Winter Backpacking Stoves

[MindlessMariachi]

Now that the Fourth of July is behind us, there's one obvious topic of conversation: winter backpacking. Hear me out though, 'cuz I have to tell people what I want for my birthday!

What's the best kind of stove to take backpacking in the winter? I've always used a whisperlight, but I don't like how much I have to fiddle with it (I'm not the most mechanically inclined). What's a better option? I was thinking of trying something wood-burning, like one of those sierra stoves (http://www.wisementrading.com/campstoves/zipztoves.htm) or maybe some of the home-made things I see people carry.

In the summer I use an alcohol-burning Pepsi can stove, which definitely won't do in the winter, and I've never tried a butane or pressurized fuel in the winter, but I gather that's sort of a disaster.

What should I go with?

 

[Jay H]

Some people here use the MSR XGK which apparently, MSR has some kind of "EX" version out:

http://www.cascadedesigns.com/msr/stoves/expedition-stoves/xgk-ex/product

A winter stove and mountaineering stove that sounds like a 747 (even when off.. j/k).

Jay

 

[DougPaul]

I use an MSR model G (discontinued). The XGK is the follow-on. http://www.rei.com/product/722001

Doug

 

[MindlessMariachi]

thanks - i know those are popular for the winter, but do they come with the same maintenance headaches that accompany the whisperlight? They're such similar designs...

 

[Chip]

From what I've read the Whisperlight is temperamental. I use a Primus Vari or Multi Fuel. Hot, loud, low maintenance, low fuel use, dependable, trustworthy, honest and brave...

I wouldn't screw around with wood or alcohol in winter, but I'm sure it's done.

 

[sardog1]

thanks - i know those are popular for the winter, but do they come with the same maintenance headaches that accompany the whisperlight? They're such similar designs...

AHA! Finally a prospect for steering away from the MSR stove line. Get thyself a SVEA 123.

You could have my forty-year old version, but you'd have to kill me first. It has never failed me, including down to temperatures at which most VFTT pos(t)ers would only shudder.

You won't be cool lugging one around. But you will be warm from various breakfasts, main meals, hot beverages, etc., when you need to be.

 

[MindlessMariachi]

thanks - the straw that broke the camel's back for me with the whisperlight was this past winter. my stove is pretty old, so I replaced the pump with a shiny new one. And on maybe the second time I used it (on a really cold subzero day) the stupid (almost new) pump failed. I suspect there's a little rubber gasket or something in there that just cracked in the cold - it's been on my summertime to-do list to figure it out exactly. It looks like the same pump in the XGK stove, and the Primus has a pretty similar design, which is what worries me about the whole thing ... oh well, I'd be interested in hearing from anyone who uses a game-changingly different system.

 

[Little Rickie]

Now that the Fourth of July is behind us, there's one obvious topic of conversation: winter backpacking. Hear me out though, 'cuz I have to tell people what I want for my birthday!

What's the best kind of stove to take backpacking in the winter? I've always used a whisperlight, but I don't like how much I have to fiddle with it (I'm not the most mechanically inclined). What's a better option? I was thinking of trying something wood-burning, like one of those sierra stoves (http://www.wisementrading.com/campstoves/zipztoves.htm) or maybe some of the home-made things I see people carry.

In the summer I use an alcohol-burning Pepsi can stove, which definitely won't do in the winter, and I've never tried a butane or pressurized fuel in the winter, but I gather that's sort of a disaster.

What should I go with?

I use a Simmer Light and have been very happy with it. I like the idea of the Zip but that would take tinkering with in the sence your feeding it fuel to keep it going and hot. Then there is the battery thing in the cold and a fan that may not like the cold.

It takes a lot of BTUs to melt and boil water in the winter. You'd have to carry in or find a hard wood fuel source (like wood stove pellets) to get the BTUs up and even then it wouldn't compare to white gas.

Wisper light is a nice stove. Practice with it now, it's not so bad to work with, then, ask for a winter bag, bivy bag or tent...

 

[Little Rickie]

my stove is pretty old, .

Ya didn't say it was old! The new ones get better all the time. Borrow one and see for yourself.

Same thing for the Seva or anyother stove you're considering.

I've see the Seva in action (simple (good) mechanics) and would buy a old or used one if I came across one but they take some tinkering too.

 

[--M.]

I've used the Optimus 8R since the 70s and have loved everything except the weight (get the SVEA 123; sardog1 is right). Also used a Whisperlight without incident.

I'd be embarrassed to say this about any other piece of gear, but with this one, I'm proud of it like a firehouse with a 50-year-old lightbulb: I have never maintained this stove in any way whatsoever, and it has never failed in any way whatsoever.

Used it in a campground last weekend (and used the alcohol stove on the trail).

People laugh about the noise, and yes, it's loud. But it has never once failed, ever. Did I say that already? That alone beats all.

