It's time for a family tent...

[spencer]

So, we own several backpacking and winter tents but the time has come for something a bit more spacious to accommodate two adults and a toddler (plus maybe another one someday).

I've done some looking online at the usual stores but I could use some advice. It seems like you need to decide between a full-blown car camping tent, many of which are ~ 15 pounds packed but give excellent head room, multiple rooms, etc, and a glorified backpacking tent that comes in under 10 pounds but lacks features and head room. Last summer we borrowed a wicked cheap family tent that I could stand up in as we rocked our then 4-month old to sleep. That was kind of nice and now I'm wondering if I need a tent I can stand up in. That tent worked fine but didn't have very good fly coverage (we got lucky and it didn't really rain) and I wouldn't expect its poor quality to last for very many trips.

We'll likely be using this tent for canoe camping, car camping and perhaps some backpacking. I'm not a weight weenie but I'm not sure I want to carry 15 pounds of tent around. I'm hoping not to spend more than $350 but would if the features were just right. Fully enclosed with mesh (bug protection) and a full coverage fly are musts.

So far, I like the features and design of the Sierra Designs Wu Hu Annex (4+2) but it's more than I want to spend and is 18 pounds. The REI Hobitat 4 seems pretty good, too but again, it's 15 pounds. Also, the REI Kingdom 4 looks pretty good. I like the idea of the 2nd room, either for gear or for a separate area for the kid(s) as they get older. Will this force me into the >15 pound category? Has anyone backpacked with a 15 pound tent?

Okay, please discuss...

 

[BF]

I would recommend the REI Taj 3. We’ve been using it for about 8 years for a family of three. Our boy was about 7 when we started using it. We have also used this tent for three adults and still have room for gear and stuff. It has two doors and two vestibules. My only complaint is that the two vestibules could be larger. This tent has stood up to some gusty wind driven rain more than a few times and has stayed dry and comfortable. The tent is 7.5 lbs making it quite manageable for backpacking. We also use it for car camping for just the two of us, leaving plenty of room for us and all our gear. It is available on line. Good luck in your search.
Jay

 

[Early Bird]

I think I'm in a similar boat. We recently have bought two new tents in order to accommodate our now 2 year old and a continued active lifestyle.

Last year, we got the REI Camp Done 2. This we used for backpacking trips. It is just over 5 lbs. and fits three of us very well. Weight was important to me, so there isn't a ton of space. If your family may grow this one won't work. The first time we camped with our daughter, we had to "Ergo" her to sleep, walk around with her in our child carrier until she fell asleep and then we transfered her to the tent. The next 2-3 times, she was able to go in the tent on her own after her bedtime routine and fall asleep on her own. We joined her at our bedtime, moving her to down by our feet. Not expensive was also important since I already had a couple of other tents. Other than that we just wanted two doors. http://www.rei.com/product/731378/rei-camp-dome-2-tent

This year we bought the Mountain Hardwear Habitat 3 specifically for car camping trips. It's super roomy and we can almost stand in it. But at 8+ lbs, we aren't carrying this up and over mountains, at least not while I am carrying our kid. I've set it up in our living room so far, but will use it for the first time camping this first weekend in June. PM me if you want to know how it goes.http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=mountain+hardwear+habitat+3&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=8587034392559943081&sa=X&ei=YF_cTbbIKoassAOO7v22Dg&ved=0CFsQ8wIwAA&biw=1280&bih=685#

I don't know what kind of features you are looking for, but hope this helps. I've always been a bit of a minimalist when it comes to backpacking. Good luck, congrats, and cool that you are still getting out there with your kid.

 

[pudgy_groundhog]

15 lbs seems like an awful lot to carry until your kid is old enough to hike/backpack on his own (and even then that is really heavy!). We did our first backpacking trip with our daughter last summer (she was 2.5). She couldn't do the full hike on her own and because I had to carry her, Steve had to carry all the gear (his pack was 60-70 lbs and we packed pretty light and conservative! the plus though was it was actually one time I could keep up with Steve ). We use a Black Diamond tent (the three season, three person Skylight) that we had before our daughter was born. I can see space being tight in a few years and we might have to get something bigger (but we're more concerned with weight than a roomy tent right now).

I can definitely see the advantage of two doors (we have an older REI dome tent that we got a lot of good use out of, but it's more or less been retired).

I'm curious to see what tents other people use for backpacking.

 

[Chip]

I know they're not popular, and I don't know why, but I've had excellent luck with inexpensive Kelty tents. At just over 10 pounds I'd consider the Trail Ridge. Seems to be a good compromise of room and weight.

