohol again. When the alcohol has dried you can glue and "clamp." Clamping will require some creative ideas depending on the shape of the boot at the location of repair. Be careful not to glue your clamp to the boot. Freesole is sticky, nasty stuff-handle carefully.

I have repaired small separations with cyanoacrylate glue (Super Glue) with good results also. The gel type works best for porous material.

FWIW I use Nikwax Aqueous Wax to waterproof. Seems to work well.

 

[Kevin]

Becareful with SnoSeal, it can gum up leather products... Not a bad idea; but if youhave a Gore-Tex membrane that needs that leather to breathe, guess what? You just wasted money and ruined your boots.

Some products like Nikwax's are water based and are designed for breathable footwear. ANd agreed on the Freeole... This stuff should be in your repair bin, great for a lot of uses.

You could have a product issue, have you contacted the manufacturer? They may want to know.

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I'd stick with Nikwax products. I've had problems with delaminations of soles/rands because of Snoseal. I like the stuff but it breaks down the glues. Now I only use it on my Sorels as they have sewn joints, not glued.

If your boots are the "old-fashioned" Norwegian welt variety, then I don't think it matters too much as they use stitching, not gluing. But, among other things, silicone softens leather. Great for your baseball glove, but maybe not so much for your boots.

 

[Chip]

I'd stick with Nikwax products. I've had problems with delaminations of soles/rands because of Snoseal. I like the stuff but it breaks down the glues. Now I only use it on my Sorels as they have sewn joints, not glued.

My "Original Sno-Seal All Season Leather Protection" contains no silicone. Other than Bees Wax, I can't locate another incredient.

Perhaps there are different versions of Sno-Seal ? I have to tell you, me and a couple friends all bought Vasque Whitney II's in, probably, 1973 and I was the one who religiously treated them with hot-boot, deep-melt Sno-Seal applications. Their boots' stitching dry-rotted within about 3 years. I had mine for about 15 years, at which point the leather and stitching were still fine and I probably could have had them resoled, but I tossed them.

So I'm a big fan of Sno-Seal. I have used Camp Dry on a bivy bag, tent floor, footprint and rain coats, but not on boots.

 

[Kevin Rooney]

Chip -

I've used the one you listed, and haven't had problems. However, the last time I bought it, it was at REI, and this is it:

It isn't the same old stuff. And while it says it contains beeswax, it smells funny - my hunch it contains beeswax AND silicone.

 

[DougPaul]

Chip -

I've used the one you listed, and haven't had problems. However, the last time I bought it, it was at REI, and this is it:

It isn't the same old stuff. And while it says it contains beeswax, it smells funny - my hunch it contains beeswax AND silicone.

That's the new version (or at least the newest). From the description, it looks like the active ingredient is beeswax--silicone is not mentioned. (Labels: "Tectron", "original formula", and beeswax waterproofing for boots & shoes.)

I have an older can--dark blue, with an "Ome Diaber" endorsement. The label says "with silicones added", "The Original Wax Waterproofing", and "mfd for A & T Ski Co., Seattle, WA, 98188".

So, my older can has silicone and perhaps your newer one does not.

Doug

 

[Little Rickie]

I wonder if anyone has had any experience or has heard about this one. I've had some boot problems this summer. It seems that after only a half dozen or so hikes the rubber toe rand and sometimes the sole, where it's attached to the side of the boot, started to separate. This has happened with several different brands.

I just found out today, after having another pair replaced, that I shouldn't be using any kind of boot treatment containing silicone. It seems that the silicone reacts with the glue and will cause the glue to break down.

I had been using "Camp Dry", which contains 13 percent silicone. Go figure.

Anyone know anything more?

Wolfgang

Who makes the boots?

 

[Wolfgang]

Who makes the boots?

Gone through Keen & Merrill

 

[Stash]

...It seems that the silicone reacts with the glue and will cause the glue to break down.

I had been using "Camp Dry", which contains 13 percent silicone. Go figure.

Anyone know anything more?

Wolfgang

Found an interesting site that lists ingredients in some products and lists Camp Dry.

http://whatsinproducts.com/information.php?brandNo=11-001-021

Don't know how accurate but it lists Stoddard Solvent as 58-65% under ingredients. Clicking on that product shows it's an ingredient in a few penetrating oils. Might it be possible that the solvent is getting under glued areas and disolving the glue?

I tend to use a paste version called WetPruf and haven't seen problems, possibly because the paste doesn't penetrate as well as a solvent-based spray would?

 

[Little Rickie]

Gone through Keen & Merrill

Send them back to the maker. They may want to examine them and make good with with you.

 

[Mike P.]

I would also recommend that whatever boots you get next, contact the manufacturer & get their recommendation on what to use.

 

[Pulker Pete]

Sno Seal

I'm with Doug on this one. I've been using Sno Seal since around 1972. I've never had a pair of boots come apart while using Sno Seal. If fact I've crossed many streams after sealing my LL bean boots and never had my feet get wet. I crossed when the streams weren't rushing and high, but basically the stuff works well. Leaned about the stuff from some of the young guys at Clapp and Treat in West Hartford Ct. The place is no longer in business. But I still seal my leather boots with the stuff.

Pete

 

[--M.]

Been waiting for someone to pipe up with this: the Limmer guys have been very clear on the dangers of Sno-Seal gumming up leathers. I used to be a Sno-Seal adherent, but now use the proprietary "boot grease" that they sell. I think it's primarily made of bear fat. Just kidding.

Is it maybe that Sno-Seal might lend itself to over-application? In any case, they always trot out a pair or two of ugly trashed boots to illustrate what horrible stuff it is, and the boots they show are always indeed trashed.

I also notice that the Sno-Seal marketing blurb now emphasizes that it does NOT impede the leather's ability to breathe. Is this new? I certainly didn't get that impression when I was using it on my Fabianos back in the 70s (my dad would warm the boots over the stove and work the Sno-Seal in like a massage).

 

[DougPaul]

Been waiting for someone to pipe up with this: the Limmer guys have been very clear on the dangers of Sno-Seal gumming up leathers. I used to be a Sno-Seal adherent, but now use the proprietary "boot grease" that they sell.

The Limmer boot grease does contain animal grease. I have read that animal greases can cause rot.

When I visited Limmer about a year ago, I specifically asked about this and their take on Sno-Seal. I was told that it depends on the type of leather (and, I think, also the tanning process that was used).

So the best treatment depends on the boot. (For Limmer boots, I would use Limmer grease.)

Doug

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I have not had problems using this company's version of Sno-Seal:

I HAVE had problems using this company's version, available thru REI. It has caused rands and soles to delaminate on my boots:

 

[DougPaul]

I have not had problems using this company's version of Sno-Seal:

My cans of Sno-Seal are similar this one. (I have not had any trouble with them.)

Guess the brand was sold to a new company which "improved" it...

Doug