Mt Colden loop advice needed

[hikerbrian]

Mike P. - We'd read before we arrived that the trailheads in the ADKs in general are full by 5:30 a.m. this year. Crazy. That's why we'd chosen to stick to an itinerary that left from the Loj. We had a reservation at the Heart Lake Wilderness Campground, so we didn't need to arrive pre-dawn at the trailhead, which would have been a challenge with 3 families including 5 kids. We could hike straight from our campsite, and we could stay out as long or as little as we wanted, knowing our car-camp tent was already set up and ready for us. Also, we'd made the reservations last December, when COVID was barely a whisper in the wind. Seems like a lifetime ago. We seriously considered not going, but in the end we decided to try and make it work. I'm glad we went. I understand the ADKs at least a little bit now and would have some idea what to expect in a non-COVID year, should we choose to go back in the future. There's value in that. And we had some special moments - our evening/night hike out of the back country in particular was really strikingly beautiful. We hiked past Avalanche lake in golden hour light. Notably, that evening there were 3 separate rescues, including a helicopter rescue at Marcy Dam, which we caught the tail end of well after dark. It IS a crazy year.

 

[maineguy]

Ok, here are my brief notes. First, amazingly, my toe healed enough to be basically 100% in time for the trip. I can't believe how much pain I was in, for what ultimately was a sprain, and likely a fairly minor one. Wow.

The trip:

Not fond of the welcoming committee on I-87 who called themselves NY's Finest. The flashing red lights were really pretty, but yeah, could have done without the rest of it. Noted.

Overall, the Daks felt a lot like the Whites to me. Subtle differences - more back country lakes, and a bit more slab, at least where we were. Maybe slightly more remote feeling. But largely similar, as one would expect I suppose. Having to rent bear canisters and practice bear country technique is also a hassle. For those reasons, I probably won't spend the 6 hrs of driving each way again to get back there. It is a long, long drive with little or no additional reward beyond what I can get in a 2 hr drive. That said, TCD and Daniel Eagan (and maineguy), your advice and thoughts were spot on. Unfortunately, I didn't have complete control over the itinerary, and Colden and some back country camping in that area were the decisions that were made.

You can't enter the back country from the Loj without first passing through a gauntlet of mini-rangers eager to tell you all about back country regulations. We were informed in no uncertain terms that our group of 9 was too big for a back country trip, and that any 'affiliated' groups over 8 needed to be separated by at least 1 mile at all times. This point was drilled into me sufficiently strongly over a 5-10 minute lecture, replete with an expectation of ranger visits and associated fines, that we split our 3 families up, camping at different spots and hiking largely different itineraries. We'd figured we'd be ok since we'd sent early morning hikers out to get 2 different campsites, but the mini-rangers let us know this was not ok at all. This was a bummer and really changed the nature of the trip, but I understand the spirit of the regulation, and as a rule I don't disrespect local customs when I'm traveling. 'No groups larger than 8' was clearly written on the sign as you enter the back country.

Also written on the sign was 'up to three tents per campsite.' So it was surprising to see >5 tents at EVERY campsite, including sites we'd passed over early in the morning because they were 'full.' Really lovely sights with little signs showing a red line through a tent were all filled with multiple tents. I'm confident rangers came through (read below), so I'm not sure what the rangers did, if anything, to enforce that particular rule. But the selective enforcement of rules was bothersome. It's a weird year though, and perhaps rangers are just doing the best they can.

The mini-rangers also asked us not only whether we were carrying bear canisters, but exactly how many, and what we were storing in there. So it was surprising to see, at Marcy Dam, several bags of food 'hung' in a tree next to a lean to. More surprising still was the gigantic raccoon actively pawing at the bag when we walked by. But the kicker was seeing a large group of people on their way to that lean to - when I let them know a raccoon was trying to get their food, one guy responded, 'He's back already? He got all my food last night and dragged it away...' I'm not sure how they got past the gauntlet of mini-rangers.

