Hope for delaying Dementia among Outdoor Curmudgeons

[skiguy]

https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-new...study-says-orienteering-can-help-165371973803
Interesting...but not sure I am on board with getting lost on purpose. LOL!

 

[Mike P.]

It was a story on orienteering, or at least stop relying on GPS all the time. For us old map and compass folk we are all set. Unless youuse GPS to find your local Dunkin.

 

[skiguy]

It was a story on orienteering, or at least stop relying on GPS all the time. For us old map and compass folk we are all set. Unless youuse GPS to find your local Dunkin.

Glad you got that part of it. It is also about how our Brains develop or dissolve neurologically. I have put my time in orienteering, so hopefully I've banked a few brain cells. Always good to have some humor and hope to go along with it.

 

[Nessmuk]

I could not agree more. When I was self-learning the finer points of precision map and compass in the wilderness, I never tried to "get lost on purpose", but I always felt that learning from mistakes meant that I would never make those mistakes again.

I will admit to occasional locality confusion at times, but the old school idea of sitting down with a sandwich along with a bit of map study to reveal where I have been and where I am now with a plan of what to do next has never failed me. Even if you have a GPS with you, you must resist the temptation to "cheat" by looking at it. You do not learn or exercise your brain by cheating. At the end of the day, I felt that a trip without any non-fatal navigation mistakes being made was far less valuable to my learning experience than a trip in which everything went perfectly smooth. In time, fewer and fewer mistakes are made and confidence grows with correct thought processes.

I have taught wilderness guides, SAR teams and adult BSA trek leaders for 30 years. Use of GPS is not allowed during the field exercise exams that each group leader must demonstrate to me. Only after I am confident the students are proficient with map and compass will I give a short course on GPS use. The only partial exception to my rule is when I teach the basic SAR specific land nav course to SAR team members, because GPS is such a mandatory tool to use along with search techniques during a SAR incident. The state certification for the SAR Crew Boss training course, however, requires old school advanced map and compass proficiency in addition to GPS expertise.

 

[TomK]

Exercise of brain or body is its own reward and is worthwhile for its own sake. Exercise of skills one may need one day is also worthwhile.

Having said that, yes, I am often lazy and use GPS routinely. It has led me astray (briefly) on more than one occasion, always because I misused it. It always told me what I was asking of it, but from time to time, I'd inadvertently ask it to do the wrong thing.

So far, I caught errors pretty quicky, because 1) what I learned in years of using a map & compass, 2) knowing that blindly relying on something like a GPS can get you into trouble, so I *always* need to ask, "Does what it is telling me make sense?" When the answer is no, I need to stop, pull out the map & compass, and figure out where the problem lies. 3) by checking the GPS very frequently for "where am I now?", I not only can quickly identify going astray, but I also have a "known good situation" that isn't too far from where I am now.

I am of an age where cognitive decline is a real concern, and wrestle with the convenience of using GPS, and the exercise of reverting to the "old ways" for the mental challenge, and to keep my skills sharp for the day that I may be in true need of them.

TomK

 

[skiguy]

Exercise of brain or body is its own reward and is worthwhile for its own sake. Exercise of skills one may need one day is also worthwhile.

Having said that, yes, I am often lazy and use GPS routinely. It has led me astray (briefly) on more than one occasion, always because I misused it. It always told me what I was asking of it, but from time to time, I'd inadvertently ask it to do the wrong thing.

So far, I caught errors pretty quicky, because 1) what I learned in years of using a map & compass, 2) knowing that blindly relying on something like a GPS can get you into trouble, so I *always* need to ask, "Does what it is telling me make sense?" When the answer is no, I need to stop, pull out the map & compass, and figure out where the problem lies. 3) by checking the GPS very frequently for "where am I now?", I not only can quickly identify going astray, but I also have a "known good situation" that isn't too far from where I am now.

I am of an age where cognitive decline is a real concern, and wrestle with the convenience of using GPS, and the exercise of reverting to the "old ways" for the mental challenge, and to keep my skills sharp for the day that I may be in true need of them.

TomK

Sure beats playing Canasta and Shuffelboard in Sarasota.

 

[sierra]

I'm a self-taught mountaineer. I learned everything from books, pre-internet for the most part. At one point my library of mountain related literature was over 500 books. I taught myself map and compass, not precise geocaching level, but the basics. Twice out west, I found myself( lol) lost. I was able to lay out my map and plot a reasonable course to get myself back on track. In CO, it was fairly easy, steep sided valley with a stream basically running down the lowest point through the valley that I know crossed the trail about 5 miles South of my position. I set a course to intersect that stream and eventually did, then followed it out. Two things came up that made it a tad challenging. Overcoming obstacles that that make you deviate from your standard bearing and following trailless terrain to keep on bearing. In hindsight a GPS might have been more efficient, to be honest, I dont know how to use one, but they sound precise. In CA, I was able to use mountains as guiding features which really helps, but the distance is deceiving to say the least. Above treeline travel is easier but you still have navigate obstacles as you travel. I don't need to go any deeper at this point in my career, but I would strongly recommend map and compass training to any budding mountain climber. Here's the biggest take away from being lost, as tough as you think you are, it's unnerving and hard not to feel that rush of panic when you realize, you are lost. I actually had to sit down and rest to get my head on straight.

 

[Nessmuk]

Exercise of brain or body is its own reward and is worthwhile for its own sake. Exercise of skills one may need one day is also worthwhile.