But, yeah, generally it's one or the other.

Congrats on the family camping thing. I know it's cliche, but enjoy it, it happens too quickly, but you and they will never forget it.

 

[Aviarome]

I went through a similar search last fall for a tent. You'll be hard pressed to find a lightweight tent that you can actually stand up in. Narrowing it down to full fly and good head clearance limited the selection tremendously, and the weight to >15 pounds. I think that most tents with an interior height of >66" were really 6person tents.

I think you'll have to sacrifice either lightweight or interior height. Thus, you'll probably have to get a basecamping tent or a backpacking tent. Either way, the prices of the tents seem to be very expensive nowadays.

I ended up buying a basecamping tent: Big Agnes Flying Diamond 6, but had to wait/search for a long time to find it cheap enough. Of course I wish it wasn't so heavy, and big. But living inside it was great. Spacious, great ventilation, and you didn't have to crawl through the vestibule to get inside.

When the time comes, I'm considering a Big Agnes Copper Spur UL4, or a Sierra Designs Lightning XT4 for backpacking with the family. Weight is specifically important, because I know I'll have to carry everything. Neither comes cheap, but hoping I can find it used or heavily discounted. Of course, maybe by then new models will have come out that will be cheaper and lighter! If you expand the search for slightly heavier tents, there are many 4p tents in the 8-9 pound range. Still, that is pretty heavy for me, although I probably could just lose 10 pounds off my waistline to make it a draw. . .

BTW, I've seen the SD Wu Hu 4+2 for over 40% off, and was my second choice vs the Big Agnes.

 

[ADKdremn]

I agree with Chip....I'm a fan of Kelty. They always seem to have just the right mix of features with a price that's hard to pass up.

I was also recently impressed with the Mountain Hardwear family camping tents, but a bit pricey for me.

How about LL Bean?? They've got quite a few options and you really can't beat that lifetime guarantee. (i'm a new employee)

 

[Bill and Sheep]

I have the REI Hobitat and it's a fantastic tent. I use it for car camping and I imagine it would be quite bulky to carry. The sucker certainly doesn't pack down small. So I can't say I'd recommend this for anything not right out of the car. But, if you're looking for a roomy, easy to set up tent for car camping, you can't go wrong with this model.

 

[DSettahr]

How about LL Bean?? They've got quite a few options and you really can't beat that lifetime guarantee. (i'm a new employee)

LL Bean makes some decent stuff, and their warranty and customer service is great, but overall, when it comes to quality, you can do better. Their target audience really doesn't seem like it's the serious outdoor enthusiast, but rather the novice outdoorsman who only heads into the woods a few times a year.

Every piece of outdoor gear I've gotten that was made by LL Bean has worked pretty well for me, but never so great that I'd buy it again. I think it's because they sometimes are willing to sacrifice some of the function in exchange for extra form.

Your best bet with LL Bean is to purchase something they didn't make through their store, since you can still take advantage of their customer service that way.

The Acadia Tent looks like it might fit some of the requirements spencer is looking for, though.

 

[NewHampshire]

Actually I have had wonderful luck with LL Bean gear. I am on a second pair of Cresta boots (the first pair had about 3000 miles on them and are actually still serviceable) and my winter backpack is made by LL Bean (and should it ever give up the ghost I would buy another in a heartbeat). I also own the LL Bean King Pine Dome tent (6 person version) and LOVE it. Alas it is about 29 pounds and thus probably not what Spencer is looking for.

Brian

 

[ExploreTheEast]

I'm with Aviarome- Big Agnes Copper Spur UL4. It's ridiculously light, roomy enough for 3 adults and a kid, and really well made (I used the Copper Spur UL3 on at least a half dozen trips last year). However, I'd only get it if you're definitely going to do some backpacking with it, because it's $479 (for REI members, over the next week). At that price, I wouldn't classify it as something that make sense if you're only going to take it out once a year.

If you're going to do 99% car/canoe camping, I think the Kingdom 4 is a great choice. I bought the Kingdom 6 with my dividend this year, so I haven't used it yet, but these are obviously not backpacking tents. Not just from a weight perspective, but I wouldn't want to test the Kingdom in a wind-exposed mountainous setting, because I'm 50/50 on whether or not it would survive. Lower elevations (rivers) and campgrounds that are car accessible? That's what I bought it for!

I'd say ditch the "have your cake and eat it too" plan- buy a car camping tent. If you occasionally need a larger backpacking tent a couple years down the line, borrow one from someone.

