noise pollution..low flying jets etc

[spider solo]

I was reading todays article 3-29-07 in the Union leader that Pittsburg Nh is facing the prospect of low flying military jets buzzing overhead at 500 ft.
The article features a picture of jets flying through the Pemi.
-NO POLITICS-
I know we can't let the disscusion drift into politics so the question is ...

DO you already plan your hikes in relation to the expected noise pollution on a given hike ??
Would you give up on an area that is often used as a place buzzed by jets, airplanes etc?

if for example if we were talking military jets as oppsed to other kinds the word military could only be used as a discriptive adjective not some kind of policy statement, either good or bad

to start off...A few years back while hiking the Sandwich wilderness I spent the majority of the day listening to jets buzzing the area. I found the deafing noise somewhat overwhelming. It was at least 5 years before I ever even thought of returning to the area.

The noise pollution does not have to based solely on air traffic.
for example I know that in the White mnts I sometimes pick a trail that goes along a brook or waterfall knowing that even though I'm near a road it will drown out the traffic noise.

Just wondering if other people already do much the same ..ie avoiding trails where you might be listening to snowmobiles all day ,might be another example.

Though the consideration of the noise pollution might seem excessive to some people.
I would use the Grand Canyon as an example. It is often cited as having an impact to the enjoyment of the area now that there are so many sight sighing air traffic there. (I have always felt the Whites were lucking in that respect.

I know up in the north country I would give up on travelling, camping there if it means jets buzzing over at 500'

So would noise pollution change your hiking habits ??

 

[dvbl]

I can definitely understand the all day buzzing putting a damper on your enjoyment. You might have caught them on a Reserves drill weekend. As long as it's not an all day thing, I like the occasional low buzz. A beautiful symbol of freedom. But all day buzzing would be a drag when you're looking for a nature experience, I agree.

As to the more general point, the incredible increase in the quantity of obnoxiously loud motorcycles is to me the number one nausea-inducing example of noise pollution. A biker weekend keeps me at home more than the flu will.

 

[Bob]

Usually when I've heard jets they just fly over once, the noise only lasts a few seconds, it's kind of neat.
The small prop planes I find way more annoying. Just floating along with their nonexistent mufflers; No matter how far out you go, they are around. I always thought they wre prohibited flying in Baxter SP yet I always see and HEAR them there.

 

[bikehikeskifish]

I haven't noticed a lot of air traffic over the Pemi. It is an area where occasional training maneuvers take place because it is an area of low population density. Besides, if you could, wouldn't you love to fly a jet over your favorite place(s)? I would! My father-in-law sold his 4-seater a few years back. It was a lot of fun flying over familiar places at 500 feet (or less). I miss that!

One of my favorite photographs is this A10 T-bolt over Osceola, FOT48 2005

Check the complete sequence -- the link is to the third shot.

(Personally, I find it much more annoying to have MHT traffic flying over my house in Bedford early on Sunday AM.)

Tim

 

[DougPaul]

I
I would use the Grand Canyon as an example. It is often cited as having an impact to the enjoyment of the area now that there are so many sight sighing air traffic there.

Much of Grand Canyon is now off-limits to sightseeing flights.

Doug

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I've always been told that the low and slow flying jets over the WMNF are A10 Warthogs flown by the RI National Guard.

Opinions about the appropriateness of this has varied widely over the years whenever this topic comes up.

 

[skibones]

Usually when I've heard jets they just fly over once, the noise only lasts a few seconds, it's kind of neat.
The small prop planes I find way more annoying. Just floating along with their nonexistent mufflers; No matter how far out you go, they are around. I always thought they wre prohibited flying in Baxter SP yet I always see and HEAR them there.

I live in Waterville Valley and the jets fly over the valley a few times a week. I agree they don't fly very long--a few circles around and then they're off.

 

[psmart]

I've always been told that the low and slow flying jets over the WMNF are A10 Warthogs flown by the RI National Guard.

The A10's, with their distinctive profile, seem to be the most common military aircraft over the WMNF. They also fly out of Westfield, Mass.

The occasional flight isn't a big problem, and in most places, that's all you'll hear. HOWEVER, they seem to have periodic training exercises over the southern part of the Sandwich Range (Sandwich Notch Road, Black Mountain Pond, etc.) where the noise can be heard for HOURS. This is a real problem. I have friends near the Notch road that can hear this from their house.

