Memory card help

[MichaelJ]

The reformat probably also clears the free block list which will minimize fragmentation.

The reformat doesn't so much clear it as blow it all away and write a new root directory and file allocation table.

Writing 0s everywhere places unnecessary wear-and-tear on a memory card

True, and similar to the reason I reformat instead of doing "delete all"; however, you will need a PC-based utility to do this; simply doing a reformat of the card from the camera will not.

FAT32 is a plenty good enough filesystem for this (and many, many other) kind of device. Just don't push your luck when the battery low warning sounds.

 

[DougPaul]

It's good to be aware of the hard drive "fragility" or reliability issue. I back up the photo files in my computer's on-board hard drive to a second hard drive, and burn the photo files to DVDs. Edited image sets converted from RAW files to JPGs usually are burned to CDs.

CDs have a lot more error correction than DVDs and are therefore more reliable.

All things considered, my digital photo archives probably are better protected from loss than are my film archives. In the latter case, I have original film negatives (or positive transparencies) and selected prints, with almost no dupe transparencies. That probably is living on the edge, speaking archivally.

If you really want safety, make sure that separate copies are in separate locations, eg your (non-home) office and your home. Multiple copies do no good if they are all stored in one building and it burns.

Doug

 

[BorealChickadee]

similar to the reason I reformat instead of doing "delete all"; however, you will need a PC-based utility to do this; simply doing a reformat of the card from the camera will not.

1st Question: I get the drift from all of the abov ediscussion that it would be better if I reformat instead of just delete. And from Michael's comment above it appears that rerformatting by pressing camera buttons is not the same as a PC reformat (whatever that is). Is there a way for me to do this better reformat using the card reader in my printer? Currently, after I upload, while the camra is still plugged itno the computer I press delete pictures and let the computer command the camera to delete my uploaded pictures. I do this every week, since every week I like to get out and take pictures.

2nd Question: EArlier this summer I took a video of a mewing caterpillar.(Yes, I'm not crazy it really did mew every time you touched it). when I tried to upload it the message came up that the camera didn't recognize the format. That just seemed crazy to me since the SD card had never left the camera. I concluded that I must have touched a button and done something bad. Waht the heck was going on there? I finally just deleted it when after several weeks I could never view it or get it off. I was able to view it on the trail on playback so that's why I concluded that I must have messed something up.

Thanks for all the above discussion. I only understand 10% of it but at least I know there's more stuff out there not to assume.

 

[DougPaul]

The reformat probably also clears the free block list which will minimize fragmentation.

The reformat doesn't so much clear it as blow it all away and write a new root directory and file allocation table.

The reformat simply overwrites all filesystem structure info (including the free block list) with new info. This new filesystem and free block list will be empty. The empty free block list will result in new files being written in a way that is easier to recover than if the files were fragmented due to a non-empty free block list.

FAT32 is a plenty good enough filesystem for this (and many, many other) kind of device. Just don't push your luck when the battery low warning sounds.

That was my point--FAT works if nothing goes wrong. A journaled filesystem can recover automatically from certain faults, such as a power failure during file writing.

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

1st Question: I get the drift from all of the abov ediscussion that it would be better if I reformat instead of just delete. And from Michael's comment above it appears that rerformatting by pressing camera buttons is not the same as a PC reformat (whatever that is). Is there a way for me to do this better reformat using the card reader in my printer? Currently, after I upload, while the camra is still plugged itno the computer I press delete pictures and let the computer command the camera to delete my uploaded pictures. I do this every week, since every week I like to get out and take pictures.

In theory, reformatting should be the same, wherever you do it. But a memory card can be formatted in any of several filesystems (eg FAT16, FAT32). If you reformat using the camera, then it should always reformat to whatever filesystem it is happiest with.

2nd Question: EArlier this summer I took a video of a mewing caterpillar.(Yes, I'm not crazy it really did mew every time you touched it). when I tried to upload it the message came up that the camera didn't recognize the format. That just seemed crazy to me since the SD card had never left the camera. I concluded that I must have touched a button and done something bad. Waht the heck was going on there? I finally just deleted it when after several weeks I could never view it or get it off. I was able to view it on the trail on playback so that's why I concluded that I must have messed something up.

