ocr3
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Anyone with recomendations on Digital cameras for backpacking?
Fixed lens vs SLR?
Fixed lens vs SLR?
Digital Camera
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David Metsky
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Short answer: It depends.
Longer answer: It depends on a lot of things. Some questions you might want to answer before making a decision:
Personally, I own an Olympus C-720 and a Canon SD300. The Oly is old technology at this point but still very functional. If you want an ultracompact I can't recommend the SD300 and SD200 enough.
And your big dividing lines are probably: ultracompact, compact P&S, compact full manual, ultrazoom, and dSLR.
-dave-
Longer answer: It depends on a lot of things. Some questions you might want to answer before making a decision:
- How large a camera do you wish to carry? They range from my credit card sized Canon SD300 to a full size dSLR with lenses that requires a sturdy sherpa.
- How much zoom do you want? Most compact cameras have 3x zoom (35-105mm equivilent). You can get up to 12x in some ultrazooms, more in dSLRs.
- Do you want full manual controls? Most folks will never use them, others insist on them. I've got one of each.
- How long are you out in the woods? Battery consumption becomes an issue on longer trips. If I could I'd always have NiMH rechargable AAs, but ultracompacts use propietary Lithium-Ions ($).
- How many Megapixels? (Note that this probably shouldn't be your first question. It's highly overrated.) If you are going to print an occasional 8x10, 3 or 4 MP is more than enough. I would argue against anything over 5 for most users, it's wasted money any pixels.
- How rugged do you want? There are only a few cameras that are rugged or weatherproof. All digital cameras are more delicate than film versions. I'd look for an all metal body in a compact.
- What features do you want? Previously, video mode in cameras was mostly a toy, now it's more than a toy, but not yet a true video camera. Other features, like macro, shooting modes, flash strenght, etc can be important to you.
Personally, I own an Olympus C-720 and a Canon SD300. The Oly is old technology at this point but still very functional. If you want an ultracompact I can't recommend the SD300 and SD200 enough.
And your big dividing lines are probably: ultracompact, compact P&S, compact full manual, ultrazoom, and dSLR.
-dave-
Gris
New member
As usual, good advice from the Dave, but I would simplify the choice even further. Are you the type that doesn't mind taking the time to drag out a lot of gear and compose shots because you have an idea what you're looking for, or are you more the type that stays on the move and takes pics because cam is handy and easy to use? If you are the former, go for the Cannon digital rebel and its progeny - more weight, more lense options, more time setting up, etc. and more high end product; but, if you are the latter, then get a reasonably compact, light weight fixed lense Olympus or Cannon with a good optical zoom (7X or more) and maybe even stabilization, then figure out a way to store it handy on your hip or breast. 
afka_bob
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Dave hit all the big points, but I always like to drive this into the ground:
Some compact models accept a fixed lens tube that allows attachment of a filter that protects delicate extended lenses. I never go out with at least this. Sometimes I put the camera in the proprietary underwater housing which is surprisingly manageable since it is a rather small camera to begin with. If you are going to keep the bare camera it in a pocket, I would invest in a sturdy ziplock bag, at least.
Some compact models accept a fixed lens tube that allows attachment of a filter that protects delicate extended lenses. I never go out with at least this. Sometimes I put the camera in the proprietary underwater housing which is surprisingly manageable since it is a rather small camera to begin with. If you are going to keep the bare camera it in a pocket, I would invest in a sturdy ziplock bag, at least.
adkphoto
New member
Digital or film? The $ 64,000 question.
David's answer was right on the mark.
One thing that I would add, is that there are a few "weather resistant" digital cameras on the market. I know the Pentax Optio is one. Casio may also have one. The water resistant factor would come in very handy on any camera taken backpacking.
People ask me for advice about digital cameras all the time. The first thing I ask them is if they have a good computer and want to spend more time on it. If this is not the case, and you simply want to e-mail photos to your friends, stick with a film camera and get scans made during processing, or buy a scanner. Film cameras are much cheaper than digitals. Granted you have to pay for film and processing periodically, but digitals have many costs that are overlooked in the initial purchase: larger media cards, backup batteries, chargers, film card readers, computer upgrades, printers, ink cartridges that cost more than your printer, etc. etc. Think about it.
If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.
David
David's answer was right on the mark.
One thing that I would add, is that there are a few "weather resistant" digital cameras on the market. I know the Pentax Optio is one. Casio may also have one. The water resistant factor would come in very handy on any camera taken backpacking.