We did find a decent, quiet campsite off to the east side of Lake Colden. We set up before dark, as advised by the mini-rangers, and we were the only ones there. Great! Finished dinner, packed everything into cans, marched them well away from camp, and settled in at dark to sleep. Around 9:00, having been asleep for half an hour or so, a REALLY noisy group of hikers, along with what must have been 300 lumen headlamps, showed up, stomping right next to our tent and literally yelling to each other. Finally, I poked my head out and asked, please, could they keep it down a little bit so we could get some sleep. No response. Until about 90 seconds later when a voice materialized right outside my tent, just as I was settling in again, 'Park rangers, how are you doing tonight.' They inquired with some rigor about where and how we were storing our food. Felt more than a little intrusive. Truthfully, I wouldn't have been so bothered by it, except for the blatant disregard of the other 'rules', especially after we'd altered our trip significantly to follow them! Sigh. When we woke up in the morning, there were 4 other tents right in our little campsite. We'd planned to stay in that spot 2 nights but opted to add 6 miles onto our Colden summit day to get out of the back country. At least at our car camp sight we had our own space and wouldn't be woken by rangers.

Avalanche lake was gorgeous, and we stared at Trap Dike the whole time. I was remarking to the boys what a great ice climb that must be; I didn't realize you could climb in the summer too, but that must be a GREAT climb in just about any season except mud season. Nice.

I haven't been up to the Whites this year. I'm sure it's chaos everywhere, and I'm done hiking until the craziness subsides. Not worth it. The scenery was nice, but (as is probably the case with the Whites right now too) not at all what I want out of a backpacking trip. If I'm back in the Daks again, I'll be targeting the remote lakes and smaller peaks. I get the feeling Colden and Marcy are Franconia Ridge and Washington transplanted.

Thanks again for the accurate advice! Even if I was unfortunately not able to follow it. In NH, everyone has to hike Washington and Franconia ridge once. Get it out of the system. I believe I've now done the 'Daks equivalent.

Now I remember why it has been a decade since I was in that area. Glad to hear you made the best of it and had a good time.

 

[Mike P.]

Mike P. - We'd read before we arrived that the trailheads in the ADKs in general are full by 5:30 a.m. this year. Crazy. That's why we'd chosen to stick to an itinerary that left from the Loj. We had a reservation at the Heart Lake Wilderness Campground, so we didn't need to arrive pre-dawn at the trailhead, which would have been a challenge with 3 families including 5 kids. We could hike straight from our campsite, and we could stay out as long or as little as we wanted, knowing our car-camp tent was already set up and ready for us. Also, we'd made the reservations last December, when COVID was barely a whisper in the wind. Seems like a lifetime ago. We seriously considered not going, but in the end we decided to try and make it work. I'm glad we went. I understand the ADKs at least a little bit now and would have some idea what to expect in a non-COVID year, should we choose to go back in the future. There's value in that. And we had some special moments - our evening/night hike out of the back country in particular was really strikingly beautiful. We hiked past Avalanche lake in golden hour light. Notably, that evening there were 3 separate rescues, including a helicopter rescue at Marcy Dam, which we caught the tail end of well after dark. It IS a crazy year.

That's right, I remember now on your campsite, which would have made the canoeing in Heart Lake possible. With a slight road walk, hiking to Mt. Van Hovenberg is a nice hike with some bare ledges offering great views. The Summit is wooded, however, if you go further, you come out on top of the Bobsled run.

 

[jfb]

The biggest issue is over-crowding, and the rangers are doing the best they can with the situation in front of them, short of a nuclear option like limiting the number of people they allow into the back country. So I get that too. Even though I fully understand the situation, it just did not feel good to be intruded on in the way we were intruded on, after we'd found an appropriate and legal campsite, practiced perfect bear technique, and gotten to bed early. I understand why it happened, but it still did not feel good.

I wonder if the ADK folks have considered how the AMC handles backcountry camping in the White Mountains. It seems to me that building clusters of tent platforms, providing bear boxes and outhouses and managing the campsites with caretakers works pretty well and might help reduce the overcrowding problems in the ADKs.

 

[TCD]

That seems like a good idea to me, as well.

As long ago as 2006, after seeing this solution used effectively in Yosemite, I recommended this type of system in writing to our State regulators.

