Please help me choose a new camera . . . THANKS.

[DougPaul]

Just out of curiosity, I did a bit of research and made up a table of various lag times. I included some popular P&Ses as well as some DSLRs for comparison.

model           autofocus       prefoc  man_foc cycle   contin  flash   
-----------     ---------       ------  ------- -----   ------  -----
A75             .90-1.2         .065            1.78     .59             
A570IS          .54-.68         .075    .286    2.60     .80    10.7     
A720IS          .51-.61         .082    .202    1.92    1.04    11.7     
SD800IS         .39-.44         .077     --     1.55     .59     6.5     

XT              .20-.24         .095    .168     .36     .35             
XTi             .20             .105    .13      .35     .33     3       

40D             .128/.166       .061    .078     .28     .16     --     
5D              .149 best       .078    .133     .40     .33     --     
1D Mark III     .069/.120       .054    .064             .11     --     
1Ds Mark II     .18             .052    .057     .51     .25     --
1Ds Mark III                                             .2      --

D2H             .049-.456       .045    .046     .25    .124     --
D2Xs            .045+slew       .045    .045     .20     .19     -- 
all numbers are in seconds

autofocus=lag with autofocus
prefoc=lag with prefocus
man_foc=lag with manual focus
cycle=cycle time large fine JPEG (shot-to-shot)
contin=continuous mode (time per shot)
flash=recycle time at max output
slew=time for the lens to focus
all data from [url]http://www.imaging-resource.com[/url]
.

Essentially all cameras listed have prefocus lag times of < .1 sec.
The SD800 looks like it has the best autofocus lag of the P&Ses.

Doug

 

[sli74]

WOW !!! You guys are AWESOME !!!
I post a question, go away for a weekend and I got such great responses and advice. I am off to compare the A570, A720, SD800 and SD850 . . . I will be back with a decision or more questions. Thanks everyone.

Grumpy, no problem about the thread drift, I don't mind . . . I don't understand most of the tech talk, but it is educational.

sli74

 

[DougPaul]

WOW !!! You guys are AWESOME !!!
I post a question, go away for a weekend and I got such great responses and advice. I am off to compare the A570, A720, SD800 and SD850 . . . I will be back with a decision or more questions. Thanks everyone.

There are good nuts-and-bolts reviews of all of the above at http://www.imaging-resource.com/MFR1.HTM?view=Canon_reviews

BTW, the review of the SD850 suggests that the 850 is an 800 with a different lens--Canon claims the 800 is an updated 700. Of the above, only the 800 has a wide angle lens (eFl 28mm).

Doug

 

[sli74]

So, I am looking for purely a point and shoot. Manual controls are not as important to me. Given that, I am torn between getting the A720 IS and either the SD800 or the SD1000

The A720 pros as I see it are its 6X optical zoom, higher battery life, the fact that it isn't the proprietary battery and it is cheaper. The cons are that it is almost twice as heavy.

The SD800 is lighter but I lose some optical zoom and battery life and pay more. But the fact that it is lighter weight makes it appealing somewhat.

The SD1000 is the lowest in price and weight but once again we are back to the optical zoom being on 3X.

I can't choose. Is there any other pros and cons I am missing?

sli74

 

[David Metsky]

The SD800 is the best option if you want the 28mm wide angle lens. If you don't then getting the SD850 makes more sense. The 850 has a sharper lens and, since you're not getting the wide angle, has more on the zoom end.

The SD800 and SD870 are 28-105mm.
The SD850 and A570 are 35-140mm
The SD1000 is 35-105mm
The A720 is 35-210mm

Weight is so small at this range as to be inconsequential. Size is more important, but both the A570 and A720 are small enough to carry on your sternum strap or hip belt.

If you're going to be using this camera in the woods where light isn't always the best I'd recommend getting IS, which eliminates the SD1000. If you want a wide angle lens then I recommend the SD800 over the SD870 due to the optical viewfinder. If you want an all around camera and don't care if you can't slip it into a pants pocket I'd go for the A720.

-dave-

 

[sli74]

Between the SD850 and the A720 which will give me a sharper image?

sli74

 

[David Metsky]

If you're not going to blow them up past 8x10 you won't notice any difference. At the ragged edge, the A720 will probably produce better poster sized images. Other then that, it's pretty even.

 

[DougPaul]

Between the SD850 and the A720 which will give me a sharper image?

In general, the wider the range of a zoom (max_Fl/min_Fl), the more compromise in the lens design and the poorer the optical quality.

IIRC, these cameras range from ~7-- ~8 MP. There is no meaningful difference between 7 and 8 MP. And there is nothing to be gained by going beyond ~8MP due to signal-to-noise issues on the sensor (important for reducing the noise at the higher ISO settings) and lens diffraction effects.

Doug

 

[Raymond]

I have an 11x14 in my bedroom taken with my old Kodak, which is only 5 (actually 4.9) mp, and you have to look pretty carefully to see any smearing of the image. (Trees on a distant slope look like they were painted.)

The heavier the camera, the easier it can be to hold steady. If you're not filing your toothbrush (Colin Fletcher reference), cameras are probably all light enough these days.

Also, I suppose most cameras these days have stitching software to make panoramas; the Canon software worked real well with the photos I took with my A720 and also some photos I took with my son's HP 707something. Much better than the panoramas I tried to assemble with Photoshop Elements 2.0.

