in support of a "Blue Bag Movement"

[DougPaul]

I'm sure your nurse is right, but I wonder what the science is behind that? I'd think that an average adult human carries less disease than an average adult animal. Could it be the food we eat? The medicines we take? If its true, that's a scarey thought.

Diseases are often host species specific and human feces tends to contain human diseases. Presumably pet feces are more dangerous to humans than wild animal feces because pets are more likely to pick up (or at least carry) human diseases.

Doug

 

[erugs]

Not to hijack the thread, but I've heard that vegetarian's feces are safer than carnivor types.

 

[David Metsky]

Even if 3/4 of those never need to go, or are able to at the facilities, that's still 12,500 potential cr@ps trail side. Seems to me it wouldn't hurt to encourage bagging on the heavy use trails.

The heavy use trails have privies in the middle of the hike, and restrooms at the top and bottom. I don't think your numbers add up.

 

[Craig]

Here is some information that addresses most of the issues raised here. Although this paper appears dated, the information presented is not.

 

[Nutsosa]

I wasnt talking about crapping on the trail - that's something alltogether different. I've never happened upon that, thank goodness.

I ran into that early one morning on my way up Lafayette, right in the middle of the OBP.

/yuck

 

[Stash]

Paper or Plastic?

It's been mentioned one or twice in this thread... What happens to the plastic bag after you "toss" it? Where I live we can recycle the plastic bags you get at the market (I believe they make fleece from them) but I think they'd get really mad if the plastic bag you tossed in the recycling bin wasn't quite empty.

If you toss it ends up in a landfill or incinerator. Are there biodegradable blue bags???

 

[Chip]

Petsmart, and others I'm sure, sell biodegradable bags for cleaning up after a dog. I'm not sure how quickly they break down, but that'd solve part of the plastic problem with bagging.

 

[erugs]

I ran into that early one morning on my way up Lafayette, right in the middle of the OBP.

/yuck

What you saw might not have been what you thought it was. Dog and bear can (but not always) look similar to human and they don't know the difference about on or off trail. (Of course, I was out in Yosemite last September and saw something obviously human on the trail -- check out the old post if you care to know more.)

 

[Nutsosa]

What you saw might not have been what you thought it was. Dog and bear can (but not always) look similar to human and they don't know the difference about on or off trail.

Unless dogs and bears have learned to wipe with toilet paper, it was definitely human

 

[Chip]

The heavy use trails have privies in the middle of the hike, and restrooms at the top and bottom. I don't think your numbers add up.

Maybe not. If everyone out there is as conscientious as the poll indicates it's not a problem. My point though is what harm would it do to encourage bagging in general ? What's widely accepted on certain mountains is unheard of on others. I guess the issue becomes "the bag" and how to dispose of it. I'm sure the AMC doesn't want a couple hundred hikers flushing or dropping off the bag every day. I have my own septic system which gets flushed out every few years, so if I want to flush the degradable bags after a trip, that's my choice. I like bagging as it eliminates the hassel associated with frozen ground, traveling above treeline and wandering around off trail to dig and fill holes.

 

[sierra]

I go in the morning, once in all my years, I had to do an emergency dump on the gulfside, just went off trail and covered it with rocks, Ive carried alot of crap in my years but refuse to pack crap, period, I trust mother nature to eventually take care of it.

 

[David Metsky]

Maybe not. If everyone out there is as conscientious as the poll indicates it's not a problem. My point though is what harm would it do to encourage bagging in general?

Because it's not needed and most folks won't do it.

There's no point putting regulations in place that are going to be ignored; it'll make getting people to follow needed regulations (don't trample the alpine tundra) harder to enforce if casual hikers think the rules are silly. Once people have a healthy disrespect for one regulation, it's pretty easy to ignore more of them. The general public simply isn't going to bag their poop no matter how you ask. And, in general, they don't need to because there are outhouses and toilets available at 4 different locations, 5 if you count Harvard Cabin.

On a mountain like Denali where a) it's really needed, b) the audience is generally sympathetic to the idea, c) and enforcement is fairly straightforward it makes sense. On Mt Washington it doesn't make sense because 1) it's not needed, 2) the general hiking public would laugh at the idea, 3) enforcement is non-existent.

 

[Chip]

On Mt Washington it doesn't make sense because 1) it's not needed, 2) the general hiking public would laugh at the idea, 3) enforcement is non-existent.

UNCLE !!! okay ! I get it ! It's not needed on the eastern slope of Washington ! Are you mental ??? Get the net ! Asssphinctersezwhat ???

How about if I just decide it's a good practice for me and mine...except on the east side of MW...but many other places, and we'll let this one die, or at least degrade. But perhaps it's done that already.

 

[Craig]

...My point though is what harm would it do to encourage bagging in general ? ...

None..

I think it's heading in that direction, slowly, very slowly.
Because it's not perceived as a problem yet there will be little effort, in the way of education, put into this issue.
Once it's a perceived as a problem, then the feds will move to regulate it on public lands.
Probably won't happen in my lifetime tho.

In the meantime threads like this help educate folks.

 

[Paradox]

UNCLE !!! okay ! I get it ! It's not needed on the eastern slope of Washington ! Are you mental ??? Get the net ! Asssphinctersezwhat ???

How about if I just decide it's a good practice for me and mine...except on the east side of MW...but many other places, and we'll let this one die, or at least degrade. But perhaps it's done that already.

If I end up staying at your place again, are you going to insist that I use a blue bag?

 

[Chip]

If I end up staying at your place again, are you going to insist that I use a blue bag?

have you looked in your back pack recently ?

 

[SAR-EMT40]

I'll start bagging my s**t when the bears and moose start doing it.

It is biodegradable and as natural as, well, s**t. No need to bag it out. Ain't gonna do it, nope, not here. Maybe in caves and the desert but not most anywhere else.

Keith

 

[Dr. Dasypodidae]

It's been mentioned one or twice in this thread... What happens to the plastic bag after you "toss" it? Where I live we can recycle the plastic bags you get at the market (I believe they make fleece from them) but I think they'd get really mad if the plastic bag you tossed in the recycling bin wasn't quite empty.

If you toss it ends up in a landfill or incinerator. Are there biodegradable blue bags???

Tossing human waste (or waste-coated plastic bags) into trash that ends up in landfills is also a real problem for groundwater contamination, same as for dispoable diapers since the 1970s. I suppose that tossing human waste into trash that is going to an incinerator is a lesser problem, but human waste (or waste-coated plastic bags or disposable diapers) really should be treated in a sewage processing plant, which technology has not yet resolved (i.e., plastic bags and disposable diapers would clog up pumps, pipes, digesters, etc.).

http://www.ecomall.com/greenshopping/diaper2z.htm

It seems to me that soil microbes on the forest floor are a safer way to dispose of human waste in the summer, with the paper getting burned or carried out to be discarded in a toilet and not the trash. Wintertime and rock and ice routes are obviously more problematic, so time to keep a tight sphincter.

 

[Paradox]

have you looked in your back pack recently ?

Dear Chip (aka "Ol' Bluebags"),

Please don't extend your feces fetish to my luggage.

Sincerely,
Paradox

 

[dentonfabrics]

I'll start bagging my s**t when the bears and moose start doing it.

Keith

Agreed. Felix Unger might use the blue bag. I'm Oscar Madison.