--Mark

 

[BorealChickadee]

Go with two separate tents.
It's the only way you'll ever really be happy.

For thirty years I used the Eureka Timberline basecamp 6 person for car camping. It is an awesome tent that I can set up alone in 3 minutes flat. Five minutes in the dark without a light. Time me. I've done it. You can stand up and with the center ridgeline I can always find at least one spot to place the tent where branches do not brush the tent.

Last fall I decided I wanted a little more luxury during bug season and picked up the LLBean King Pine 4 person with the attached screen room. That one is for lazy days when I want to sit and relax, read, and just enjoy being outdoors. Will be trying this one soon and am looking forward to the luxury of car camping with a chair, screen room and a good book.

I also have a very light aluminum frame folding cot for camping. In under five minutes I have the tent up, cot up and sleeping bag fluffed. I spoil myself silly and enjoy every minute of it. Got the cot in Bean's over 30 years ago. They don't have anything like it now.

Incidentally my first Timberline 6 was bought in the LLBean main store under the Bean label and manufactured by Eureka. That's back when the main store was just an upstairs room. It lasted 3 decades before I had to replace it. Without a second thought I bought another Timberline 6, this time an Outfitter model with the heavier floor. Wonderful tent. I picked up the King Pine only because I enjoy tenting in the Moose River Plains and it's always bug season there.

 

[Quietman]

I agree with a separate tent for car camping.

For car camping I've stuck with a cheaper cabin tent and cover it with a tarp for complete water proofing. I have used this setup for 10+ years with the same tent that cost approx. $100.

Webshots is being stupid and won't let me link to a larger image so it is attached.

 

[ADKdremn]

In the past I defintely agreed with this statement and your observations. I was very hesitant to even consider the Bean. Plus, it's just not cool cuz you definitely don't look hardcore enough sportin Bean on the trails!

However, over the past few years I've been buying more and more stuff from them for a few different reasons. The first reason....all the "cool" outdoor stores in my area closed, such as EMS and couple small privately owned places. I would have to drive an hour plus to EMS or REI. So, I slowly/hesitantly started checking out Bean.
Secondly...I kept getting gift cards there during the holidays or birthdays and had to spend them on something.
Thirdly...I was impressed with the quality of the things I was getting and that always kept me going back. I started off with baselayers, socks, gloves, etc. I bought your usual down jacket there that was on many a winter trip....loved it! The other year, I replaced that with a primaloft jacket that has a hood, packs better and is more of a technical jacket. Extremely impressed with it. When I was in the market for a softshell Bean was the first place I checked. The only reason I didn't buy there was none of their models had a hood, however, the newer ones do. I own their Day Trekker backpack that has been the best day pack I've owned. I've used it a few times in winter, but mostly gets used in the other season. For next winter, I'm going to purchase their Bigelow pack which is highly rated by Backpacker and won the bargain of the year or some such award in their gear guide.
And...with an employee discount I think I'll be buying more!

Slowly, I think SOME of their stuff is being aimed more to the hardcore hiker. They recently introduced a line of lightweight packs, tents and sleeping bags. I don't own any of it, but it's pretty nice. Probably not as light as some stuff out there.

All that to say...I think they're trying. I'm only working there part time for a few weeks now, but I have been very impressed with the atmosphere and company. You can't beat getting paid to talk to people about what you love!!

Sorry Spencer that this post is a total thread drift!!

LL Bean makes some decent stuff, and their warranty and customer service is great, but overall, when it comes to quality, you can do better. Their target audience really doesn't seem like it's the serious outdoor enthusiast, but rather the novice outdoorsman who only heads into the woods a few times a year.

Every piece of outdoor gear I've gotten that was made by LL Bean has worked pretty well for me, but never so great that I'd buy it again. I think it's because they sometimes are willing to sacrifice some of the function in exchange for extra form.

Your best bet with LL Bean is to purchase something they didn't make through their store, since you can still take advantage of their customer service that way.

The Acadia Tent looks like it might fit some of the requirements spencer is looking for, though.

 

[hikerbrian]

LL Bean makes some decent stuff, and their warranty and customer service is great, but overall, when it comes to quality, you can do better.

I've had two car-camping tents from Bean and they have been absolutely bomber (I have had MSR, EMS, Marmot and REI brand backpacking tents over the past 10 yrs to compare). They weigh a lot and I would not backpack with them, but the quality has been amazing. They've outlasted all of my other tents. I currently own one of their 6-person tents, have had it for 17 years, 17 YEARS! and it looks like the day I bought it. When it's driving rain, I have no worries. I expect to have it for at least another 10 years.