I was told (and you cannot make this stuff up): "Those ideas will never work here. It works out west, but eastern hikers are too stupid to use the facilities correctly, and will just stuff the bear lockers with trash."

I was astounded. We went back and forth for a bit, before I gave up.

This forum has produced many good ideas about how to manage these situations. Almost all of these ideas have been recommended repeatedly, in writing, through the appropriate channels. But in Albany, we are dealing with arrogant, know-it-all bureaucrats, who simply will not listen to suggestions from the unwashed, inferior public.

I'm glad most of my travel is off trail. It's easy for me to avoid crowds. I advocate for better management not for myself, but for folks who would like to come enjoy the area, and for local businesses who need the traffic to survive. The issues described in this thread are an example of how the current poor management degrades what should be a great experience, and makes people reluctant to come back here. This hurts everyone, but it seems to be very hard to fix.

 

[DayTrip]

Stupid question: Isn't back country/ "at large" camping allowed in the Adirondacks below 4,000 ft? Did they get rid of that with COVID? I think I'd rather take a meat tenderizing mallet to my own genitals before staying in a designated backcountry campground in NH or NY this year, or any busy weekend for that matter. The crowds, the noise, the lack of etiquette, the trash, the "toilet hygiene", etc. and that's all before you even contemplate COVID issues. When I backpack I want to be out there on my own and get a little solitude. I can't imagine how irate I would have been if I'd had hikerbrian's experience. I am really hopeful this year's surge in popularity is a temporary phenomenon for the Northeast and not the start of a trend....

 

[skiguy]

I am really hopeful this year's surge in popularity is a temporary phenomenon for the Northeast and not the start of a trend....

The trend has been on an upward swing before this Season. 2020 has only accelerated the process. IMO I don't think you'll see things change very quickly. If anything it is going to get worse as more and more people flee their primary residencies in the cities, relocate in more suburban areas and only get that much closer to the Mountains.

 

[DayTrip]

The trend has been on an upward swing before this Season. 2020 has only accelerated the process. IMO I don't think you'll see things change very quickly. If anything it is going to get worse as more and more people flee their primary residencies in the cities, relocate in more suburban areas and only get that much closer to the Mountains.

Yah I know it has been on the uptick. I see the changes even in the 8 or so years since I started serious hiking. This year has seen an explosion in hiker volume though so I hope it backs off and other distractions capture the minds of some of these people. Even lesser used trails are showing major signs of erosion, braiding, etc. And of course all the littering. That won't be sustainable without more volunteers, more money from the states or access restrictions. I really don't see funding improving at all so the future looks ominous to me. I think we all need to be vocal advocates for the rewarding joy of corn maze puzzles and the affordability of up and coming states like Nebraska.

 

[skiguy]

I think we all need to be vocal advocates for the rewarding joy of corn maze puzzles and the affordability of up and coming states like Nebraska.

Be careful what you suggest. They are already working on a version for North Carolina. Wait until it hits in New Hampshire. All the Social Media sites will be advertising it. Before you know it having a 48 Four Thousand Footer Patch won’t be enough.https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/hikeit/hike-it-smoky-mountain-edition

 

[peakbagger]

The whites lack "mini rangers". If anything the FS is understaffed and appear to have dropped enforcement of some regulations like the 1/4 mile rule.

 

[DayTrip]

The whites lack "mini rangers". If anything the FS is understaffed and appear to have dropped enforcement of some regulations like the 1/4 mile rule.

Couple of weeks ago when I did my pemi loop there were 3 bike packers set up with their tents literally at the end of the bridge over the Pemi leaving Lincoln Woods lot (the official bridge not the one down on the Kanc) on a SAT morning. I think there were three different tents, bright colors, reflective guylines, their bikes, etc. The fruit doesn't get any more low hanging then that. If they didn't get fined by rangers I'd say people are able to go ahead and do whatever they want with zero consequences....

 

[bikehikeskifish]

I've see the "mini rangers" up on Franconia Ridge. Not the most pleasant experience, I will say.

