Faraway Mtn May Be Closer Than You Think

[RoySwkr]

The attached images are from the
STATE OF NEW HAMPSHIRE
GENERAL HIGHWAY MAPS
COUNTY SERIES
SCALE 1"=1 MILE
NEW HAMPSHIRE
PUBLIC WORKS AND HIGHWAYS
PREPARED BY THE
NEW HAMPSHIRE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WORKS AND HIGHWAYS
PLANNING AND ECONOMICS DIVISION
IN COOPERATION WITH THE
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
FEDERAL HIGHWAY ADMINISTRATION

(the cover page at 18" x 24" is too large to scan). From the revision log, the base map was made before 1955 and the last revision to this sheet was 1973 but probably involved roads not summits. Most or all states produced and sold this map series at one time, and the early DeLorme of ME, NH and VT used them as base maps. I don't know how many still bother.

I don't consider this map a primary source as from the elevations the mountains are probably from the USGS 15' quad. Rather it shows which peak the professional cartographers at the highway department took for Faraway Mtn. Although it has been said that the USGS map is ambigious, I consider it significant that the professionals at both the highway department and the planning department (as well as all 3 hikers I know who have listed all peaks in NH and climbed over 1000 of them and hence are expert at with reading USGS maps of NH) all agree on the bump closer to the name rather than the higher one farther away. Every paralegal is entitled to their opinion of the law, but I'd go with the 5-0 ruling of the Court of Appeals

 

[Trail Bandit]

About the County Road Map: I agree that the road map people have drawn in some hills to "fill in some roadless blank spaces" but I think that all that was done is to try to copy what was on the USGS maps. In some cases, their sketch seems to agree, and in others they are way off. Bald Knob is listed as 1660FT elevation where as the actual currently accepted height is 1801 feet. Is there a bump, lower down from what we have been calling Bald Knob, that is the real Bald Knob? A quick comparison of the elevations of many of the hills shown, will raise similar questions about them too.

 

[RoySwkr]

About the County Road Map: I agree that the road map people have drawn in some hills to "fill in some roadless blank spaces" but I think that all that was done is to try to copy what was on the USGS maps. In some cases, their sketch seems to agree, and in others they are way off.

I'll be content if I can convince people of the correct location of Faraway, and let somebody else worry about the rest of the Ossipee Range

Suppose you use your mapping software to superimpose the county map on the USGS map, using Mt Roberts and 2765 as fixed points, that should show you where Bald and Faraway are

 

[RoySwkr]

I have a response about the carriage road map at the Moultonborough Historical Society and the location of the 6 lookout towers.

On the 1917 map the 6 observatories are on: Mt. Roberts, Mountain View,
Mt. Faraway, Mt. Shaw, Black Snout, and Turtleback (the last marked as 60
ft. high). I have photos of 2 different ones from period media (featuring
Ossipee Mountain Park). I believe you're right that the radio tower is
located on the historic Mountain View site.

So apparently we now have 2 period maps showing that the higher spot is Mountain View and the lower is Mt Faraway, do the revisionist geographers wish to give up yet?

 

[Amicus]

I'm glad somebody finally got a look at that Moultonborough Historical Society map and confirmed that it does indeed show the location of T. Plant's six towers - a point of keen interest to some students of the Ossipees. I've been wondering about that since I learned of its existence a few months ago, through another VFTT member, and then told you about it. I take it you also haven't had a chance to look at it, and are quoting an acquaintance who has?

I guess there aren't any real surprises among the six. While Shaw and "Black Snoot" are fairly close together, their opposite vistas would have justified a tower on each. I suppose that may also have been true of "Mountain View," which I guess would have had more of a view W and perhaps N, and "Faraway," the lower bump with remains of a carriage-road which buckyball and I found last year, which would have looked over the Lake and S.

But which of the two "radio tower" summits was "Mountain View"? The northern one, which seems to be no more than 10 feet lower than the high-point summit, would have had a better new to the north, from what Trail Bandit, Mary and I observed on our hike there last month. On the other hand, it seems likely that the carriage road may have ended at the true summit.

There was already quite a bit of evidence that Plant, or whoever drafted that 90-year map for him, labeled the bump "Faraway" and the summit of that ridge "Mountain View," but I continue to believe that reflects conditions then that do not apply now, especially since those names never won official endorsement and the summit has logically come to be called "Faraway" by many before me. That there was then a tower on "Faraway" merely strengthens that argument, in my view. So, this "revisionist geographer" politely declines to revise his revisionism.

Thank you for sharing this very interesting information.

 

[RoySwkr]

I take it you also haven't had a chance to look at it, and are quoting an acquaintance who has?

Correct. Hopefully the Moultonborough Historical Society will have an open house so skeptics can see the map, but I trust an historian to be able to read the tower names.

But which of the two "radio tower" summits was "Mountain View"? The northern one, which seems to be no more than 10 feet lower than the high-point summit, would have had a better new to the north, from what Trail Bandit, Mary and I observed on our hike there last month. On the other hand, it seems likely that the carriage road may have ended at the true summit.

The Mountain View tower was almost certainly on the S one as shown by the carriage road and the boundaries of the Plant estate.

I continue to believe that reflects conditions then that do not apply now, especially since those names never won official endorsement and the summit has logically come to be called "Faraway" by many before me.

I'm not sure why you accept the opinion of people who can't read a USGS map properly over those who actually named it.

That there was then a tower on "Faraway" merely strengthens that argument, in my view.

Huh?

 

[Amicus]

Hello Roy,

As to the location of the six Plant towers, you detected skepticism where there was none. I accepted your acquaintance's ID at face value, as the rest of my post indicated. I did want to point out the source of your knowledge of that map, however.

