Mt Tecumseh Elevation Article

[Salty]

I haven't seen any definition of exactly what constitutes the top of the mountain? Barring a flat granite ledge, many summits have natural loose material of unknown depth over ledge.

The County Highpointers define it as the highest naturally occurring spot. So scree, soil, huge boulder or ledge, doesn't matter. Whatever's there at the time, though I think perhaps your point is some summits are naturally unstable in height to some degree.

 

[Rob S]

If you value tradition then why 48 for the Whites?

You're right. I should have said "tradition as known in my lifetime".

 

[skiguy]

For me personally, regardless of actual height, the Catskills will always have 35 peaks, the ADKs 46, and the Whites 48. I value tradition over precision, but would not have any issue with any club changing their list. Like Tecumseh, life is too short, ..... (haha!), and I'd prefer to keep hiking the peaks I want to hike, whether on a list or not.

It’s nice to have lists with rules and all the other fun things created by other people than yourself to follow. It certainly gets you out there and gives you the lay of the land. After more than half of century of hiking and climbing I got accustomed to peaks being listed and delisted as part of the game a long time ago. Whom remembers and or has climbed West Tecumseh? It was on the NE 100 HH at one time but was delisted entirely. At least for Tecumseh even though it is not a 4000 foot Mountain it still is on the 100 HH so it is not totally orphaned.

 

[Daniel Eagan]

I wish the author had not mentioned a 3 foot pile of rocks on top, nor would I advocate taking view pruning of any kind outside of proper channels. It's a slippery slope risking going overboard (case in point: Tecumseh) when individuals decide what's best for everyone else.

And you kids get off my lawn!

The DEC in New York has been dismantling the cairn atop Skylight, where for years tradition called for hikers to bring up rocks to add to it. Summit got to be a mess in recent years. The mountain also grew a couple of feet taller.

 

[skiguy]

The DEC in New York has been dismantling the cairn atop Skylight, where for years tradition called for hikers to bring up rocks to add to it. Summit got to be a mess in recent years. The mountain also grew a couple of feet taller.

I don't think it's being dismantled but Eisenhower in the Southern Presie's has had a somewhat practice of the same tradition. Back in the 70's we all use to joke that people were trying to change it's viewable profile to look like a certain female body part.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

Has the FTFC moved the summit of Owl's Head yet?

Tim

 

[Tom Rankin]

I don't think it's being dismantled but Eisenhower in the Southern Presie's has had a somewhat practice of the same tradition. Back in the 70's we all use to joke that people were trying to change it's viewable profile to look like a certain female body part.

NY has a Nippletop, on the 46'er list. I remember one of my friends, on approaching the summit 'cone', saying 'Looks like we're still on the ***'.

 

[Tom Rankin]

Has the FTFC moved the summit of Owl's Head yet?

Tim

I'll assume that's sarcasm, but does the FTFC ever precisely define any summit location? Or, do all of them have signs now? (It's been a while, but I do have 3 rounds)

 

[Tom Rankin]

The number 48 isn't part of the list, it's been 46 and 47 in the past. There's no need to replace anything. If Hight or Guyot qualify they'll be added in their own right.

I went searching for the 'Like' button for this post. (Some Forums have one! Hint! Hint!)

 

[Tom Rankin]

For me personally, regardless of actual height, the Catskills will always have 35 peaks, the ADKs 46, and the Whites 48. I value tradition over precision, but would not have any issue with any club changing their list. Like Tecumseh, life is too short, ..... (haha!), and I'd prefer to keep hiking the peaks I want to hike, whether on a list or not.

LOL, you can tell who is from NY here (I guess myself excluded!)

 

[skiguy]

NY has a Nippletop, on the 46'er list. I remember one of my friends, on approaching the summit 'cone', saying 'Looks like we're still on the ***'.

That is no where close to what I was trying to reference. You must be missing my point.

 

[Tom Rankin]

That is no where close to what I was trying to reference. You must be missing my point.

