Frosty said:
NO ONE is saying ALL ATV riders cause trouble on land like Beans. What Bean and other land owners are saying is that the trouble is caused by ATV riders. Try to accept that, that some ATV riders are causing trouble. Then consider that if there is no effort to fix the problem from within the ATV community as was down with mtn bikers, then the landowner is left to fix the problem herself. Which she did.
Thank you for agreeing with what I posted. What I had proposed was WORKING with the ATV clubs, who ARE trying to rectify the problem of the few rogue ATV riders. There IS an effort, which is what I mentioned, many times.
You keep saying the two sides should work together as if the landowner has some need to accomodate the riders. You keep believing that and keep denying that ATVs are a problem, and yeah, more and more land will be closed. The riders need land, the landowners don't need the riders. Try to grasp that concept and then see what needs to be done to keep current open land open, and reopen closed land.
I am acknowledging that she doesn't
have to work with the ATV clubs, I am saying she
should, as it is a better solution, for the ATV community, the community at large, and her image. It's a win-win solution all the way around, rather than one sided. I also never denied that ATV's are the problem, there you go again, but I doubt they are the complete problem. I am saying that ATV's are easy to blame, so caution should be exercised when throwing accusations without proof. Try to grasp
that concept.
The first step in fixing the problem is acknowledging that there is a problem, and blaming land closures on a giant conspiracy where the whole world is against ATVs for no good reason falls a bit short. Remember, Bean initially allowed riders on the land. It was their bahavior that caused her to close the land. Now you must convince her that that behavior won't recur if she reopens her land.
I am not saying there isn't a problem, but I'm also not blowing the problem out of proportion like you are. I know the whole world isn't against ATV's, wow you have a flair for the melodramatic. You keep mentioning
their behavior solely that caused the problem, do you have proof of this? It has been stated that teens partying is also a cause of the problem, yet you fail to mention them.
I don't care. I don't have an ATV and don't care if anyone else does. It was only the name Bean that caused me to even view this thread. But I do know that blaming landowners for closing land and believing that there is a secret conspiracy rather than acknowledging that landowners are simply reacting to cure a problem on their land will not help you a bit. If I were a landowner, nothing I have read in this thread would give me a warm fuzzy feeling about ATV riders respecting my property. I hope you do better with Bean and the other landowners.
It's obvious you don't care, and therein lies the attitude problem. I also don't have an ATV, but I get tired when people blame only the ATV's and don't address the real problem. I also don't blame the landowners for closing their lands, as I mentioned before, it's their right and they can do anything they want. I am blaming the attitudes, like yours, that help escalate the problems and drive wedges into potentially viable solutions for all parties. Looking at what you have posted, nothing you could read in any thread would give you a warm fuzzy feeling, because you are so obviously closed minded nothing could change it. Which is fine, take your bias, your one sided rationales, and have a nice day.
Is it a wonder hikers broadly don't accept them??? Hikers, generally speaking, aren't apt to accept anything that destroys trails or creates a loud disturbance while they are trying to enjoy a bit of solitude.