Can't tell what happened without more info (which may have been lost by the time you discovered the problem). Perhaps the filesystem (data) on the card became corrupted and the video file was damaged.

At the first hint of ANY problem with a card, pull it and don't write anything on it until you have extracted as many of the desired files as possible. Then reformat. Ideally, test the card before putting it back into service if you have an appropriate test program to determine whether the card itself is defective.

Doug

 

[David Metsky]

Is there a way for me to do this better reformat using the card reader in my printer? Currently, after I upload, while the camra is still plugged itno the computer I press delete pictures and let the computer command the camera to delete my uploaded pictures. I do this every week, since every week I like to get out and take pictures.

Never reformat in the computer. I don't delete using the computer either. Always (always, always) reformat in the camera. It's possible that your computer can write a new file system to the card that your camera can't understand and that card will be useless to you.

Never reformat in the computer.

 

[Grumpy]

CDs have a lot more error correction than DVDs and are therefore more reliable.

If you really want safety, make sure that separate copies are in separate locations, eg your (non-home) office and your home. Multiple copies do no good if they are all stored in one building and it burns.

I am aware that DVDs are not as reliable as CDs. Trouble is, I haven't figured out yet how to copy the contents of a full 4 GB CF card onto a 700 MB CD without losing data to file compression.

As for making multiple copies and storing in separate locations for security: Pretty easy to do with digital media; a lot more difficult to do with traditional film. Dupe transparencies, dupe negatives and prints are better than nothing as backups, I suppose, but are second-best copies.

G.

 

[Grumpy]

Never reformat in the computer. I don't delete using the computer either. Always (always, always) reformat in the camera. It's possible that your computer can write a new file system to the card that your camera can't understand and that card will be useless to you.

Never reformat in the computer.

Dave's advice is exactly in line with what I've been led to believe from conversation with those who know, and through reading about the topic.

I always do my card formatting in the camera.

G.

 

[DougPaul]

I am aware that DVDs are not as reliable as CDs. Trouble is, I haven't figured out yet how to copy the contents of a full 4 GB CF card onto a 700 MB CD without losing data to file compression.

I doubt that any individual photo file is >700MB.
1 4GB CF card -> 6 CDs.

As for making multiple copies and storing in separate locations for security: Pretty easy to do with digital media; a lot more difficult to do with traditional film. Dupe transparencies, dupe negatives and prints are better than nothing as backups, I suppose, but are second-best copies.

You could always do a high-quality scan and then it becomes a digital copy problem... It will probably only take 2 or 3 lifetimes...

Doug

 

[Grumpy]

I doubt that any individual photo file is >700MB.
1 4GB CF card -> 6 CDs.

I virtually never shoot just one photo in a session that is worth archiving. My experience is that I don't always know immediately what will be worth recovering from the files 1-10-20-30-40 years down the road. Hence, I archive the whole shoot, as captured. And hence, the use of DVDs as a storage medium when the shoot produces data in GB quantities. That's the way I operated with film; it's the way I continue to operate with digital images.

This discussion could go on for days. Suffice it to say that if we are concerned about quality and reliability in a system, care needs be taken at every step of the way -- including the earliest (hence the card formatting discussion). How we save our results for the future also require thougthful attention (hence the archiving leg of the discussion). We all find our own way with these things, and hope ours turns out to be an example of "best practice" for our intentions and purposes.

G.

 

[darren]

Agree, always format in the camera. I do not delete photos from the memory card with the computer. I dump all of the photos from the camera to the computer. Once I know I have everything ok on the computer and the camera is disconnected from the computer, then via the camera menu I use the "Format" command to erase everything.

I have had memory cards get hosed twice. Once during a write when the camera batteries died. And once when I was using a card reader to delete photos via computer control.

Chances are the card is still good if you can do the format via the camera. But if you are nervous, then what is $30 for a new card?

Once difference between name brand and no name brand memory cards is read / write speeds. With my SanDisk Ultra II and III cards I can shoot at 5 frames of RAW photos per second (full speed of my D20). With my cheapo PNY cards I can only shoot at 1 or 2 frames a second. Plus if I shoot a test shot and then go to playback mode quick to check my exposure, it takes to long if there is quick action going on. They are unusable for action sports or animal shots. In my mind they are unusable for quick changing stuff like sunsets too. My PNY cards are strickly for emergency use only.

- darren