forgive us our trespasses...

[sillypinkbunny]

So, what do you do when you're 'wacking and you come across No Tresspassing signs on the backs of trees...in other words, you find that you've inadvertantly been trespassing, despite your best intentions?

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

Ummmm....Leave!...by moving to the other side of the trees.

 

[post'r boy]

where's the summit in relation to the signs????

 

[TCD]

It's always easier to leave private land than to enter it. If I'm on a bushwhack where's there's a risk of crossing private land, I ususally don't worry too much about it if it's on the way out. Most (not all) landowners can understand that you made a mistake, and that you only want to leave their land and return to the road.

BTW, spb, I read your trail report on Round Mountain. When you get a chance to go back there, one of my favorite "superloops" is to bushwhack the East Ridge of Round, then trail it over to the summit of Noonmark, then bushwhack the West ridge of Noonmark over to Bear Den, then down Gravestone Brook back to the trail and out. Try it, you'll like it!

TCD

 

[skiguy]

The Tone

Being a "North Country Landowner" ah..hemmm....I'll be back on this one...stick to the thread.

 

[ken]

where's the summit in relation to the signs????

it doesnt matter, even if the summit is on private property - you don't belong there if there are signs telling you - it means it belongs to someone else and the person paying for it (the property tax & the signs) doesn't want you there!

 

[post'r boy]

thanks for the enlightening words ken, i never realized that!!
it's called joking around.
i have a dozon donuts here if you'll be nice!

 

[catskillclimber]

I had an experience along these lines today after work mountain biking. I was following a trail that ran along some power lines when the trail ran out. I totally expected it to continue down to route 7 where I could ride the road back to my house. To this point I lost alot of elevation, was muddy, tired, and almost out of water. The thought of heading back uphill the entire distance was just depressing. I followed a cow path that led to private land and then out to the road. I was very anxious about this because you never know what the reaction of the land owner will be. I think most would understand, then again, there are those crazy rednecks that just might put some birdshot in your butt to keep you moving. I won't ride that route again.

 

[byates1]

what if it's on a list and the list your working on, it's on that list. and you won't get the list done if you don't bag that peak. you won't be able to get to the next list. i mean, come on, it's on the list!!! even if it's on the list you shoulnd't bag that peak, list or no list. you can make a list within the list.

you didn't make it up round mountain , what list are you working on buddy? failed weak hike lists?

welcome to views, people around here take thier tresspassing seriously, almost as seriously as the lists.

 

[bigmoose]

Quick, summon the Gibberish-to-English translator!

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

what if it's on a list and the list your working on, it's on that list. and you won't get the list done if you don't bag that peak. you won't be able to get to the next list. i mean, come on, it's on the list!!! even if it's on the list you shoulnd't bag that peak, list or no list. you can make a list within the list.

you didn't make it up round mountain , what list are you working on buddy? failed weak hike lists?

welcome to views, people around here take thier tresspassing seriously, almost as seriously as the lists.

I don't know what you were trying to say, but I LMAO.
I guess it's just been one of those days...

 

[MattC]

I know the question is "what to do if it happens", but I would simply answer "Do your best to not let it happen in the first place."
I think avoiding trespassing is like any other navigational issue-careful preparation beforehand is the key. Study the maps. A lot. Figure out compass bearings beforehand. Know where the property lines are and plan your route accordingly. Check out the excellent "Bushwhacking Tips" thread currently over on the "General Backcountry" forum for more info. Sorry, I don't know how to link to it.

I've never trespassed, accidentally or otherwise (at least to my knowledge), but sometimes marked property lines can be a useful navigational aid, provided you stay on the public land side of the signs. There are places in the Catskills where herd paths run right along a property line. I can think of one where the landowner encouraged me to hike along the line. There are also places where one might run into a property on the way back from a 'whack and follow it back to a trail or road, always remaining on the public side.

Matt

TCD, that hike you mention does sound pretty fun. Maybe I'll check it out someday... after I get the 46 monkey off my back of course.

 

[Neil]

I had been thinking of starting a thread on the subject of private land. Prino and I were discussing this on a previous hike. He's from England and I'm from Canada and we both agreed it was a pity that private land is so firmly out of bounds in the ADK's. (I imagine it's similar elsewhere).
This has never been my experience hiking/bushwhacking in Canada where I have never given a thought (or hesitated) about crossing private land. Prino was saying that landowners in England are duty bound to maintain paths on their own land for the benefit of hikers. I'm sure the history of the 3 countries is responsable for the big differences.
But don't you all agree with me that it's a pity?

 

[Rick]

I agree that hiking in england (and other EU Countries) is much different than the states, but that's what makes us unique - Our rugged individuality. The ability to stake a piece of land, hold title and keep others off. I'm not saying right or wrong, but it is uniquely american

 

[sillypinkbunny]

uh, thanks.

Re: response by mcorsar...
Correct. The question was indeed "what to do if it happens", and correct again, your answer is quite simple. In fact, if I were to take it to heart I might even think you were passing judgement on a noobie such as myself, thinking I didn't "do my best to avoid the situation." In fact, I choose to hike outside of the neatly packaged maps with dot-to-dot boundaries from time to time, accessing hikes from state land and trying to exit via state land. I was more or less just curious to hear other folks' tales regarding this kind of experience, but since your tally provides you with no such experience, thanks anyway...
Re: Neil's post:
As far as being duty bound to maintain trails for the public, I think this is a bit xtreme. However, it is a pity that landownership in the states can be exclusive and protective...