I haven't tried the Canon stitching software with the non-programmed panorama-like attempts I made with my Kodak because the Canon software says that it will only work in a Mac that is running at least Panther (10.3) and my Mac, which has four-plus years' worth of pictures in it, has only OS 10.2.8. So I'm stuck using another computer for my Canon photos until I upgrade.

 

[David Metsky]

Just to throw a wrench in the works, PMA 2008 is going on right now and the first batch of new camera announcements are coming out. Olympus started things out with a new 20x ultrazoom, some 7x ultrathin compacts (no longer weather proof, alas), and some entry level models with some nice specs on paper. They all use xD cards, but other then that are nice improvements, many having 28 and even 26mm wide angle lenses.

Look for the Canon announcements in the next day or two. I'd hold off buying anything until then.

 

[sli74]

I won't be making the purchase for another week or so but I doubt I can afford any newly released models . . . unless they are under $250 or so . . .
But, keep me updated on what you find for further suggestions, Dave.

sli74

 

[BorealChickadee]

The SD800 is the best option if you want the 28mm wide angle lens. If you don't then getting the SD850 makes more sense. The 850 has a sharper lens and, since you're not getting the wide angle, has more on the zoom end.

The SD800 and SD870 are 28-105mm.
The SD850 and A570 are 35-140mm
The SD1000 is 35-105mm
The A720 is 35-210mm

Weight is so small at this range as to be inconsequential. Size is more important, but both the A570 and A720 are small enough to carry on your sternum strap or hip belt.

If you're going to be using this camera in the woods where light isn't always the best I'd recommend getting IS, which eliminates the SD1000. If you want a wide angle lens then I recommend the SD800 over the SD870 due to the optical viewfinder. If you want an all around camera and don't care if you can't slip it into a pants pocket I'd go for the A720.

-dave-

If I'm not worried about the optical viewfinder, which is better, the 800 or 870 in image quality? Any other consideration between the two? I'm seriously considering picking up a 28mm P&S strictly for hiking.

 

[DougPaul]

If I'm not worried about the optical viewfinder, which is better, the 800 or 870 in image quality? Any other consideration between the two? I'm seriously considering picking up a 28mm P&S strictly for hiking.

I think they use the same lens and the difference between 7.1 and 8.0 MP isn't worth noticing, so the image quality should be the same.

The advantages of the optical viewfinder are that it is easier to use in bright sunlight (LCDs often wash out under these conditions) and it is easier to hold the camera steady against your face than at arm's length.

I chose the 800.

Doug

 

[David Metsky]

I agree with Doug, the image quality is going to be very similar between the two. I would add that the optical view finder allows you to turn off the LCD and save battery power which is important in cold weather and on long trips.

Also, the Panasonic FX33 and FX55 are similar cameras with 28mm lenses.

 

[Rob S]

Another vote for the SD800. Bought it last year. It's by far the best camera I've ever owned for hiking.

 

[David Metsky]

BTW, Canon announced it's new models today and there's nothing very impressive about the changes. Your choices are pretty much the same as they were before.

 

[Quietman]

The site in DougPaul's link in his previous thread now has previews of the new Canon cameras. The new models include the A580, A590IS, & SD1100IS.

Last March, I picked up my A540 for $120 (clearance and store sample) after the newer models came out. I love the camera, and the price was right.

At the moment, 9 of the top 10 selling cameras are Canons. Pretty impressive!

 

[DougPaul]

The site in DougPaul's link in his previous thread now has previews of the new Canon cameras. The new models include the A580, A590IS, & SD1100IS.

There is also info on the new models on the Canon website: http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndex1Act&fcategoryid=101

BTW, my earlier link was http://www.imaging-resource.com/MFR1.HTM?view=Canon_reviews


Also Canon announced a new member of the Digital Rebel series: the XSi (450D). Any discussion should probably go in a different thread.

Doug

 

[Michelle]

Seema -

I'm looking for similiar features in a camera, I have an Olympus Stylus (don't laugh) 3.0.....it's held up to multiple beatings and takes great pictures.....I'm not too camera saavy...all I do is point and shoot, maybe change the setting to landscape if I'm feeling artistic. I'm not sure where Olympus falls in the competition here, but they used to make a great camera.
I recently went to Best Buy to check out the newest Olympus styles and noticed the Stylus's are smaller, still weatherproof, somewhat light....but they have done away with the small viewfinder. I like using the viewfinder only because it uses up WAY less battery than the LCD screen. And if charging the battery is an issue......you want to prolong the life of that battery as long as possible! So, in the end, I'm prob going to stick with my good ole 3.0 for awhile longer.....unless I read about the great "world's perfect hiking camera" in this thread!!!
Anyway.....in my "research" I found out that Olympus sells their refurbushed cameras on e-bay, guaranteed and with warranty.......you might be able to score a nice Stylus 7.0 weather and shockproof camera for under $200, the only reason I'm holding back is because of that LCD screen......but if you can overlook that....it could turn out to be a nice deal.
anyway happy shopping!

 

[sli74]

Hey thanks chickety . . . I think Brian and I have decided on a Canon A720 IS . . . it is on sale for just under $200 and we can use AA batteries in it which avoids having to charge batteries, we can just carry extra AA batteries.

For all the rest of you who took the time to educate me on the best camera for my needs, THANK YOU VERY much . . . I am glad we have decided on one so I can move onto thinking about the next thing on my "to do" list.

Now, where can I get a cheapest SD cards?

sli74