Tim

 

[skiguy]

Couple of weeks ago when I did my pemi loop there were 3 bike packers set up with their tents literally at the end of the bridge over the Pemi leaving Lincoln Woods lot (the official bridge not the one down on the Kanc) on a SAT morning. I think there were three different tents, bright colors, reflective guylines, their bikes, etc. The fruit doesn't get any more low hanging then that. If they didn't get fined by rangers I'd say people are able to go ahead and do whatever they want with zero consequences....

At least they didn't have a wheel barrow full of beer and ice with the intent of heading to Franconia Falls.

 

[JoshandBaron]

Couple of weeks ago when I did my pemi loop there were 3 bike packers set up with their tents literally at the end of the bridge over the Pemi leaving Lincoln Woods lot (the official bridge not the one down on the Kanc) on a SAT morning. I think there were three different tents, bright colors, reflective guylines, their bikes, etc. The fruit doesn't get any more low hanging then that. If they didn't get fined by rangers I'd say people are able to go ahead and do whatever they want with zero consequences....

When I rolled into Livermore a month ago there were people camping on the grass next to the parking lot. I have seen them enforcing things on the East Side Trail a couple times this season.

 

[maineguy]

At least they didn't have a wheel barrow full of beer and ice with the intent of heading to Franconia Falls.

Yeah, I remember seeing groups with coolers slung between poles on their way to Franconia Falls back in the late 60s. Back then the Wilderness Trail parking lot, which held about 6 cars was on the opposite side of the river than the one today. On weekends, cars were lined up for miles on either side of the Kanc.

 

[skiguy]

Yeah, I remember seeing groups with coolers slung between poles on their way to Franconia Falls back in the late 60s. Back then the Wilderness Trail parking lot, which held about 6 cars was on the opposite side of the river than the one today. On weekends, cars were lined up for miles on either side of the Kanc.

Regulations were not as tight then. Camping in parking lots at trailheads was not all that uncommon. Also in those days with the Old Osseo Trailhead was on the way down to Loon. It made sense to park on the road between Lincoln Woods and the Osseo Trail if you were doing a loop.

 

[TEO]

Hikerbrian, I'm grateful that you were good about following the rules, but I think that you made a poor choice, even irresponsible, with your itinerary. Yes, that's harsh, but we on VFTT are aware of the overuse and as educated hikers, we should be doing what we can to alleviate the problem, not make it worse. If we're going to hike and camp on holiday weekends, we should seek out lesser-used destinations. If we need to hike the most popular peaks, then we should be hiking at off-peak times. We'll all have better experiences if we do so.

 

[skiguy]

I think the OP made an excellent effort to better understand and seek out information well over a month ago. I see nothing irresponsible. Not everyone has the luxury of not hiking on weekends and holidays.

 

[TEO]

Skiguy, I absolutely agree with your first and third points. But, we do have a a choice on where we hike on weekends and holidays. We also know and say that one of ways to decrease overuse is to avoid the most popular areas when the crowds will be the greatest, such as on holiday weekends. I'm being hard on Hikerbrian because those of us who are educated and aware of the problem need to be a part of the solution, not further contribute to the problem.

And unfortunately for Hikerbrian, he paid the price with a less than exceptional experience. IMnotsoHO, something is wrong if you don't think that it's worth returning to the Adirondacks.

 

[hikerbrian]

Hikerbrian, I'm grateful that you were good about following the rules, but I think that you made a poor choice, even irresponsible, with your itinerary. Yes, that's harsh, but we on VFTT are aware of the overuse and as educated hikers, we should be doing what we can to alleviate the problem, not make it worse. If we're going to hike and camp on holiday weekends, we should seek out lesser-used destinations. If we need to hike the most popular peaks, then we should be hiking at off-peak times. We'll all have better experiences if we do so.

I hear you, TEO, and I don't mind 'harsh' criticism! I'm a beginner at everything compared to someone somewhere; we all have something to learn.

In a perfect world where I get to make all the choices, and s*** doesn't happen, it's easy to do all of the things you suggest. In this case, I didn't get to make all the choices, and a worldwide pandemic happened. These and other factors impacted my available choices.