People ask me for advice about digital cameras all the time. The first thing I ask them is if they have a good computer and want to spend more time on it. If this is not the case, and you simply want to e-mail photos to your friends, stick with a film camera and get scans made during processing, or buy a scanner. Film cameras are much cheaper than digitals. Granted you have to pay for film and processing periodically, but digitals have many costs that are overlooked in the initial purchase: larger media cards, backup batteries, chargers, film card readers, computer upgrades, printers, ink cartridges that cost more than your printer, etc. etc. Think about it.
If you have any questions, feel free to PM me.
David
pepsi
Member
To add just one more thing. I have Canon, G2 and G5. In three seasons I can take hundreds of pictures without changing the battery. I don't even carry the extra anymore if the trip is less than 5 days.
However, the first time I took one out in winter conditions (below 10F) I only got 4-5 pictures before the low battery indicator came on and one more before it quit.
I have tried keeping the battery in my pocket but it dosen't help enough.
This may not be normal but I have gone back to film for winter.
However, the first time I took one out in winter conditions (below 10F) I only got 4-5 pictures before the low battery indicator came on and one more before it quit.
I have tried keeping the battery in my pocket but it dosen't help enough.
This may not be normal but I have gone back to film for winter.
bobmak
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Just a comment on film versus digital.....
I have a Nikon 2200 2 megapixel digital camera. Original cost was $200, I think it's about $150 now. The camera I bring on most trips is an Olympus Stylus Epic 35 mm point & shoot that I purchased used on Ebay for $25; this camera is also "weatherproof" meaning it is moisture resistant. The digital is great for taking quick photos that I want to email to friends. But if I want high quality photos that are keepers, I'd use the Olympus. The quality of the photos I take with that little point and shoot are very close to what I get with my Nikon N80 with a standard 50 mm lense, and way above what what the digital can produce. Digital technology is getting closer to film all the time, but it's not quite there yet.
I have a Nikon 2200 2 megapixel digital camera. Original cost was $200, I think it's about $150 now. The camera I bring on most trips is an Olympus Stylus Epic 35 mm point & shoot that I purchased used on Ebay for $25; this camera is also "weatherproof" meaning it is moisture resistant. The digital is great for taking quick photos that I want to email to friends. But if I want high quality photos that are keepers, I'd use the Olympus. The quality of the photos I take with that little point and shoot are very close to what I get with my Nikon N80 with a standard 50 mm lense, and way above what what the digital can produce. Digital technology is getting closer to film all the time, but it's not quite there yet.
David Metsky
Well-known member
Actually, that's not true anymore. In recent tests, for the first time, the professional dSLRs surpassed 35mm SLRs in terms of quality. Granted, none of us are going to carry a $30,000 dSLR like that hiking, but the switch has already happened.bobmak said:
For hiking use, a modern 4-5MP digital will be indistinguishable from 35mm P&S for anything up to an 11x14 print assuming it is a high quality camera. Fortunately there are many cameras out there that are much better than your Nikon 2200, which is a nice 2MP camera, but certainly not as good as others on the market.
-dave-
afka_bob
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...well, 2MP digital technology isn't there yet, for sure, but it never will be -- at 2MP. And you don't have to spend $thousands to match it -- in practical usage, digital can surpass 35mm in some ways. Drugstore (Walgreens) 4X6 prints from my 2-to5MP files are much sharper than the 35mm and APS 4X6 prints. Consumer photo-finishers often print film shots very slightly out of focus so that dust doesn't show on prints. This is unnecessary with digital printing on the same photo paper, so they print them in focus and they are noticably sharper.
On the other hand, the advice to stay with film for winter conditions isn't bad -- generally less finicky cameras, fewer battery hassles in the cold (totally-mechanical but still-compact older 35mm SLRs or rangefinders can often function w/o batteries, losing only metering capabilities but still let you shoot if batteries fail), and if they do get destroyed by the damp and weather, cheaper to replace.
Olympus has a series of digital Stylus cameras at 3 and 4MP that are weatherproof and compact, and if you really want to be absolutely waterproof, dive housing are available for them.
Like with almost everything else about winter hiking and camping, there are many solutions according to the weight, effort, and expense you wish to carry, make, and invest.
On the other hand, the advice to stay with film for winter conditions isn't bad -- generally less finicky cameras, fewer battery hassles in the cold (totally-mechanical but still-compact older 35mm SLRs or rangefinders can often function w/o batteries, losing only metering capabilities but still let you shoot if batteries fail), and if they do get destroyed by the damp and weather, cheaper to replace.
Olympus has a series of digital Stylus cameras at 3 and 4MP that are weatherproof and compact, and if you really want to be absolutely waterproof, dive housing are available for them.
