Slide Cornell Wittenberg Loop from CR 47

[Hank]

Just under 2.5 hours drive from NYC this morning in light traffic. Left trailhead register 7:47 am solo, pack-less but with essentials in short pockets. I wore my Flyer vest as it was in the mid 40s but to have it just in case the weather would turn, not predicted to happen. As it turned out, I ended up carrying the vest for almost the whole passage. I also carried a space blanket, one water bottle, gels, compass, 2 maps, etc.

The Neversink was easily crossed on rocks. Taking the red trail to and over the peaks for the virtue of a direct route, as opposed to the scenic Curtis-Ormsbee Trail. I ran it as a trail run but was surprised at how slow my average speed panned out.

Did I blow it, or were there no views from the top of Slide? I passed an opportunity on the left before the summit to northwestern views as the AMC Catskill & Hudson Valley Day Hikes claimed 360 views were to be had at the top. After descending to the Burroughs plaque I re-ascended past the footing of the old fire tower in a search for a trail to some view. Every path had brush laid across it, as sign in the Adirondacks that the trail is not for use. No views. BTW, this was my first Catskill hike.

On to Cornell. The spring just east of Slide summit was the first and last water I took. [Yes, I am a camel] Water was running profusely. Cornell was also a disappointment on views but I knew a guide book mentioned Wittenberg had an open ledge. I did not carry a guide book but I did take pictures of both the Wittenberg Cornell Slide Trail and the Phoenicia East Branch Trail descriptions with my camera so I could access them in the camera display if needed, however awkward it might be. But this was a trail run and I wanted to keep moving and did not try to read on the camera. The cliff faces on Cornell, which had been a question mark to me as I was solo act turned out to be no problem. This was different hiking than the ADKs and Whites. You hit the same cliff bands on different mountains, or so it seemed to me. The rocks were different and summits had hardwoods.

The southern and eastern views from Wittenberg were worthy. However, a haze robbed me of clear distant detail.

Eschewing bug dope, I was only bitten by mosquitoes in Woodland Valley. For me, it was just in and out of the valley and on to the impressive stone steps.

At the trail intersection for Giant Ledge, I left the yellow marked Phoenicia East Branch Trail and took the unmarked easement through the Winnisook Club, saving distance and vertical. I had my only food, a gel and put the hammer down on this unmarked trail/abandoned road. As the trail ends on CR 47 just north of Winnisook Lake, I ran the eastern shoulder of the road, uphill to just above the lake, then downhill to the car park, getting to the register 4:47 after leaving it at the start. I had expected to run it in less than 4 hours. How will this compare with the Escarpment Trail Run on the 26th? I am hoping the ability to run with no weight on the supported run will make a difference. Also, I will not be backtracking looking for views and taking pictures.

My Polar S710 said I had 4260' vertical gain.

Back in Greenwich Village by 3:30 pm. Only stumbled on roots/rocks twice but never went down. Thanks to all who gave advise on putting this trip together.

 

[Tom Rankin]

Glad you had a good trip.

There are views to the left as you ascend Slide. Check out the little trails next time, some of them must not be brushed out. Also, at least in the Winter, standing on the summit Rock should afford a few views here and there. They say that from various points of Slide, you can see every other 35R mountain (not necessarily the top).

There is a view looking back towards Slide just before summitting Cornell. There is a view from the summit as well, nominal.

Wittenburg has the best open view for sure.

 

[Mark Schaefer]

Sounds like a good, fast run.

The balsam fir near the ledge at the Burroughs Plaque on Slide Mountain have really grown up in the last decade, obscuring the eastern view from this ledge. The views on the Slide summit have never been 360 degrees to my knowledge; or at least not since the fire tower was dismantled many decades ago (way before my time).

There was a period of time in the 1970s when about 2 acres just south of the Burroughs Plaque was nearly stripped of all vegetation by campers illegally cutting trees for firewood. At that time there was still a lean-to on the summit, and it was legal to camp on the summit. It was quite common to see a tent city on summer weekends. I even remember arriving on the summit of Slide at dawn in late April 1975 to find over a dozen tents on the summit. Anyway, the deforestation did offer some additional views to the east and south from the plaque ledge. It also led to the banning of camping above 3500' in the Catskills. The balsam forest on top of Slide has recovered in the last 3 decades and the views have rapidly closed in. The eastern view at the ledge was the last to go. The Catskill master plan allows for maintaining existing vistas/views within Catskill Wilderness Areas. But so far they have not done any recent cuttings to maintain the historic, eastern view on Slide Mt. I am not sure whether the DEC plans to authorize the reopening of this view, but it appears not.

