Lost Hiker??

[Waumbek]

With all due respect, but where do you get this information? Is this experience, if so where and for what? Because everything that I have learned/experienced with suicides contradicts most of your statement. Again with respect, because I am curious.

The authority in this field is William Syrotuck, whose Analysis of Lost Person Behavior is a classic. The profiles that Sardog and SAR-EMT refer to accurately summarize Syrotuck's findings. Yes, Syrotuck considers despondents who are also "lost persons," and his data are meant to give searchers a profile of the different categories of lost persons, e.g., children (age specific), hikers, fisherman, hunters, alzheimers patients, etc., and to predict how they got lost and how to find them. For instance, hikers are heavily trail-dependent, of course, but often have poor map and compass skills, so if the trail becomes unclear from missing signs, blowdowns, etc., hikers are likely to have gone missing there. There are certain patterns that hikers will follow to get themselves found again as well. That's true of all the groups Syrotuck describes. Children, for instance, may evade being found for fear of punishment, for fear of the strangers they've been taught to avoid, etc. Searching for children thus involves looking for them hiding under fallen trees, etc. For despondents who are not lost persons, other profiles no doubt exist. The difficult issue is to know whether an apparent despondent fatality is not in fact a hypothermia victim, one who became so disoriented and mentally confused that he or she set up a camp right near a trail rather than walked out.

 

[NH_Mtn_Hiker]

While most everyone seems to have jumped on the suicide bandwagon let's not forget that on the weekend (Jan 21-23, 2005) that Robert Sypek went camping, the Franconia region was setting record low temperatures, in the vicinity of -20 to -25 F.

I've always loved (heavy on the sarcasm) how law enforcement and other agencies always seem to have an excuse ready when they don't have an answer. Just because after losing his job he went camping, that doesn't mean he committed suicide........I lost my job in August of 2001 after becoming partially disabled in a car accident. I was out of work for over 4 years, and in that time I went hiking and camping many many times...and not once did I commit suicide!

 

[SAR-EMT40]

I can speak from both some personal knowledge and anecdotal evidence that I have gathered and had experience with from myself and talking to other EMS members. Also sardog1 and waumbek have given a couple of good references. One (I looked quick) that I didn't see was Ken Hills work on searches which he includes a category of despondent also. This is considered also be a baseline reference for searches.

You are correct though Clown that the research that Ken Hill and others did was based upon looking for despondents during searches and that the despondent needed to actually be searched for. The contacts that I have had with suicides through EMS as opposed to SAR, and again, I agree that these are anecdotal but almost all that were successful were not in bedrooms or bathrooms or in a main building at all. I have been to several attempts in houses but most of these I feel were not true attempts.

If you told me that you have evidence or your anecdotal evidence contradicts the search theory for suicides that are found in houses I wouldn't argue. Of course those wouldn't have been counted in the SAR despondent categories because they wouldn't have had to be searched for.

Seriously though, if your experiences with suicides, not attempts, are different I would be interested in hearing it.

Keith

 

[SAR-EMT40]

While most everyone seems to have jumped on the suicide bandwagon

Like I said. Speculation and I am not convinced, just considering it more likely with what I think I now know. I am pretty sure most of the others are not convinced either but I won't presume to speak for them.

and not once did I commit suicide!

What about attempts? Maybe you’re just not good at it?

Keith

 

[sardog1]

Yes, that's the statistics on Search and Rescue despondents. Those statistics only include SAR and not all suicides. I agree with you that all suicide attempts that occur within the Search and Rescue category can be split into two groups (out of sight and not far) but what for all suicides in general?

edit: What I'm saying is that this is not something that happens all the time. The way it was made to sound as if people go running into the woods to kill themselves and it rarely happens that way. Many more people are found in there closet, garage, bedroom or dove off a bridge/tall building. (sorry for getting morbid on everyone)

The 2001 statistics from the National Violent Injury Statistics System show that while the great majority of actual suicides occured in a residence, 8% of the total occurred in recreational or natural areas. (I haven't been able to find a similar statistic for all attempts.) Whether 8% is "rarely" depends on the signifcance one attaches to that number in relation to the total.

From my perspective (which is biased by my experiences), it seems more than "rarely." Our SAR dog unit will receive suicide callouts at least a couple times a month for cases suspected somewhere in NH or VT. Note that these are only those cases in which the subject has not been found and law enforcement thinks it would be helpful for SAR dog teams to search for them. It's one of the things that I tell would-be handlers to consider, because it's a regular part of the job for us.

And a final note. Anyone familiar with the circumstances of Guy Waterman's suicide will recognize that occasionally the weather is the selected agent. And once the subject is exposed to hypothermia, even an uncertain commitment to the objective can become moot as the brain loses its capacity to function.

 

[forestgnome]

While the discussion here about suicide is educated and informed, and interesting, it seems premature to speculate suicide. Other than losing a job ( in a very strong job market) I don't see any reason. It seems so much more likely that he succumbed to cold temps or heart attack, etc. We will know for sure very soon anyway.

 

[Maddy]

I have been thinking the same thing. There are so many possibilities. He could have sustained an injury and been unable to help himself. Illness is another consideration. Something as simple as the "flu" could have rendered him so weak and in combination with the cold he could have fallen victim to hypothermia.
I wonder how much "survival"gear he had with him most especially food and protection. How experienced was he in the mountains in winter???
One wonders why he even bothered to set up camp if his intent was to die on the mountain.
There are too many unanswered questions.

 

[Dugan]

Has it yet been established that the remains found are indeed those of Sypek?

 

[Waumbek]

Has it yet been established that the remains found are indeed those of Sypek?

Yes, finally.

Article published Jun 13, 2007
Missing man's remains identified, three years after disappearance

FRANCONIA, N.H. (AP) _ Authorities have identified human remains found last year near Franconia Notch as a Carroll man who disappeared in 2004.

The search for Robert Sypek began Feb. 3, 2004, when a passer-by noticed a car covered with snow in Bethlehem, near Mount Garfied and the Gale River trailhead on Route 3. Authorities said it appeared the car had been sitting there for about two weeks, and they weren't sure whether Sypek has been hiking in the area. He lived alone and had no family in the area.

Authorities searched a 50-square-mile area over the next few days but found no sign of Sypek.

In May 2006, a man walking his dog found skeletal remains just north of Franconia Notch, just over a mile from the car. The state medical examiner's office said Wednesday that the remains have been identified as Sypek, but the cause and manner of death remain undetermined.

 

[albee]

Did anyone else notice that SAR searched 50 square miles but didn't find a tent located 100' off of a trail just over a mile from the deceased's car?

Some people had speculated suicide based on proximity to terrain features. Well, was this data considered while conducting the search?

I greatly respect and appreciate all the work done by SAR crews, but out of curiosity I was wondering if there was any kind of post-recovery review and if anything was discussed as to what (if anything) might have been done differently? (This is NOT a criticism, please don't read it that way!)

Thanks.

 

[rocket21]

I'm just reading about this now and it's possible I'm foggy on the timeline, but based upon the snowstorm? it's very possible they missed him. I was involved in a winter search and rescue a few years ago and it's amazing how difficult it can be. Add some fresh snow on top of it, and there's a decent chance you won't find anything until spring. Also, considering it took a year to find the remains, it must have had some obscurity.

That does beg the question, was there any effort to locate the remains that spring?

 

[HAMTERO]

I think maybe they thought that after his car had been there for 2 weeks before they started looking that he was dead. The 50 square miles is just newspaper stuff.