Lessons, Rentals & Try-b4-Buy

[--M.]

==Where can a skier get Telemark lessons?

==For those places offering rentals, have you had experience with any which offer Telemark equipment? Have you ever then bought what you rented?

For example, Wachusett Mountain offers downhill lessons only (or so their phone rep just said).

Could one get a decent Tele lesson at Waterville Valley? Jackson? Anywhere south of the NH border?

Ward Hill?

Thanks,

--Mike

 

[adktyler]

As far as where you can get lessons, EMS offers some: http://www.emsski.com/index.html

 

[zman]

Check out New England Telemark-
they have great fesitvals with rental and grp lesson packages- great instructors and lessons

http://netelemark.com/page1.htm

I did this for a few years when I was crossing over from alpine to tele- I also took some midweek private lessons @ Cannon Mtn (they were cheaper during mid week)

 

[--M.]

Pretty much exactly what I was looking for. Thanks!

Any further beta sincerely appreciated. For example, at which northern NH Nordic spot does one find they speak Tele more than at any other? Does the lift line for the Sherburne Trail start at Joe Dodge Lodge? Just kidding about that part (I know where it starts, duh).

Thanks!

 

[DougPaul]

Wildcat gives Tele lessons.

Doug

 

[bignslow]

I took my first (only) tele lesson at Mad River Glen. The lesson was great but their beginner terrain was non-existent. I'm also just learning Tele (8 yrs snowboarding, to 1.5 yrs alpine, to tele) and I love it.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Waterville has offered them in the past.

Tim

 

[--M.]

Great stuff; thanks again. I think that Wachusett option is looking attractive.

Do the rental areas at these places tend toward heavy (full) Tele set-ups (heavy plastic boots & down-mountain bindings); or more toward the lighter side, with transitional gear that glides as well as carves? Have you ever bought something because you rented it first? Seems a stretch for it all to align neatly like that.

Do most Tele skiers use lift-served areas only when they can't get their fill of true backcountry? Isn't Tele more about the whole mountain than just the down-hill part of it? Have you tried gliding in a Tele set-up? Just a tad slow.

I want to use Tele turn expertise to ski the whole thing, not necessarily for slide or lift-served areas.

 

[zman]

Great stuff; thanks again. I think that Wachusett option is looking attractive.

Do the rental areas at these places tend toward heavy (full) Tele set-ups (heavy plastic boots & down-mountain bindings); or more toward the lighter side, with transitional gear that glides as well as carves? Have you ever bought something because you rented it first? Seems a stretch for it all to align neatly like that.

Do most Tele skiers use lift-served areas only when they can't get their fill of true backcountry? Isn't Tele more about the whole mountain than just the down-hill part of it? Have you tried gliding in a Tele set-up? Just a tad slow.

I want to use Tele turn expertise to ski the whole thing, not necessarily for slide or lift-served areas.

My experience is that rentals are "full tele setups".
My friend bought a pair of Atomics that he rented and loves them (they didn't have my size so I ened up with a pair of K2)

Tele skis are not really made to "glide" since it is difficult to get much "kick " out of them like you do with nordic skis which you wax or have fishs cale bottoms.

I'm still practicing my tele turns on lift served runs and have skinned up ( can't glide very easily with skins) to a few hills to ski down- I am currently looking at backcountry setups to be able to glide up then ski down with a fair amount of control.

 

[DougPaul]

Tele skis are not really made to "glide" since it is difficult to get much "kick " out of them like you do with nordic skis which you wax or have fishs cale bottoms.

Huh?
Tele skis are designed to glide and turn.

All you have to do is put the proper XC waxes* on the bases and Tele skis will kick and glide. (The bases are made of the same materials as are XC and BC skis.) Modern Tele rigs are heavy and the kick and glide isn't terribly efficient, but it works.

* Tele skis don't generally have fish scales.

When skiing Moosilauke via Ravine Lodge, I use XC waxes on the (low angle) road, put on the skins, climb the steep part, pop the skins, ski down, and, if need be, refresh the XC waxes for road back out.

Doug

 

[David Metsky]

Wachuset has about a dozen pairs of skis and some limited instruction. MRG, Wildcat, Sugarbush, and Sunday River have good tele rentals and instruction. Ski areas rent full blown tele gear, not backcountry.

NET is a great place to start. A festival ticket gets you demos and instruction. Keep in mind that demos are only for 2 hours, if you want to ski all day you'll want to rent gear. I always demo gear before I buy, and you get lots of options at a festival. NATO runs the MRG telemark festival which is much bigger and lots of fun, but the instruction generally has too many people to be really useful, IMO.

I tour on the same gear I lift ski, but I tour for turns so I'm climbing generally large slopes like Tuckerman, Gulf of Slides, etc.

MRG has fine beginner slopes at Birdland - it's a great place to learn.

 

[zman]

I stand corrected

Huh?
Tele skis are designed to glide and turn.

All you have to do is put the proper XC waxes* on the bases and Tele skis will kick and glide. (The bases are made of the same materials as are XC and BC skis.) Modern Tele rigs are heavy and the kick and glide isn't terribly efficient, but it works.


Doug

Doug, they do glide, but in my experience they are heavy and tiring and not very efficient for touring, especially for longer days out when I am not simply climbing to get turns-

I am actually looking for something between my K2 skis/ Scarpa T2 boots setup and my metal edged, nordic style cross country skis with SNS boots & bindings.
Specifically, I'm wondering about a three pin cable binding with either the Garmont excursion or a Alpina BC 2075 boot on a Rebound Crown ski-

Doug, Dave and others- any experience/opinions with this type of "tweener" setup for easier touring with the ability to carve turns on moderate hills??

Thanks for any input

Marty

 

[--M.]

Thanks everyone.