I'm thrilled to learn, finally, that Plant did build six towers, and where they were. Once more, thank you for imparting that.

Now, let's turn again to that "Plan of Locale" map, c. 1918. I find six crosses on it, each with a name, and they are the six towers, as we now know them. So, Plant and that map were really naming towers, not summits. Who would name a summit "Mountain View," after all? I suppose that tower had a good one then, and wonder how long the tower on "Faraway" lasted. (Perhaps it was planned but never built? There is at least some evidence for most of the others. We saw no sign of a tower up there - just an ancient road).

I'm sure the mapmakers to whom you allude (USGS?) had no clearer idea what "Faraway" meant to Plant than you or I do. So, logic tells me and others to go with the summit. This is not a point on which I would wax dogmatic, however, so I respect your alternate ID.

 

[RoySwkr]

Here is a photo of one of the 6 towers from the annual forestry report, note title

This photo was published without attribution in the NH (Bi?) Annual Forestry Report but my contact at the Castle says it
"was taken by Plant's photographer George Wesley Perry... That image was included in one of the magazine articles I told you I have (1917)."

 

[MichaelJ]

Here is a photo of one of the 6 towers from the annual forestry report, note title

You would not get me up that last flight of stairs. That's a heck of a tower design!

 

[Amicus]

Here is a photo of one of the 6 towers from the annual forestry report, note title

Fascinating photo - thanks for digging it up and posting. The caption, if correct, would confirm that at that time - c. 1916 - there were six "observatories" in the "Park." Would that be "Ossipee Mountain Park," the old name for what became Tom Plant's "Lucknow" (later known as "Castle in the Clouds") estate, which he purchased a few years before and started developing in 1913? (Someone wrote "Lucknow," in quotes, at the top of the photo.) His improvements presumably included these observatories. I wonder which one the photo shows? The rocky top reminds me of Turtleback, but I attach little weight to that.

MichaelJ: That tower design does look a little eccentric - not much room at the top, for sure.

 

[Trail Bandit]

Thanks Roy,
That is a great photo, and who knows, it may have been on Faraway. Next Spring, I will go look hard for some sort of anchors up there. I would like you to come along on a hike sometime.
Bob

 

[RickB.]

The rocky top reminds me of Turtleback, but I attach little weight to that.

+1 The rocks seem to show the columnar jointing so prevalent on Turtleback's summit.

Great photo, thanks, Roy!

 

[carole]

Thanks for locating that picture. I'd probably only get as far as the first landing.

 

[RoySwkr]

The photo was published without attribution in the NH (Bi?) Annual Forestry Report but my contact at the Castle says it
"was taken by Plant's photographer George Wesley Perry... That image was included in one of the magazine articles I told you I have (1917)."

Apparently Plant had the 6 towers built after tearing down the pagoda-style tower Ossipee Park had on Lee Mtn to build the Castle there.

The rocky top reminds me of Turtleback,

For those who haven't yet hiked all the Castle trails, there is a plaque on the Bald Knob Cutoff explaining columnar basalt like Devils Tower and Devils Postpile. The bottom of some of the columns are near the plaque, with the top on Turtleback. Somehow I have a feeling that it won't be long before someone goes up to find the spot where the photo was taken.

 

[RoySwkr]

Iris Baird found a stack of old Forestry Reports at the northern district office, and convinced the ranger he would have more storage space if he gave the reports to the Lancaster Public Library. This makes them more readily available to the public.

That is a great photo, and who knows, it may have been on Faraway. Next Spring, I will go look hard for some sort of anchors up there.

Now that it's been pointed out, I think not only the rock structure but the shape of the rock look more like Turtleback. That's also the only one of the six where I remember anchors. Certainly there was a tower on Shaw, and I don't remember any anchors there (or a survey marker

 

[Amicus]

Now that it's been pointed out, I think not only the rock structure but the shape of the rock look more like Turtleback. That's also the only one of the six where I remember anchors. . . . Somehow I have a feeling that it won't be long before someone goes up to find the spot where the photo was taken.

I suspect that wouldn't be difficult. The remains of the Turtleback tower anchors and cables are very much in evidence. Some of the latter appear in this photo I took in July 2008, looking east to Shaw:

Here are two photos I took in August 2007 of that columnar jointing by the Bald Knob Connector that Roy mentions, some of which, as noted, can also be seen around the Turtleback summit:

 

[RoySwkr]

yet another location for Black Snout

from The Mountain People of Moultonboro by Gilbert M. Hewins, 1908:

Mr. Shaw built a lookout seat with overhanging roof on a spot where the "Castle in the Clouds" now stands and Ossipee Mountain Park was opened to the public. The Park became a widely known resort and thousands came each season to sit in the "Crow's Nest" and view the scenic beauties of the Park. To protect his property, Mr. Shaw charged an admission fee of 25c per person. Another road was built to the highest peak which is nearly 3000 feet above the sea, and from it is seen a magnificent view which includes Casco Bay, Portland, Saco and many other places in Maine as well as the White Mountains, Kearsarge, Whiteface, the Sandwich Range and lakes Ossipee and Winnipesaukee in New Hampshire. This mountain was formerly known" as "Black Snout," but at the Annual Town Meeting in 1882, it was re-named Mt. Shaw by vote of the town to honor Mr. B.F. Shaw.

 

[Amicus]

Roy:

More good stuff, esp. the origin and date of "Shaw." I've seen somewhere a period postcard showing the "Crow's Nest." carole might have posted it?

 

[Trail Bandit]

This what the Crow's Nest looked like.

 

[RickB.]

This what the Crow's Nest looked like.

Thanks! Hard to imagine, given what's there now.