Highland Center?

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I choose to be more negative than positive. Down with this life is good crap - it really isn't all that great.
Have you stopped taking your pills?

Haha! I hear ya! Saccharine is OK for coffee but only if you're out of sugar.

But hey! As my friend Rik always says, "Be safe, the mountain will still be there tomorrow".

In any case, they blew it with the name. The center of the Highlands is somewhere in Scotland.


Thanks for sharing! :)
 
what's the appropriate response when you see a veteran basher using the Boot Room at Pinkham, filling their water bottle at a hut, reading Appalachia, or parking at the Highland Center because the NH DOT hasn't plowed out the nearby trailheads yet?

when i worked for the amc as a hut caretaker i spent a lot of time out hiking the surrounding areas. i heard many conversations incognito about the amc particularly from thru hikers who often felt very strongly about how much the amc sucked and was ruining their hiking experience. i would then return to the hut to find these same people cooling off in the hut, filling water bottles, studying maps, and my favorite, asking for "work for stay". i always found it amusing.

bryan
 
i always found it amusing.
Did you find it amusing or did it piss you off?

I see nothing amusing about hypocrisy or freeloading.

Had I been you I would have razzed their hypocritical ***** from here to Springer Mountain (and then I would have probably gotten fired).
 
Have you stopped taking your pills?

Haha! I hear ya! Saccharine is OK for coffee but only if you're out of sugar.

But hey! As my friend Rik always says, "Be safe, the mountain will still be there tomorrow".

In any case, they blew it with the name. The center of the Highlands is somewhere in Scotland.


Thanks for sharing! :)

If they stuck a Scottish nick nack shop in the lobby I might wonder in.
Better idea would be to lose some of the parking lot and put a Market Basket in.Then they'd have the most northerly Market Basket in NE,that would attract the tourists
 
I use the bathrooms at Pinkham because I have to....whipping it out in a parking lot full of people is, well....hell, Matts got worse for NOT peeing in a parking lot, so I can only imagine what I would get.

I stop in at huts usually because the people I am with want to....I could easily go without ever stepping in one.

I am friends with someone who's stepson's girlfriend worked at one of the huts (and at Pinkham for a while). Let's just say the AMC is not "generous" with the pay there. I am a VOLUNTEER trail adopter (I am glad to do it), and my point about mentioning this is that this program is run on a minimum of funds. So where does all this money go?

I am with Gig, this orginization is going the way of TNF, Abercrombie and Fitch, and all the others mentioned in that other thread. The AMC was an orginization to be proud of at one time. Now.....well, Joe Dodge is probably rolling around in his grave right now.

Brian
 
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So where does all this money go?
Here's one example: http://www.outdoors.org/conservation/wherewework/maine/mwi-overview.cfm
With the recent purchase of the 29,500-acre Roach Ponds Tract in late 2009, AMC has permanently protected over 66,000 acres of land in the region, creating a 63-mile-long corridor of conservation land stretching from AMC's Katahdin Iron Works property near Greenville north to Baxter State Park. AMC has also added new nature based outdoor recreation opportunities through its trails network and Maine Wilderness Lodges.

I have some issues with the Maine Woods Initiative, but more in the execution than the goals.

The Maine Woods Initiative is the main funding thrust of the AMC right now, and a lot of resources are going there. This is something that only an organization like the AMC can accomplish, IMO. Smaller, more grass roots organizations clearly have their place (and I support and am active in many of them) but so do larger organizations that work with large donors. There's room (and need) for all of them.
 
I figured there would be a couple that would say "i would rather be in the mountains than NYC" - well whatever, for myself - some weekends I would rather be in the hills - some I would rather be in the city.

signed proud ex-AMC member

There are some weekends I want to be someplace else, just never NYC.
the Beach, home, at a ball game, playing with my kids, out for a drive... I like my cities smaller, I like tourist destinations less crowded or if I'm at a tourist trap, I want an escape to someplace quieter. (Williamsburg VA vacation this year, the parks were a zoo, but the time share felt secluded & very relaxing)

As far as how much a NP CEO makes, I guess that depends on value. If they have great ideas on how to meet/exceed the goals of the organization, they should be rewarded. If they somehow got say a billion from Bill Gates or Warren Buffet or $100 mill from Tiger (so he could hide in the forest somewhere) well, that kind of fundraising should be rewarded.
 
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Did you find it amusing or did it piss you off?

I see nothing amusing about hypocrisy or freeloading.

Had I been you I would have razzed their hypocritical ***** from here to Springer Mountain (and then I would have probably gotten fired).