 

[spencer]

Okay, I've given up on the notion of having my cake and eating it, too. We have a really nice Sierra Designs 3-person backpacking tent that will work very well when weight matters and space does not. I've had three adults in it with no problem before so I guess I don't really need my family tent to be backpackable.

So, now I'm trying to decide between the REI Hobitat 4 (with the full vestibule or maybe the Garage), REI Kingdom 4 (with the full vestibule), or the Sierra Designs Wu Hu Annex 4+2. I won't be able to stand up in any of these but I guess I'm okay with that. It was nice when "Ergo'ing" the baby to sleep, as Early Bird said, but those days are behind us (for now).

After you buy the necessary vestibules and with the current REI member discount, they are all within reasonable price range of each other. I'm a bit worried the Wu Hu will be too big for some places we camp.

Anyone have direct experience with any of these? If so, here are a few specific questions:

1. In the Kingdom, does the wall divide the tent in half or are the sides unequal? If the former, can two adults really sleep comfortably in each half and still have room for some gear? Explore the East, what do you think (can three sleep in each half of your 6'er)?
2. There are some reviews of the two REI tents that imply the rainfly does not go far enough down toward the ground, letting some splashing rain in the mesh. Is this a real problem on either of the REI tents? I've had this happen with a couple of other tents we own, if they are not pitched perfectly and it's very annoying.
3. Is the extra vestibule (not the Garage) on the Hobitat useful or is it too small to be of much use for covering gear, getting in and out of the tent dry, etc? Bill (or Sheep), what do you think?

 

[DSettahr]

Spencer: The Hobitat 4 is currently 23% off at REI.com. If you get it on sale, it's by far the cheapest of the three. It's also the lightest (although not by much), but more importantly, it looks like it's the simplest. A few draw backs- the lack of rainfly coverage looks like it could be an issue. Both of the other tents you list seem to have better rainfly coverage. Also, I noticed that someone in one of the reviews said that the mesh on the Hobitat 4 does not keep no-seeums out. This is definitely a consideration.

Slowly, I think SOME of their stuff is being aimed more to the hardcore hiker. They recently introduced a line of lightweight packs, tents and sleeping bags. I don't own any of it, but it's pretty nice. Probably not as light as some stuff out there.

All that to say...I think they're trying.

Oh, I agree. Like I said, they do make some pretty decent quality stuff. And in terms of bang for your buck, you usually certainly can't find better value for what you're paying for. And if you're car camping, their gear is excellent.

But when you work in the woods, I've found that LL Bean gear simply just doesn't hold up that well. Packs, boots, rain gear, etc., aren't as comfortable or functional as other brands, and wear out more quickly. (I'm talking about 2-3 months straight during the summer of being in the woods 5 days a week for work, plus, of course, hiking for my own enjoyment on my days off.)

 

[Bill and Sheep]

3. Is the extra vestibule (not the Garage) on the Hobitat useful or is it too small to be of much use for covering gear, getting in and out of the tent dry, etc? Bill (or Sheep), what do you think?

I've never used the extra vestibule on my Hobitat. I generally use that tent when I'm camped for a few days and going out on dayhikes, so I have never had any need to set that up as I'm usually sleeping or off hiking. From what I can remember, it seemed pretty insignificant so I suspect it might be ok to keep dry but wouldn't have much space to store gear. But I could be wrong on that as I've never used it.

 

[ExploreTheEast]

1. In the Kingdom, does the wall divide the tent in half or are the sides unequal? If the former, can two adults really sleep comfortably in each half and still have room for some gear? Explore the East, what do you think (can three sleep in each half of your 6'er)?

Spencer, three can definitely sleep in each half of the Kingdom 6 (and it is cut in half down the middle). The thing is gigantic. I would say if it was three people that are my size (6' 1" and 220 lbs), you'd still have more room than a normal backpacking tent (I've owned a Sierra Designs Flashlight 3 before, and there is far more floorspace on one side of the Kingdom 6). Also- I can stand up in the Kingdom 6, but the Kingdom 4 is shorter, but it's not that much shorter. I'm guessing you can still stand in it, but it's just not something you'd want to do for more than 5 mins at a time.

Regarding the rainfly- I haven't actually been out in it yet, so I can't say. It looks to me like that's not an issue though. Here's a pic of it set up in my living room (what can I say- I was excited!), and the mesh is up pretty high off the ground...

 

[spencer]

thanks everyone. We ended up with a Kingdom 4 with the added vestibule. I think it will work very well for us, although our first trip with it isn't for a couple more weeks.