Like with almost everything else about winter hiking and camping, there are many solutions according to the weight, effort, and expense you wish to carry, make, and invest.
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bobmak
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Just when you think you have decent technology you are left in the dust once again!!! When I bought my Nikon 2200 it had just come out (maybe 2 years ago) and I though it was the best thing in it's price range; it ended up being $200 with rebates. I realize that it is a bit dated now; Nikon is now selling a 4 megapixel version of this camers for the same price. The point I wanted t make was that I purchased a film camera for $25 that takes better pics than my $200 digital. As the Dave pointed out, digital is getting better all the time.
So whats the best digital deal (image quality wise) in the $200-$300 price range these days? We work our butts to enjoy all this beauty, and it's always nice to have great photos to share when we get back.
So whats the best digital deal (image quality wise) in the $200-$300 price range these days? We work our butts to enjoy all this beauty, and it's always nice to have great photos to share when we get back.
afka_bob
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bobmak said:
"These days"? Try "this day." Tomorrow (literally) it will change. If your 2MP does what you want it to do, that's all that matters. With any fast-changing technology, buy it, then ignore the new stuff (and especially the prices of the new stuff) until you need a new one.
I'm using a nearly two-and-a-half-year-old (i.e., ancient technology) Olympus C-5050. It works great, I still have several months on the extended warranty and no plans to change it for anything else anytime soon.
But, to answer your question, I'd buy the next-to-last generation Canon A-series (A75 or A85?). Easy to use, reasonably rugged, compact, versatile, great image quality, and (I think) they use AA batteries and compact flash. There are others, but the Canons are easy to find just about anywhere, especially the discount places.
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David Metsky
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I have a new Canon SD300 4MP model which is slightly smaller than a credit card and takes great pictures, is extremely fast taking pictures, and has a killer movie mode; it cost me $325 + $30 for a 512M memory card. You can save roughly $75 by buying the 3.2MP SD200 which has all the same features. These are pretty much P&S cameras. I personally think this is the best ultracompact on the market today, but these things change every few months.
If you wish to use full manual controls, consider the Canon A85 and A95 which are larger but allow you to set everything yourself. There are very nice ones from Panasonic and Nikon as well.
-dave-
If you wish to use full manual controls, consider the Canon A85 and A95 which are larger but allow you to set everything yourself. There are very nice ones from Panasonic and Nikon as well.
-dave-
Nessmuk
Active member
Pentax just anounced a new 5Meg 3x zoom pocket waterproof cameraocr3 said:
http://www.pentaximaging.com/products/product_details?reqID=6442215&subsection=optio
I have a tiny pocket sized Sony DSC U20 and a larger Canon G3. The Sony came out in a waterproof version 2 weeks after it bought it. But it goes backpacking with me because it is always available. I have taken literally thousands of shots with it that I never would have gotten fumbling with the bulkier Canon. Even though the Sony only has 2Meg, for most photos I can't tell the difference if I only display them on a computer monitor, which is mostly how I show them. Using that small Sony has changed my life with all the photos I have to document my trips. I wish it had zoom and was waterproof beyond a ziplock bag. A Pentax may be in my pocket next season - I'll wait for the critical reviews to come out.
David Metsky
Well-known member
The new small Canons (SD200 and SD300) have better image quality and feature set IMO than the Pentax. I've actually never been too impressed with Pentax image quality; they're OK, just not best in class. They've also had some reliability issues but the new Canons are new so who knows? There are good reviews for the Casio Exlims and the Sonys, except the Sony image quality is just average and they cost more than the others due to the use of Memory Sticks.
I've gone for years with non-weatherproof cameras and had no problems. If a camera with everything I wanted came in weatherproof and non-weatherproof varieties, I'd go for the weatherproof without a doubt. Alas, right now no one has come up with that camera yet so I stick with the non-weatherproof but robust all-metal ones.
If you are willing to carry a larger camera but don't want to go all the way to a SLR (and lose movie mode in the process) consider the Panasonic FZ-20 or the Canon S1. These are great all-in-ones with 12x and 10x zoom with Image Stabilization. Very cool cameras.
I've gone for years with non-weatherproof cameras and had no problems. If a camera with everything I wanted came in weatherproof and non-weatherproof varieties, I'd go for the weatherproof without a doubt. Alas, right now no one has come up with that camera yet so I stick with the non-weatherproof but robust all-metal ones.
If you are willing to carry a larger camera but don't want to go all the way to a SLR (and lose movie mode in the process) consider the Panasonic FZ-20 or the Canon S1. These are great all-in-ones with 12x and 10x zoom with Image Stabilization. Very cool cameras.