"amusing" is being too nice. i don't appreciate that kind of hypocrisy either. it just got to the point that you had to let it go, for the sake of having the job and because so much time would have been spent trying to straighten people out. not too many days went by i didn't end up defending the amc on some level. always made me wonder what people were doing there in the first place (didn't like carrying a tent?). thru hikers in particular didn't seem to realize there was anything beyond their white blazed corridor and that the mountains and facilities were there for people other than themselves (mind you i also met many wonderful people in that mix as well).

bryan
 
Here's one example: http://www.outdoors.org/conservation/wherewework/maine/mwi-overview.cfm


I have some issues with the Maine Woods Initiative, but more in the execution than the goals.

The Maine Woods Initiative is the main funding thrust of the AMC right now, and a lot of resources are going there. This is something that only an organization like the AMC can accomplish, IMO. Smaller, more grass roots organizations clearly have their place (and I support and am active in many of them) but so do larger organizations that work with large donors. There's room (and need) for all of them.


Yes, but unfortunately the AMC won't leave it as a true wilderness, one of the few places left in NE - they have plans to build. Now, if they left it alone that would be cool.
 
Now, if they left it alone that would be cool.
If they wanted to leave it wilderness they wouldn't have support from the locals who derive their livelihoods from the land. It's a complex situation, and there are no simple black and white solutions, IMO.
 
Ive voiced my complaints and comparisons of the HC verses PNC in past threads. I tend to hike alot in the southern peaks as of late and have tried to use the Highland center to my advantage. I will not renew my previous negitive comments but will convey my recent opinions instead. I decided to drag my gear in there and set up on many occasions, verses the back of my truck, nobody has ever bothered me about it, bathrooms are 4 star, I mean compared to the outhouse at Crawford path trailhead, cmon. The people that work there are funny, some seem out of place but they all are nice enough imo. I dont eat there, I pack all my own food, when I break it out to eat again nobody bothers me. All that being said, its still to me a funny place and has a wierd vibe, but it is what it is, what the AMC's intentions heck you got me, to each his own, but Im making use of the place to my needs and the coffea is always ready, they just need MUCH bigger cups. oh one more thing, there's this girl that works the desk sometimes, man she's like watching the sun come up over the continental divide on a warm summer morning.;)
 
I agree it is complicated. I do hope though, that they don't end up building a Highland Center equivalent in the Maine Wilderness or cut many new roads in there for access to new buildings.
This area has not been a "wilderness" since Thoreau passed through ... let's blame Thoreau ... after all, he recognized the beauty of the area and spread the word.

For eons before Thoreau visited, the area was bountifully used for hunting, fishing and gathering ... not for sport but for subsistence which is part of the motivation of the traditions which continue today.

It has also been used for logging for centuries and this has given us the benefit of access to backcountry on roads built expressly for that purpose. Some of these roads come and go with the logging cycles. The clear cuts, mostly done according to sound forestry management now, open up vistas and feedlots for large mammals.

The land which AMC acquired is home to four sporting camps, AMC now operates three, and several leased lots on which modest cabins were constructed. AMC canceled these leases and some of the cabins are in their rental inventory.

Rather than constructing roads, AMC, sometimes to my chagrin, is abandoning them. There isn't a paved road in AMC's North Woods holdings and you traverse what's there at your own risk, high clearance, 4 WD and extra spare tires often a necessity.

As beautiful as this area is, appreciate that it is at approximately midstate (appreciate that after driving 7 hours to get there) and this is the southern gateway to to the great North Maine Woods, most of which is privately owned for industrial forestry (a renewable resource remember) and most of which is accessible to the public for the traditional uses which have been going on for centuries.

The area is far from a "wilderness" under bureaucratic definitions, but it is wilder than anything in the Northeast. Let's not be selfish and shortsighted about how it is used ... notwithstanding the AMC holdings, the North Woods generates revenue for the US Treasury, not consumes it. It is jobs, recreation and spiritual renewal ... but for better superlatives, ask Thoreau.
 
Yes, but unfortunately the AMC won't leave it as a true wilderness, one of the few places left in NE - they have plans to build. Now, if they left it alone that would be cool.

AMC isn't the Wilderness Society or the Nature Conservancy, or a state or the USFS either.

I expect that they will provide recreational "opportunities" for those that want to travel up there. There's plenty of land up there that a portion can be built on.

Historically, much of the area has been used for timber. That industry is now largely gone. Got some other ideas on how to support the local economy?
 
oh one more thing, there's this girl that works the desk sometimes, man she's like watching the sun come up over the continental divide on a warm summer morning.;)

You may have just given me a reason to actually set foot in this foreign place!! :D Nice simile, btw!
 
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Can't wait to check this place out after reading all this. :) Sounds like an interesting place to visit.

If I think it's to expensive, I won't go back.
If the food is poor, I won't go back.
If service is poor or rude I won't go back.

:D
 
This area has not been a "wilderness" since Thoreau passed through ... let's blame Thoreau ... after all, he recognized the beauty of the area and spread the word.

For eons before Thoreau visited, the area was bountifully used for hunting, fishing and gathering ... not for sport but for subsistence which is part of the motivation of the traditions which continue today.