More specifically, our reservations at Heart Lake were made last December. No one could have predicted use trends would be so crazy 10 months ago. I might not have picked Heart Lake, myself, even absent the pandemic. I prefer spots that are off the beaten path. But last December, a very good friend of mine said she and another family had made reservations at a campground in the ADKs, right in the middle of the most beautiful part, and would I like to join them? If so, I should make the reservation promptly, since there weren't many spots left. Even with 20/20 hindsight, I don't think it was reckless, frivolous, or irresponsible to make that reservation at that time and sort out the details later. Although it is clear to me now that that area is REALLY crowded, it's not easy to make that assessment from a computer, and other REALLY crowded areas I've been to in the past (Yosemite, the Tetons, Yellowstone, etc.) control the crowds one way or another, either through a permit system or by limiting parking. I don't think it was willfully ignorant on my part to think that the limited number of campsites and the limited number of parking spots at the Loj were both intended as crowd control. If my family had not gone, another one would have taken our spot at the campground. So it's not clear to me how that would have alleviated the crowding issue anyway.

I read a few months ago that parking lots in the ADKs were filling very early, typically by about 6:00 a.m. Since we were locked into our reservation at Heart Lake, we could either hike directly from there, or I could get my family and the two other families, all with young kids, up and out by, say, 5 a.m. and we could take our chances on finding a trailhead that still had parking in some remote area. I don't think that would have been a particularly good plan - I can tell you the staff we interacted with had no earthly idea what they were taking about when we asked for advice about such things. For example, when we asked about the Lake Colden area - and we asked several employees at the Loj - some said as long as we got to Avalanche Lake before dark, we could camp wherever we wanted. Others said we better leave the Loj by 5:30 am Friday morning if we wanted any chance of finding a back country site anywhere. You'll forgive me for not putting much weight in any of the advice we got while there. Given the options, I thought it best for any hiking that we depart directly from the Loj.

Even at that point, Friday morning pretty early, as we were getting on the trail I let the rest of the group know that if it felt too crowded my family would make it a day trip. I wasn't willing to take on really any COVID transmission risk by, say, cooking with several groups of people, and we were perfectly fine turning around and exploring other parts of the park. But as we hiked in, there were many, many open lean-to's and campsites. Marcy Dam, Avalanche Lake, all of them had open spots. So after splitting our group per the ADK volunteers' advice, we opted to camp out in an empty spot as a single family near Avalanche Lake, while the other two families found spots on the south end of Colden Lake. Again, if it had felt crowded at that point, there's no way we would have stayed.

To summarize, I tried to make the best decisions I could of the limited options available, and in hindsight I don't think the decisions I made were particularly bad ones. I could have skipped the trip to the ADKs entirely, and I very nearly did just that. I really only committed when I loaded my family into the car and we started driving. Until then, it was really up in the air, depending on COVID numbers and what I was reading about transmission risks associated with outdoor activities. I don't think keeping our reservation was a terrible idea. Once there, I again made the best decisions I could with the information in front of me, given an unprecedented year and campground employees who had no idea what they were talking about (but acted quite sure of themselves).

If the goal is to limit environmental degradation, then I don't think telling experienced hikers to stay away from crowded areas is a particularly good means of achieving that goal. In the case of the ADK Loj area, where parking capacity is the crowd-limiting factor, all you're going to do is decrease the average skill level of the cohort, which will lead to greater environmental degradation, not less.

I'd further argue that having rangers waking up campers in their tents in the middle of the night is not likely to decrease environmental impact either. Why not shine those amazing headlamps around in the trees and surrounding area, and if things are amiss regarding food storage or whatever, then start going tent to tent? We didn't have to try hard at all to identify egregious impacts, or to identify those responsible for them.

I've been to lots of places that are in pretty high demand and where there is tremendous potential for overuse - the Tetons, Denali, Rainier, North Cascades, Glacier, Mt. Shasta, Yellowstone. I've packed out my own poop on plenty of occasions where that level of LNT is needed. I can't say I've ever been woken up by rangers, or been given the kind of lecture we got at the trailhead from the volunteers. It is possible to manage high-use areas, and frankly I don't think waking people up in the middle of the night is the way to do it.