As Tom mentions there is a north and west view just west of the summit high point that offers a good view of the Devils Path mountains. There is also a fairly good eastern view from the top of the ladders/stairs just above the spring on the eastern side of Slide.

The Escarpment Trail run is about 3.5 miles longer than the S-C-W loop. I noticed that the Escarpment Trail Run website claims the elevation change is about 10,000' (that has to be up and down combined). The end of the run at North Lake is 260' higher than the start, so the net elevation gain is perhaps just over 5100'. The steep 1180' climb up the north side of Blackhead is the toughest part of the course. Although the climbs of Stoppel Point and North Mountain will be quite noticeable late in the run as well. Beware of the descent off of Arizona Mt into Dutcher Notch. The trail is badly eroded and the footing here is the worst on the Trail Run. The descent off of North Point has been shored up with trail maintenance in recent years, but it is also steep.

I have seen trip reports from spring and early summer 2009 stating that the Escarpment Trail from Windham High Peak through Acra Point is quite overgrown. Hopefully there will be some trail work done prior to the Trail Run. It is quite common to see trail runners training along the Escarpment Trail in June and July, so hopefully the Trail Run organizers are well appraised of the situation.

Good luck with the training and run.

 

[Hank]

Things change in time. In my whole loop I only encountered 3 groups on the trails. Considering an unofficial July 4th Monday and great weather, I can only speculate where the sort of people who used to hike were.

Your point of less maintained trails, greater length and vertical gain also work against my time on the Escarpment Trail Run. That I will be 60 in one month might have something to do with it but my last marathon was 3:24. However, I was never a fast runner in my youth. A few other factors. I injured the same tendon in one foot more than the other running the Bear Mtn Half in May, over loose stones. The injury is still there. How people go all out on loose stones is beyond me. I had to walk sections of trail for this reason. Another, more insidious factor which also came up in the Bear Mtn Half was my slowing due to not taking in calories. Yesterday, out there by myself, I had no metrics to tell if I was slowing. On the Bear Mtn race I didn't eat or drink till the second half where I noticed people who were running with me began to pass. Yesterday, I walked the section from Woodland Valley to the intersection at Giant Ledge. Not that I walked slowly, but I didn't run it. Nor did I attempt to take in calories. But I ran the easement section at a decent pace and the road all out. Though I don't know for sure, I suspect there are fewer better running sections on the Escarpment trail.

One factor that cannot be denied is the longer you are running, the harder the final miles are on your legs. Faster runners not only have better technique, but they can handle higher intensities because they subject themselves to the rigors for shorter periods.

 

[adktyler]

Glad to hear that the trip turned out all right for you!!

 

[Jay H]

The W-C-S loop is on a much wider trail than some parts of the Escarpment, being hiked much more commonly than some sections of the Escarpment north of North Point and south of Windham.

Tom basically stated the views on Slide, you can kind of make out the Devil's path summits from the wide rock on Slide but 360deg views??? maybe if the observation tower was still there.

The official views are between the CO/BR trail junction and the summit.

Cornell has a short spur trail to a view too, but as mentioned, Wittenberg has a fantastic open ledge looking out towards the Ashoken reservoir.

Jay

 

[Hank]

No doubt the narrow trails on the Escarpment Trail make passing a problem. But are there sizable stretches which are suitable to running where it is not strewn with unfriendly size/shaped rocks? Is the last section to the finish actually runner friendly?

I cannot fathom how anyone can run 30k at the pace required to do it sub 3 hours with the vertical and not have a significant distance on a surface which you can actually run.

 

[Mark Schaefer]

No doubt the narrow trails on the Escarpment Trail make passing a problem. But are there sizable stretches which are suitable to running where it is not strewn with unfriendly size/shaped rocks? Is the last section to the finish actually runner friendly?

I cannot fathom how anyone can run 30k at the pace required to do it sub 3 hours with the vertical and not have a significant distance on a surface which you can actually run.

There are stretches that allow for passing:

• Much of the northern start up through and just past the Elm ridge lean-to.
• The section that skirts around the two summits of Burnt Knob.
• The summit of Acra Point to the intersection with the Batavia Trail before the start of the climb up Blackhead.
• The flat summits of Arizona, Stoppel Point, and North Mountain to North Point.
• After the descent from North Point there are several flat sections toward the finish.

However, there are occasional rocky climbs / descents amongst these. And nasty roots and occasional loose rocks pretty much everywhere that require constant attention. Also Catskill rocks are extremely slippery when wet.