It has also been used for logging for centuries and this has given us the benefit of access to backcountry on roads built expressly for that purpose. Some of these roads come and go with the logging cycles. The clear cuts, mostly done according to sound forestry management now, open up vistas and feedlots for large mammals.

The land which AMC acquired is home to four sporting camps, AMC now operates three, and several leased lots on which modest cabins were constructed. AMC canceled these leases and some of the cabins are in their rental inventory.

Rather than constructing roads, AMC, sometimes to my chagrin, is abandoning them. There isn't a paved road in AMC's North Woods holdings and you traverse what's there at your own risk, high clearance, 4 WD and extra spare tires often a necessity.

As beautiful as this area is, appreciate that it is at approximately midstate (appreciate that after driving 7 hours to get there) and this is the southern gateway to to the great North Maine Woods, most of which is privately owned for industrial forestry (a renewable resource remember) and most of which is accessible to the public for the traditional uses which have been going on for centuries.

The area is far from a "wilderness" under bureaucratic definitions, but it is wilder than anything in the Northeast. Let's not be selfish and shortsighted about how it is used ... notwithstanding the AMC holdings, the North Woods generates revenue for the US Treasury, not consumes it. It is jobs, recreation and spiritual renewal ... but for better superlatives, ask Thoreau.

I have been visiting the area since I was 2, and have fished/hunted the Roach Ponds too many times to count. The fishing was always good and the ponds have the largest frogs I've ever seen. The hunting was always meager, too much land for not enough wildlife, but the moose were abundant.

You're right about the roads, and for fishermen they were a gold mine to some of the best spots, but you've always needed a high clearance 4x4 to get in there. Based on their own website, they plan on closing the area down to all motorized traffic, which is too bad. The area is so dense there is little chance people are going to wander off-road and create a problem. But, while it was a good fishing spot, it was rarely used by more than a handful of people.

I have no problem with the AMC dictating terms of the land, it's theirs and they can do with it what they wish, within state regulations. I am glad to see they plan on maintaining the working aspects of the forest, but do wish more consideration was given to snowmobilers and ATV's, which is where most of the tourism industry in that area derives its money. The locals were not for the sale to the AMC, but accepted it as part of the Plum Creek management plan, of which the public had significant input.

However, I think it's a monumental blunder on the AMC's part to try and develop it as a wilderness center and expect a lot of people to show up. The closest place for resupply is Greenville, with only the Indian Hill Trading Post carrying anything of value (IHTP also owns the other grocery store in town), but they do stock a nice selection. It is remote, much more than anything in the Whites, and will take considerably more effort to reach a destination. Once you arrive, you won't have the beauty and splendor of the mountains, you have a place in a forest with no majestic views to take in.

KI is similar, but the main thrust is Gulf Hagas and the KI history, neither of which exist in the Roach Pond tract.

The winters are just as harsh as the White mountains with the cold and snow (sometimes colder, the pond/lake ice is often over 4' thick), but good luck calling S&R out there. For those people looking for a wilderness experience where they're self sufficient, it's a perfect location. But, for those people looking for a more gentile woods experience, it's entirely the wrong place.

Augmenting the location in the woods is the fact you've got to drive umpteen hours just to get there (I live in Maine and it's over 3 hours for me to get there, which is more time than it takes me to get to the HC), over the suckiest roads in existence (Maine roads are HORRIBLE), and there is nothing close by that will entice you further, just more woods. When I go to the Whites, I always stop in North Conway, which has some great shops, restaurants, and sights, supported not only by the hiking & climbing industry, but also the plethora of ski areas nearby, along with shoppers and sightseers. In Maine there is very little similar, with snowmobiling, ATV's, hunting, and fishing being the main tourism components, and if people can't drive to their destination (motorized access), they won't go. No one is going to lug a deer or moose very far without a vehicle, nor will a lot of fishermen walk to a pond they can only fish from a bank. So right from the start the "public uses" are significantly diminished.

I can understand why the AMC bought it, to complete the tract along the 100-Mile corridor, but I don't think for a minute it'll become profitable like anything in NH. I see it as more of a long term investment/land conservation green initiative than a self-sustaining entrepreneurial endeavor.

Just my 2 cents on the subject.
 
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I can understand why the AMC bought it, to complete the tract along the 100-Mile corridor, but I don't think for a minute it'll become profitable like anything in NH. I see it as more of a long term investment/land conservation green initiative than a self-sustaining entrepreneurial endeavor.
My thoughts exactly. :)
 
Kudos to Stan and Lawn Sale for very fine posts, in my opinion. I had a dim view of the AMC's Maine Initiative until hearing a fine presentation a couple of years ago by one of my Old Hutperson buddies Gerry Whiting, who was AMC's point person for the project. I will get there for an overnighter eventually, but as noted by many, it is a long drive for a lot of us, as is BSP.
 
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