One minor safety caution: don't induce the relief valve by overheating it. You'll feel for about a millisecond like John Wayne in "Hellfighters." (http://www.vftt.org/forums/showpost.php?p=133992&postcount=17)

 

[DougPaul]

thanks - i know those are popular for the winter, but do they come with the same maintenance headaches that accompany the whisperlight? They're such similar designs...

I've never had any maintenance problems with my 35 year old MSR model G. (It is gasoline only, otherwise very similar to the XGKs.)

One way to minimize maintenance is to only use fuel intended for stoves and lanterns: Coleman fuel, Blazo, MSR Superfuel, etc. Motor fuels have additives that can clog stoves (and poison you...).

I've used the Optimus 8R since the 70s

I also have an 8R which still works and has always worked well for me. If you want to use it in the cold, get the add-on pump.

The XGK has a very good windscreen (the 8R may explode if you use it with a windscreen) which can be very helpful if there is a breeze. FWIW, I prefer the G/XGK in winter.


BTW, there is a prior thread which may be of interest: "Winter Stove Favorites" http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20434

Doug

 

[Tim Horn]

There is a reason why these stoves are standby's in the winter. They are simple, can be fixed in the field and made to work even when broken. I too broke a pump on an MSR on the first day of a long trip. I was able to rig the pump so it worked for the next 7 days. That is the only time I had a problem with my MSR beyond maintenance which for me consists of oiling the leather cup once a year. Easy to use, repairable in the field, outputs a bunch of heat in all conditions and a long long track record of success. Perhaps someone will build a better stove someday but I bet it will be based on the SVEA 123 design.

 

[DougPaul]

There is a reason why these stoves are standby's in the winter. They are simple, can be fixed in the field and made to work even when broken. I too broke a pump on an MSR on the first day of a long trip. I was able to rig the pump so it worked for the next 7 days. That is the only time I had a problem with my MSR beyond maintenance which for me consists of oiling the leather cup once a year. Easy to use, repairable in the field, outputs a bunch of heat in all conditions and a long long track record of success.

You can also buy a rebuild/repair kit for MSR stoves as well as buy replacement parts. http://www.rei.com/product/714949

Doug

 

[J.Dub]

I've always used a whisperlight, but I don't like how much I have to fiddle with it (I'm not the most mechanically inclined). What's a better option?

I've been using a Whisperlight the last several winters.

I recently picked up a used XGK on evilBay, based on the robust performance of my buddy's stoves on winter Presi Traverse trips three years in a row. (The twin engine, snow-melting flamethrower he's been refining each trip is the shiznit.) Our guides on Rainier also used the XGK, FWIW.

The Whisperlight is going up on evilBay soon.

Draw your own conclusions.


(Like someone said upthread, there's a reason the XGK and Svea123 are so popular mountaineering stoves.)

 

[tb69wemt]

AHA! Finally a prospect for steering away from the MSR stove line. Get thyself a SVEA 123.

You could have my forty-year old version, but you'd have to kill me first. It has never failed me, including down to temperatures at which most VFTT pos(t)ers would only shudder.

BINGO!!!!!

We have a winner!!!

I have several diferent makes and model stoves many new technology stoves but when push comes to shove and the temps drop my 30 year old SVEA 123 gets the job. I have tried many times to retire it nothing compares to it when really cold.

 

[Chip]

You could have my forty-year old version, but you'd have to kill me first. It has never failed me, including down to temperatures at which most VFTT pos(t)ers would only shudder.

What temps we talking about here ? I suppose there's a temp that my external bottle Primus wouldn't work as well as my 8r. I haven't found that temp yet though. (Not that I'm often out in substantially below zero temps, but I'm interested if you have a number in mind that you would only carry the 123 in.) (BTW: I consider the 8r and 123 equivalent in cold weather, you might not.)

 

[sardog1]

What temps we talking about here ? I suppose there's a temp that my external bottle Primus wouldn't work as well as my 8r. I haven't found that temp yet though. (Not that I'm often out in substantially below zero temps, but I'm interested if you have a number in mind that you would only carry the 123 in.) (BTW: I consider the 8r and 123 equivalent in cold weather, you might not.)

-20 F is inconvenient. -30 F is when Mother Nature starts actively trying to kill you.

Wanna know why I favor the SVEA? Read the comments of longtime users in this Google search for Whisperlite + Primus +"below zero" + SVEA.

P.S. I've seen the 8R in action below zero and saw no operational faults, except the need to prime with the pump. Moving parts = things that occasionally go wrong at the wrong moments. Don't know nuthin' 'bout runnin' no Primus.

 

[cbcbd]

What are you looking to get out of it? Ease of use, no hassles, no sooty hands?
I've been using my Jetboil almost exclusively for most of my trips, especially the ones where I've had to melt snow for water.
Other than that, I've had no problems with my Whisperlite Internationale in the winter.

 

[Pete S]

Here's another approach that uses canister stoves

http://chauvinguides.com/PresiTraverse/presicookingguide.htm

 

[Sheomet]

I've used my XGK here in Alaska at temps near -35F, haven't had any problems with it yet.