There is a "recommended" minimum height of 3000 feet over federal Wilderness areas, but since the FAA has jurisdiction on airspace, it's only a recommendation. However, I believe the National Guard and Air force have a "comment" line specifically to get feedback on this kind of issue.

 

[DougG]

So would noise pollution change your hiking habits ??

Like many factors .............it depends.
The fly-overs I've seen barely rate a second glance. Other folks have varying levels of tolerance for things such as crowds, cog smoke/whistle, bunkroom snoring, bugs, etc. A bad weather forecast or sky-high fuel costs are most likely to change my hiking habits.

 

[MadRiver]

I usually see them either skiing at Waterville Valley or hiking Welsh/Dickey. I personally have no problem with them. However, I no longer hike the Jewell Trail because I hate the smell of the cog.

 

[michael]

DO you already plan your hikes in relation to the expected noise pollution on a given hike ??
Would you give up on an area that is often used as a place buzzed by jets, airplanes etc?

Personally it is the humans that I tend to avoid when planning hikes.
Present company excluded of course!
Having grown up in the flight path of Pease AFB with the B-52s, KC-135s and FB-111's coming and going at all hours, I do not find the occaisional jet noise even if prolonged, is all that bothersome nor does it inhibit my enjoyment.
If I can live through 10 years of low flying bombers dragging their landing gear through my bedroom, I can handle the few sorties of jets one does hear out in the wilds of New England. I will say that I do hear more jets in NH and VT but rarely in Maine. and I could never foresake a place like the Pemi due to jet traffic and noise. Heck a few weeks ago my brother and I had an A-10 dive bomb us on top of Lincoln. It was pretty cool and only a couple hundred feet above us.

 

[spider solo]

Much of Grand Canyon is now off-limits to sightseeing flights.

Doug

Ahh ...for me that would be good news.
I was often envious that my sister had the chance to see the Grand before the flights.
They must have put restrictions in to address the problem.

 

[DougPaul]

Ahh ...for me that would be good news.
I was often envious that my sister had the chance to see the Grand before the flights.
They must have put restrictions in to address the problem.

They did.

You can go now... (Please take me with you--I wanna go back! )

The area around S Kaibab Tr and S Bright Angel Tr (and the most popular part of the S Rim) is pretty quiet. IIRC Marble Canyon is flyable and I don't know how far downstream one must go before aircraft are allowed.

Doug

 

[Artex]

I've seen the A-10 around the Pemi on several occasions. Personally, thought it was really cool every time. Just my two cents.

 

[sapblatt]

In all of my hikes I would estimate that there has been less than two to three total minutes of noise from A-10s - at that level I kind of like it - if it were constant I would not...
I agree with others - motorcycles are a bigger nuisance...and in certain areas, cog railways too.

 

[cbcbd]

I have enjoyed the few times I've seen jets or any other planes flying around... I guess I have always liked planes since I was a kid and don't live in high air traffic areas, so that is just my personal experience.

In winter I tend not to be too crazy about hearing snowmobiles around (it's one of those things that unless you're riding one it's just annoying) - still, it's not something I usually plan for so I just deal with it.

 

[griffin]

There are times I just want a good hike, and others I really need a good quiet hike. For the latter, I'd probably avoid being in an area where they were doing fly-overs if I could, just like I'd avoid hiking near the Cog, or in Franconia Notch.

 

[David Metsky]

<mod hat>
First and last warning. I have no idea if jjmcgo was joking or not, but it stops now. You can talk about noise pollution all you want, leave the political commentary for different message boards.

-dave-
</mod hat>

 

[drewski]

noise

noise is good .. i like noise..keeps the bears away...i'm afraid of bears!!

 

[spider solo]

plane, trains and automobiles ..etc

...don't want this thread going political anymore than the moderaters do.
I'm asking if people change their hiking patterns in relation to noise.

Expandng it to more of a hiking/ camping thread I would use the example that I have travelled miles(car) to go to a paticular camping site. Upon setting up camp I realize I will be listening to traffic all night.
I leave my tent set up... but when it's time to sleep for the night I will take my sleeping bag down to a brook, river, stream and sleep to the sounds of that instead .
In that case I've changed my behavior and more than likely I am breaking whatever rules about sleeping in a non designated place.
Chances are I would avoid that destination again because of the noise pollution.
Others would sleep soundly and the whole subject would be meaningless.

Ok back to more familar territory...wouldn't it be nice to have one day a year you could do a hike in Franconia Notch and have a no traffic day. A nice day when climbng the Flume or whatever there are only the sounds of days gone by ??