Goat Packing

[Spiny Mouse]

Does anyone know what the rules are in the WMNF regarding pack animals? I know some people out west use goats as pack animals and I was wondering if it would be allowed in the Whites.

Horses would be too big and have trouble on rocky climbs that would probably just be fun to a goat. Llamas may be OK, but I think goats would still do better climbing rocky trails. Goats are small enough for our White Mountains trails, big enough to carry 30-50 pound loads, and eat just about anything.

My thought is that herbivorous pack animals might be banned to protect endangered plants above tree line. I've tried searching for the WMNF rules on the subject and found nothing.

http://www.napga.org/

http://www.goatpacking.com/

 

[Hillwalker]

Nimby

A few years ago it seems that somebody wanted to use Llamas for packing in the Whites but it didn't fly. Anyway I do know that pack animals are prohibited on the Appalachian Trail which of course runs through the Whites.

But then again horses are allowed on bits of the AT in Virginia, so you raise an interesting question.

 

[dr_wu002]

Can't you just post a hike in Trips & Events and when people show up, tell them you hurt your back and if they can help carry your stuff...

This topic sort of came up recently.

-Dr. Wu

 

[Waumbek]

A few years ago it seems that somebody wanted to use Llamas for packing in the Whites but it didn't fly.

In the early to mid-1980s, llamas were used in the Whites for "guided backpack tours." These were semi-luxury events where the guides schlepped your stuff, made camp, meals, etc. I saw them in the Wild River area several times; they used to make camp about a mile or so down the trail from the Spruce Brook shelter. Wild River was fairly unknown to the general hiker then, and it was odd to come across these expeditions on days when you would see no one else. I believe the idea was nixxed because of the amount of browse the llamas were consuming.

 

[peakbagger]

The llama treks were for profit events and controlled by the outfitter guide permit system. They were limited to the wild river area and did at least one trip up to Unknown Pond in the Kilkennys. The debate would be if the pack goats were "pets" and not part of of a business.

 

[Spiny Mouse]

Pet Goat

I would see a string of any pack animals as having a potentially significant environmental impact, just due to their concentration in one place, along with the people who were with them. My musings are more along the lines of just me hiking with my pet goat, who happens to be helping me carry my gear. Except that I don't have a goat. Just a dog, whose picture you can see in my avatar. Good doggie. She may be a "working" breed of dog, but she's so goofy that I can't imagine the results if I tried putting panniers on her.

 

[Waumbek]

The llama treks were for profit events and controlled by the outfitter guide permit system. They were limited to the wild river area and did at least one trip up to Unknown Pond in the Kilkennys. The debate would be if the pack goats were "pets" and not part of of a business.

I think the debate would center on pet v. livestock. A goat would probably be considered livestock, whether or it's not part of a commercial enterprise, not a pet (even if it is treated as one), and therefore not allowed in a national park. Whether or not a national forest has the same rules, I can't say. You'll probably have to call WMNF to find out for sure.

 

[David Metsky]

I know that the folks at Foote's Farm in Warren have brought their mules up Moosilauke via the Carriage Road. We've since posted the Dartmouth trails on the mountain against pack animals (their hooves do a number on the trail surface) but that's private property.

 

[jniehof]

Pack goats have been used for an ascent of Washington; there was an Appalachia article around...1991?

 

[Tobit]

Interesting topic and I've never seen a clear answer to the question here in the North East. A friend of my in Colorado hikes all the time with his pet goats, Rooster and Peanut. I'd love to hike with a goat, vs. a dog, out here. However, given the difference in terrain and vegetation it probably isn't wise even if it was allowed which I doubt.

 

[audrey]

Pack goats have been used for an ascent of Washington; there was an Appalachia article around...1991?

I remember that article - if my memory still serves, they were on the Jewell Trail.

 

[Whiteman]

My wife won't let me have a goat

But you have to admit, it sounds like it would be a lot of fun to have a frisky little goat along for the hike. I don't know anything about the subject, at all, but I know there is a potential milk supply there. Imagine, a little fresh goat milk in your coffee or tea, and if you're resourceful, a little fresh goat cheese at night (lemon juice is probably all you need to start the separation of the curds from the whey).

Then you have all the problems of nibbling on sensitive vegetation.

I'm looking forward to the updates.

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I had a pet goat growing up, and he was a character. Smart, mischievous, stubborn, and full of life. And yes, goats eat most anything, including the neighbor's prize roses.

Pack animals they're not. If you wanted a small animal for that, I'd consider a burro.

 

[Tobit]

Pack animals they're not. If you wanted a small animal for that, I'd consider a burro.

Meet Rooster and Peanut - http://n0tu.blogspot.com/

 

[sardog1]

Peanut: "Did you remember to pack the Yaktrax?"
Rooster: "Yaktrax? We don't need no stinkin' Yaktrax!"

 

[Jaytrek57]

Pack animals also have the "right of way" on trails.

Now there's a topic we haven't heard in a while.

Sorry...dind't mean to beat a dead horse...(oops again

Peace.

 

[Spiny Mouse]

I had a pet goat growing up, and he was a character. Smart, mischievous, stubborn, and full of life. And yes, goats eat most anything, including the neighbor's prize roses.

Pack animals they're not. If you wanted a small animal for that, I'd consider a burro.

Check out the links in my original post. You'll see lots of pictures of goats doing some serious load carrying in the backcountry, in the woods, above treeline, and in the snow.

Apparently, some breeds of goat do not pack well. Nubians are noted for their laziness and the various pygmy or dwarf varieties just lack the ground clearance, but saanens, togenburgs, oberhaslis, la manchas, and alpines all have good reputations as packers. Basically, wethers of the full size dairy breeds (except nubians) do well.

Or so I hear. I've never really known any goats myself, but they do sound like fun critters to be around.

 

[bjc]

I was staying at Jim Liberty cabin on Chocoura many years ago when a 4H club showed up with a llama packing some of their supplies. They joined us in the cabin for the night (the club members, not the llama).

 

[Paradox]

I had a pet goat growing up, and he was a character. Smart, mischievous, stubborn, and full of life. And yes, goats eat most anything, including the neighbor's prize roses.

Pack animals they're not. If you wanted a small animal for that, I'd consider a burro.

And you don't have to buy one, you can just burro one.