Sorry, I'll try to stay abreast of your next post.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

I'll assume that's sarcasm, but does the FTFC ever precisely define any summit location? Or, do all of them have signs now? (It's been a while, but I do have 3 rounds)

I think there are only a few with summit signs - Zealand, Washington, Moosilauke, and maybe Cabot. Was it sarcasm? Maybe... more a comment about the speed at which the list is likely to change, and about the 'precision' over 'tradition' comment.

Tim

 

[Scubahhh]

The DEC in New York has been dismantling the cairn atop Skylight, where for years tradition called for hikers to bring up rocks to add to it. Summit got to be a mess in recent years. The mountain also grew a couple of feet taller.

I thought the idea behind carrying rocks up the high peaks was that volunteers would later use them to mark a trail on the exposed rock to protect delicate flora. Did I just dream that? If I did, it's a pretty cool dream, eh?!?

 

[TCD]

I thought the idea behind carrying rocks up the high peaks was that volunteers would later use them to mark a trail on the exposed rock to protect delicate flora. Did I just dream that? If I did, it's a pretty cool dream, eh?!?

That's only the case where it has been requested. Used to occasionally see an official sign from a trail crew here or there asking for rocks to be brought up, but not so much anymore. When they need a bunch of rocks now, usually they are choppered in in a big white nylon bag. But the state has so diminished the trail crews that the bag of rocks typically sits on the summit for years without being used, until hikers and kids toss them around and spend time spelling out their names with them. Then when a trail crew finally plans to use them, they have to spend time gathering them back up.

The tradition on Skylight is much older. Since at least the early 80s, the ADK High Peaks guidebook has said that "Legend states that if a climber fails to carry a rock from timberline to place on one of the two huge cairns on the summit, it will surely rain." So this is the source for the two enormous cairns. The most recent edition of that guidebook has removed that wording, and replaced it with a request to hikers to please NOT bring up rocks. In 1985 when I brought up a rock it was fun, and the cairns were not that "huge." But in recent years they got out of control, so that tradition had to end.

 

[Salty]

I went searching for the 'Like' button for this post. (Some Forums have one! Hint! Hint!)

I still have a few of these left in storage.

 

[skiguy]

I still have a few of these left in storage.

You don't have any friends though.

 

[David Metsky]

You're right. I should have said "tradition as known in my lifetime".

The number was 46 until 1975, and 47 until 1980.

 

[TomK]

The number was 46 until 1975, and 47 until 1980.

Got out my 1976 copy of the WMG. It lists 46 (and the list is in the front of the book, not the back). Galehead and Bondcliff are omitted, and Wildcat "E" is listed rather than Wildcat "D".

The 1979 copy lists 47, adding Galehead, and still lists Wildcat "E". The penultimate paragraph of the "lists" section notes "Galehead, with a new measurement of 4024 ft. becomes a 4000 footer."

I did a trip in 1978 with an overnight at the Guyot shelter then did Bond and West Bond, did *not* go out to Bondcliff (why would I, it wasn't on the list , stupid younger me) but then visited Galehead because it *was* on the list.

My next copy is the 1987, and that lists 48, including Galehead, Bondcliff, and Wildcat "E".

Didn't get another copy until 2007, and that has Wildcat "D" rather than "E" - when did they make that change?
The description of the Owl's Head path in that edition notes that "The AMC's Four Thousand Footer Committee will continue to recognize the knob where the well-beaten path currently ends as the official summit of Owl's Head."

Have they changed that? Didn't see anything in either the 2012 or 2017 copies to indicate they had. Any thing else I missed?

Is it the case that "most" folks that have "done the 4Ks" have done 48, including either Wildcat "E" or "D"? If that is the case, I think it is perfectly reasonable to say "we aren't changing the list anymore". It is also perfectly reasonable to make a change whenever new information becomes available. It isn't that big a deal in the grand scheme of things - we're just climbing hills here, not sending a probe to Neptune...

TomK

 

[ChrisB]

.... we're just climbing hills here, not sending a probe to Neptune...TomK

I love that!

Also, what's so wrong with the "NE-103?" Has a nice ring to it, no?