It seems the try-b4-buy concept really applies to the festivals, unless you just happen to match well with the rental gear at list-served spots.

Personally, I'm more lightweight than heavy. I have tried the Tele route
==Karhu 10th Mt;
==Voile Cable 3-pin (sans actual cable);
==Garmont Excursion
on the Sherburne and Wildcat Valley Trails: perfect.

But the Wildcat Trail illustrates the problem: when the steep ran out, the work really began. I used this set-up for bc with friends in the 'DAKs and was left in the dust. Maybe glide wax woulda helped.

This year, I have replaced ten-year old NNN gear with this:
==Fischer Silent Spider (long, thin, edged);
==Voile Mountaineer 3-pin;
==Alpina 1575.

Hopefully, this will help dial in the right balance of beef & finesse, and allow mixing set-ups. (Too many formats! Everyone wants you to use NNN-BC.)

I may earn the Gulf of Slides, but I'll never go over the top of Tuck's. It just won't happen, and it would be silly to overdo the gear for something I'll never do.

Thanks again for the info: Wachusett for a lesson; MRG, Wildcat or Cannon to work it out; and a festival (not a rental place) for trying new gear.

 

[David Metsky]

Specifically, I'm wondering about a three pin cable binding with either the Garmont excursion or a Alpina BC 2075 boot on a Rebound Crown ski-

Doug, Dave and others- any experience/opinions with this type of "tweener" setup for easier touring with the ability to carve turns on moderate hills??

Sure. I have Excursions and 3-pin cables on my Outtabounds. You can tour and turn on them, they work quite well. I've used them on several trips but I generally go with my big tele gear (which keeps getting lighter in weight) because I'm headed to places that benefit from them. You can easily do something like Moosilauke Carriage Road on the Outtas but if you encounter bad snow conditions the heavier gear is worth the weight.

 

[DrewKnight]

Waterville has offered them in the past.

Mike, Waterville does still offer telemark lessons, if you end up up this way. There are several good tele instructors at WV, including Dutch, Bjorn, Clarence, or Bill Powell. I don't know Dutch or Bjorn, but Clarence and Bill are friends -- good teachers and good guys to ski with.

Lessons are only available as privates or semi-privates, no group lessons.

Rentals are available at the Cross Country Center in Town Square - but call ahead, not sure what the equipment is or how much they have.

<Info courtesy MFurgal64, who's a primo downhill instructor at WV and an occasional lurker here>

 

[--M.]

Hey DrewKnight, thanks for the info. I was thinking of WV for this, but really (and this shows my bias), from the Nordic side, envisioning a lesson happening up on Tripyramid somewhere, rather than on the slopes of Tecumseh. I have to get my head back to the old downhill days in order to truly master technique. And THEN I can go looking for fire warden's trails and secret stashes.

When I was on downhill skis, I could "ski" anything. I just couldn't do it artfully. Skinny skis taught me how to ski with more weight-shift and (hopefully) a little more grace. Putting the edge back in it tends to bring out bad habits and I can sometimes ski like a gorilla.

WV is certainly closer than Pinkham Notch or even Cannon, and maybe I can learn something on Tecumseh and then take it out on Snow's.

Thanks again for the info.

 

[DrewKnight]

When I was on downhill skis, I could "ski" anything. I just couldn't do it artfully. Skinny skis taught me how to ski with more weight-shift and (hopefully) a little more grace. Putting the edge back in it tends to bring out bad habits and I can sometimes ski like a gorilla.

It's funny you say that... I have gotten to a point where I can ski almost anything, somewhat artfully (though this is a subject of considerable debate) on downhill skis, but I hadn't been on cross country skis in... um... ashamed to say, 25 years, till last Saturday night, when we went out by headlamp with a group of friends. We only went up Tripoli Road and into the North End of the WV network a little ways, but all the way up, I was thinking about how fast I roll on the same trails in the summer on my mountain bike - and honestly, I was abjectly terrified of coming back down.

When we turned around and headed back, I went first, figuring at least there would be a crew of people behind me to recover the wreckage. I bopped out of the track and into an excessively cautious snow-plow down the first small hill (or so I thought -- these were not bright headlamps)... actually warned one of my friends, "Watch out, steeper hill coming!" Of course, we were already at the bottom! I guess it wasn't as hard as I remembered.

 

[DougPaul]

Doug, they do glide, but in my experience they are heavy and tiring and not very efficient for touring, especially for longer days out when I am not simply climbing to get turns-

Sure. I'd never chose the tele gear for a pure tour, but as noted, they can be used in "tour mode" to access steeper terrain. I typically use T3 boots for mixed trips--if I loosen the upper they give me enough ankle flexibility. (Considerably more than my T2s would.)

I am actually looking for something between my K2 skis/ Scarpa T2 boots setup and my metal edged, nordic style cross country skis with SNS boots & bindings.
Specifically, I'm wondering about a three pin cable binding with either the Garmont excursion or a Alpina BC 2075 boot on a Rebound Crown ski-

Doug, Dave and others- any experience/opinions with this type of "tweener" setup for easier touring with the ability to carve turns on moderate hills??

I have "tweener" gear, but it is no longer available and I'm afraid that I'm not up on the current models. All of my skis and boots are 3-pin so I can mix and match as needed. Dave.m's BC skiing page might have some useful info: http://home.comcast.net/~pinnah/DirtbagPinner/dirtbag.html.

Doug

 

[--M.]

I bopped out of the track and into an excessively cautious snow-plow down the first small hill (or so I thought -- these were not bright headlamps)... actually warned one of my friends, "Watch out, steeper hill coming!" Of course, we were already at the bottom! I guess it wasn't as hard as I remembered.

Yeah, but eating trees really blows! Gotta walk before they make you run, right?