 

[MattC]

I had been thinking of starting a thread on the subject of private land. Prino and I were discussing this on a previous hike. He's from England and I'm from Canada and we both agreed it was a pity that private land is so firmly out of bounds in the ADK's. (I imagine it's similar elsewhere).
This has never been my experience hiking/bushwhacking in Canada where I have never given a thought (or hesitated) about crossing private land. Prino was saying that landowners in England are duty bound to maintain paths on their own land for the benefit of hikers. I'm sure the history of the 3 countries is responsable for the big differences.
But don't you all agree with me that it's a pity?

Interesting. An English friend of mine told me about the trail thing a couple months ago while we were driving to the ADKs. I do agree that it is a pity when land is "firmly out of bounds", although I do play by the "rules." Just because something is posted doesn't always make it completely out of bounds however-by this I mean one can always ask a land owner for permission. I know the few people who have done the Catskill Hundred Highest had to ring a lot of doorbells.

The New York/New Jersey Trail Conference Catskill maps clearly mark where state/private land boundaries are. A few spots have a little "KO" for "Keep Out." These are areas where an owner has expressly forbidden hikers traveling. If an area is private land, but there is not a "KO" then I figure it has potential for getting permission. I have yet to look into any areas like this, but I may at some point. I've heard that many owners don't mind if you ask nicely and assure them that you won't sue them, set fires, camp, hunt or perform pagan rituals on their land. Well, maybe around Woodstock they'd be okay w/ the pagan rituals...

Matt

 

[MattC]

Re: response by mcorsar...
Correct. The question was indeed "what to do if it happens", and correct again, your answer is quite simple. In fact, if I were to take it to heart I might even think you were passing judgement on a noobie such as myself, thinking I didn't "do my best to avoid the situation." In fact, I choose to hike outside of the neatly packaged maps with dot-to-dot boundaries from time to time, accessing hikes from state land and trying to exit via state land. I was more or less just curious to hear other folks' tales regarding this kind of experience, but since your tally provides you with no such experience, thanks anyway...

I was not passing judgement and I'm sorry if I offended you in any way. Others had posted advice for what to do if it happens, such as get off the land immediately, or if you meet the owner, apologize and ask to continue back to your car. If I was being assuming, my only assumption was that you don't want the trespassing to happen. I assumed this because you used the word "inadvertantly" in your original question. Therefore I offered advice on how to avoid it happening. I stand by my post. Also, if you are serious about staying on state land, hiking outside the "neatly packaged maps" is probably not a great idea-how else besides map study would you know whether or not you might accidentally trespass? This isn't a sarcastic or rhetorical question.

Matt

 

[Frosty]

thanks for the enlightening words ken, i never realized that!!
it's called joking around.

I think you need to work on your humor so people can tell you're being funny.

 

[mavs00]

Sorry spb,

I'm with mcorsar still. Like you, I definitely

"choose to hike outside of the neatly packaged maps with dot-to-dot boundaries from time to time" accessing hikes from state land and trying to exit via state land."

All the time in fact. It's no excuse not to EXTENSIVELY preplan to avoid crossing over land that "you have no right to cross". On my current list, fully 15 percent of the list has PP issues that must be addressed PRE-HIKE. I found myself joining "hunt & fish clubs" ( I neither hike nor fish) just to gain LEGAL access to certain peaks. It really is a big deal. Trespassing can almost ALWAYS be avoided with good pre-hike work.

That said, I'll answer the question. Hiking Saddleback (Jay Range, ADKs), an unfortunate road closure had us start the hike a little lower than intended, but we thought we were still okay. About 20 minutes in, we hit a barbwire fence and KNEW instinctually that we'd crossed PP. After the hike, we were fortunate to encounter the landowner in question. WE WERE VERY HUMBLE and actually begged forgiveness. I even offered money to him for our failure to "know better". Eventually, he was real cool with us (no doubt due to our attitude), and he gave us "retroactive" permission for the passing.

Since my explicit goal is to complete my list without trespassing, I am considering NOT COUNTING that peak until I do it over, avoiding the PP altogether.

Hope that helps. GREAT THREAD on a very important topic.

 

[RGF1]

Re: response by mcorsar...
Re: Neil's post:
However, it is a pity that landownership in the states can be exclusive and protective...

As a person whoes Family has a good chunk of posted land I am waiting to how this thread goes . The above coment is not sitting well with me.
We own the land we have a right to determine what happens on our land .
If we do not want any one but thoes who have our permission on it that is our Constitionanally protected right. In NH you are required to post signs every 100 ft and you have to notify the F&G It is very difficult to not see the signs To me there is not a excuse for you being on OUR land with out OUR permission .
What is wrong with land ownership being exclusive and protective?
That person or family owns it pays taxes on it and has every right to say happens on thier land .As another person posted it is thier land and they do not want you on it. ?
What is the issue? This what you do if you if you are on posted land LEAVE ! If you do not you run the risk of being arrested and charged with criminal tresspass a misdemeaonr in NH that usallualy ends up with a fine and probation .

BTW I got Poster boys joke