I just looked through the 2008 slide show (link of the Trail Run website) which reminded me of the flooded section of trail near the start. All of the photos in the slide show are from three basic areas:

• The starting trailhead parking area.
• The flooded beaver pond that the trail literally goes through near the start of the trail. The water appeared to be mid-calf to knee height. Be prepared to get wet as recent reports indicate that the beaver pond is still there, and this summer has been and is likely to continue to be rainy.
• Some of the rocky descents near the North Lake finish.

I am also amazed that anyone can run this race in less than three hours. It does attract some elite trail runners. But there are also many who take 6-8 hours to complete. There should be many behind you in the race. I remember talking to one of the volunteers at the Dutcher Notch water stop in the late 1970s. He mentioned that one runner took over 9 hours to finish one year. That runner took a wrong turn and got lost. And no, I have never nor could I ever run in this race. I just happened to stumble upon it during what I thought would be a quiet hike up Stoppel Point from Crows Nest Road. Little did I know.

I am not sure whether they still offer water at Dutcher Notch. In the 1970s they were able to drive a jeep up to Dutcher Notch from Lake Colgate. Volunteers would now have to carry water in as the trail is no longer drivable.

 

[Hank]

Now to get stronger and stay uninjured for the event. It should prove to be memorable. To finish strong, that's the thing.

Here is a link to photos on Facebook. They are thumbnails as the transfer from the Mac is less than perfect. The transfer program would not let me select all my pics except for thumbs

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=27158&id=1108962542&ref=mf

 

[Mark Schaefer]

Some comments on your C-S-W loop observations.

This was different hiking than the ADKs and Whites. You hit the same cliff bands on different mountains, or so it seemed to me. The rocks were different and summits had hardwoods.

The geology and summit forests of the Catskills differ greatly from the northern mountains. The Catskills are shorter and further south and are entirely lower than the normal tree line for this latitude. Some Catskill summits are dominated by balsam fir and/or red spruce. However, most summits have some hardwoods mixed in due to the lower elevation and latitude. Some of the highest Catskill summits such as Graham are even dominated by hardwoods, albeit dwarf hardwoods.

The Catskills are formed of sedimentary sandstone and shale layers which were uplifted intact so that the strata remained horizontal. There has been no subsequent folding of the sedimentary strata, nor are there any imbedded metamorphic rocks nor any significant amounts of minerals. The quartz on the summit of Slide is among the few minerals. This sedimentary strata was initially deposited over millions of years in a vast river delta which was formed as the Acadian Mountains eroded. The Acadians were once of great height, and thus the sediments accumulated several thousand feet deep. The Catskill strata layers vary greatly in hardness based upon the degree of mud, silt, gravel, and minerals that were deposited with the sand over time. Also the water content of the inland sea varied over time which provided different degrees of cementing in the layers. The layers at any given current elevation are fairly uniform within localized areas of the Catskills . The tops of ledges and cliff bands tend to be hard layers which may require the glaciers of the next ice age to wear through. Any softer layers that were above the current hard tops have weathered away since the last ice age. So within localized areas it is common to find cliff bands and ledges at the same elevation. If you look at the detail in the USGS topos you can readily see these terraced slopes in many areas. The early settlers called them beehive slopes/terraces because of the resemblance to their rope beehives they constructed to attract pollinating bees.

Things change in time. In my whole loop I only encountered 3 groups on the trails. Considering an unofficial July 4th Monday and great weather, I can only speculate where the sort of people who used to hike were.

Slide Mountain was often a "party mountain" for campers in the 1970s. Although it is the highest mountain in the Catskills it is one of the easier Catskill climbs from Route 47. Those former party campers have no doubt moved to lower, free, car camping areas such as those along the Peekamoose-Sundown Road and Rondout Creek. Those camping areas can be quite noisy on summer weekends.

This year neither Friday nor Monday surrounding the Independence Day holiday were full legal holidays and perhaps not for many workers. That nay have suppressed the hiker traffic in the Catskills. Perhaps the hiker traffic to Slide Mountain picked up later in the day, and you were spared the brunt by your relative early start. The trail from Woodland Valley up to the Giant Ledge Trail also gets very little use compared to the other trails. By using the easement (former trail) you may have missed the multitudes that hike the popular Giant Ledge.

 

[Hank]

The trail from Woodland Valley up to the Giant Ledge Trail also gets very little use compared to the other trails. \

There were places I had to think twice if it was a trail! After all that magnificent work building those stone steps...

 

[Tom Rankin]

Here are some old pics of the summit of Slide, c. 1958:

Summit with Cornell in the distance

Summit with Devil's Path in the distance

Summit from old Observing Tower (removed) looking towards the Ashokan Reservoir.

 

[Hank]

What a difference 51 years makes. Somehow I wouldn't expect to see deer on the summit now.