Having said that, yes, I am often lazy and use GPS routinely. It has led me astray (briefly) on more than one occasion, always because I misused it. It always told me what I was asking of it, but from time to time, I'd inadvertently ask it to do the wrong thing.

So far, I caught errors pretty quicky, because 1) what I learned in years of using a map & compass, 2) knowing that blindly relying on something like a GPS can get you into trouble, so I *always* need to ask, "Does what it is telling me make sense?" When the answer is no, I need to stop, pull out the map & compass, and figure out where the problem lies. 3) by checking the GPS very frequently for "where am I now?", I not only can quickly identify going astray, but I also have a "known good situation" that isn't too far from where I am now.

I am of an age where cognitive decline is a real concern, and wrestle with the convenience of using GPS, and the exercise of reverting to the "old ways" for the mental challenge, and to keep my skills sharp for the day that I may be in true need of them.

TomK

Most of my backcountry trips have multiple goals. The "published" goal is to reach some remote backcountry destination and return along some potential stated route(s). This will give SAR some place to look if I do not return home on time. But in many cases my more personal important goal is to practice and gain ever more skill and experience at successful traditional precision backcountry land navigation (no GPS). Achieving my accuracy and experience goal is more rewarding to me than the eventual arrival at some rarely seen little hidden pond in the wilderness.

 

[Andrew]

I say I don't like using gps when hiking (stays in the pack for emergencies) and prefer my maps and reading the landscape. But my wife does as she has the need to quantify miles etc. and uses the thing on her phone for day to day stuff, but I have to say it is nice for clearing uncertainty, especially with a dependent minor in tow; "are we close to the trail junction yet, should we turn around now."
But think about that loss of real world decision making when you always know exactly where you are. I have been 'hiking' since I was a pre-teen either by myself, or with my childhood friends, but we didn't call it hiking, instead "let's go to Eagle Rock and check out the cliffs" and the like...But remember maybe hiking for what seemed like miles and eternity and not seeing the trail junction, or the campsite, or lean-to yet; and having to sit down as a group and look at the maps and try to read the landscape and make decisions. And maybe the true wonder of not knowing exactly where you are.

 

[skiguy]

I say I don't like using gps when hiking (stays in the pack for emergencies) and prefer my maps and reading the landscape. But my wife does as she has the need to quantify miles etc. and uses the thing on her phone for day to day stuff, but I have to say it is nice for clearing uncertainty, especially with a dependent minor in tow; "are we close to the trail junction yet, should we turn around now."
But think about that loss of real world decision making when you always know exactly where you are. I have been 'hiking' since I was a pre-teen either by myself, or with my childhood friends, but we didn't call it hiking, instead "let's go to Eagle Rock and check out the cliffs" and the like...But remember maybe hiking for what seemed like miles and eternity and not seeing the trail junction, or the campsite, or lean-to yet; and having to sit down as a group and look at the maps and try to read the landscape and make decisions. And maybe the true wonder of not knowing exactly where you are.

Sounds like a wealth of brain cell retention.

 

[peakbagger]

We used to take the Gorham scouts in the woods for strict map and compass work. Thery were always surprised and proud when they came out just about what they were shooting for despite being out in the woods shooting bearings from terrain feature to terrain feature for three or four hours.

 

[skiguy]

We used to take the Gorham scouts in the woods for strict map and compass work. Thery were always surprised and proud when they came out just about what they were shooting for despite being out in the woods shooting bearings from terrain feature to terrain feature for three or four hours.

Sounds like great neurological stimulation which is what the article infers. As stated there in using a GPS bypasses stimulating areas of the brain that are important to exercise that map and compass work otherwise does. I know personally when using a GPS the experience is definitely a disconnect from other levels of stimulation that otherwise would be perceived without the use of GPS. GPS definitely has it’s place but the mental gymnastics that occur by not using it is no doubt beneficial not only by maintaining brain power but also the development of that brain power. It has been known for sometime now that digitized learning uses different neurological pathways than that of analog based learning.

 

[peakbagger]

Cab drivers in London have to get a license to drive a cab. In order to get the license they have to have a map of all the streets in London memorized and are tested on that knowledge. There have been studies where certain parts of the brain are measured of people just starting to learn the map of London and after they have passed the test. There is a distinct gain in brain development in a particular part of the brain. No doubt folks who actively bushwhack with map and compass are building and rewriting brain matter.

 

[Nessmuk]

Look carefully at this video clip to the end. Which of these kids do you think is most aware of and will ever appreciate their surroundings? Handheld GPS or cell phones, may be good tools for their intended purposes, but focussed misuse will result in brain mush. I have even seen people walk with a compass the same way. Most times this practice will lead them to fail (at the very least) the land navigation portion of their wilderness guide leadership certification.

View attachment kidsstaringatgps.mp4

 

[peakbagger]

Of course, probably the biggest thing going for outdoor people is continued outdoor activity. Yes there are genetic and potential unknown environmental issues that everyone may have, but most things I have read is continued daily routine physical activity is key to delaying a whole host of old age issues. Oh yes and good oral hygiene also seems to have a linkage so floss them teeth

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

Of course, probably the biggest thing going for outdoor people is continued outdoor activity. Yes there are genetic and potential unknown environmental issues that everyone may have, but most things I have read is continued daily routine physical activity is key to delaying a whole host of old age issues. Oh yes and good oral hygiene also seems to have a linkage so floss them teeth

Recently added the water pick routine, which is wicked tedious but seems to help.