winter day trip packing question

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coldfeet

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Well I'm going out on Sunday to slide mtn in catskills with the catskill 3500 club..first time..I read that many folks carry a light sleeping bag for emergencies.. is this true? I know the boy scout motto "be prepared".. also should i carry a stove and pot just in case?..this will add app 5 more pounds..What's the average weight on a day trip?..Sorry for so many questions but remember your first time? thx..Happy holidays and a safe one to all..Get a sober driver if u drink! (I can't spell designated correctly) or did I?
 
coldfeet said:
Well I'm going out on Sunday to slide mtn in catskills with the catskill 3500 club..first time..I read that many folks carry a light sleeping bag for emergencies.. is this true? I know the boy scout motto "be prepared".. also should i carry a stove and pot just in case?..this will add app 5 more pounds..What's the average weight on a day trip?..Sorry for so many questions but remember your first time? thx..Happy holidays and a safe one to all..Get a sober driver if u drink! (I can't spell designated correctly) or did I?
Questions to ask yourself: Consider the expected weather - then considered the unexpected weather (seriously). How isolated will you be? Are you solo or going with an experienced group (probably not everyone needs to carry duplicates of all emergency gear.) Ask yourself, if I sprain an ankle (or worse) and can't walk out on my own, could I survive with the miminal gear I have until help arrived? Maybe only a lightweight waterproof tarp and some kind of insulation from the ground would be enough, maybe not. A stove may be overkill, but adequate water is a necessity, winter or not.
 
I think that when you go out with a club and you memtion that your a beginner I think it's the responsibility of the leaders to tell you what they think you should bring. Maybe the leaders already have the "group gear" such as sleeping bag, stove, pad and other gear. I started carrying my own "emergency gear" since i started reading some threads. Instead of a sleeping bag I packed insulated pants and a parka, i also have an emergency bivy/space blanket ($20) and first aid kit. I think I carry more essentials than the leaders, just in case something happens to them! I think I just answered my own question..I will carry a stove if no one else does. Thx for listening and I hope to see Peakbagr up there..we're meeting at 10 at the trailhead..I'll be the noisy one with the pots and pans banging and the 30 lb pack!
 
emerg gear

I never, even solo, carry a sleeping bag or stove for dayhikes in the winter, but thats me. My back up gear is, heavy fleece pants, over mitts, xtra hat, xtra food and an xtra top layer, enough to survive and get out, whenever that is. ;)
 
sierra said:
I never, even solo, carry a sleeping bag or stove for dayhikes in the winter, but thats me. My back up gear is, heavy fleece pants, over mitts, xtra hat, xtra food and an xtra top layer, enough to survive and get out, whenever that is. ;)

I'm leading a hike 1/1/5 to Windham High Peak in the Catskills. I will be bringing a bivvy sack, and some other 'extreme gear' items. Since I am the leader, I feel some obligation to be prepared on the part of everyone else.

At the trailhead, I must assess each person's abilities and gear. If I do not think they are prepared, I have the right to tell them that I do not think they should go on the hike with the group.
 
Hi Tom,

That's exactly what I want to hear..I felt bad last night going to sleep because of the statement that i made about "leader responsibility", I didn't mean for it to sound like they were baby sitting for me and they are "volunteers" not paid guides.. Hard to explain typing but since I'm a school teacher and a "new" asst, scout leader, I like to have some type of checklist to make sure "I'm prepared". I know it's impossible to bring everything but I don't mind bringing stuff for the team. PS I met Eli on line and I might go out with his group on 1/8 somewhere.

Meanwhile off subject, the zipper on my new fleece pants from campmor keeps getting caught, I think the zippered pant shell from EMS might not be big enough to stretch in..and other silly but important ideas..real beginner here wanting to not make to many mistakes..Thx Happy Holiday! David
 
Tom, I'd like to go on your trip..my check to Judith was sent..ps u have PM..thx David
 
Well, as a winter beginner, Slide in the Catskills is perfect. It is not really very difficult in elevation or distance and yet it is a beautiful winter hike. I think you'll have a great time. I also lead hikes for the 3500 club and feel a responsibility to make sure participants are prepared. I carry a little extra gear when I am the leader. I will be leading Peekamoose and Table on 2/13 in case you have any interest in that one. Let us know how you made out.
 
Dawn,

Weather question..accuweather says tomorrow near Phoenicia temps 15F another weather website said 30F..Is one side of the town warmer than the other? That would be pretty interesting..thx..what's the most accurate site that u use?..David..Want to try the koflach but not at 30F
 
I think Slide is one of the most moderate of the winter climbs and you could go a little lighter than you might for one of the more remote peaks, especially given that you can be sure of not being alone on the weekend.

That being said, you cannot count on the leader to have extra gear for the group, each individual needs to have enough to equipment to survive a night out on the mountain. On this particular trip, a stove, cook kit and sleeping bag might be overkill. In addition to what you wear hiking, I would say you should have a hooded insulated parka, shelled mittens, a balaklava, spare glove liners, a space blanket or bivy sack, a head lamp with lithium batteries, a first aid kit, a 3/4 length pad, spare socks and goretex pants and parka, if you are not hiking in them.

There are many items that could be be added, I would also be carrying insulated pants, an extra set of poly pro, an extra light, a small flask, extra food, an esbit stove with metal cup, a candle, parachute cord, a trash bag, a spare map and compass.

You could probably hike for five years and not use much of this stuff, but bear in mind that if one of your party were to be injured, all of you would be out there for a while, and anyone who cannot sustain themselves could well become another victim. The more people in your group, the more delays you can expect. I like to keep my insulated parka unstuffed at the top of my pack, and pull it on any time I see the group taking of their packs, it makes me a lot more patient. Some one will always say, we're only stopping for a second, and they are usually the first one to get cold, because they make their point by not putting on another layer.
 
coldfeet said:
Dawn,

Weather question..accuweather says tomorrow near Phoenicia temps 15F another weather website said 30F..Is one side of the town warmer than the other? That would be pretty interesting..thx..what's the most accurate site that u use?..David..Want to try the koflach but not at 30F

Since Phoenicia is only about 1 mile from one side to the other, I wouldn't expect that wild of a difference. Slide starts out about 1700' higher than Phoenicia, so subtract about 5-10 degrees, plus another 5-10 for the summit.

I think that you'll be OK since you'll be with a group. Just make sure you have warm mittens, hat, waterproof shell gear, a warm jacket (heavy fleece, down or primaloft), extra socks, long underwear (polypro), a balaclava, handwarmers, good easily digestible high carb/fat food (gorp is good), and insulated leather/rubber boots (or plastic if you are into clumsy walking, painful shins, and slow pace). The more winter hiking you do, the better idea you'll have of what to bring, and what is extra weight. I never ever bring crampons and an ice axe, simply because you won't be traversing ice fields above tree line too often.
 
Thx for input..I repacked probably 1/2 dozen times..I have most of what u mentioned minus the stove..need to sleep!
 
Weather forcast can be tough for areas farther away from the city areas. A lot of time when you look at current conditions for a town like Phonecia they are really giving you the conditions out of another area that can be closer to the Hudson. Usually it will say on top, as reported from ? It is all depends on where the weather station is for a certain area. I beleive when you do Phonecia it comes out of Albany when using NOAA. On other sites it may be reading from areas farther south. Always remember mtns make their own weather so prepare for the coldest days. Once you get to the trailhead you can then decide what is needed.
I always found www.weather.gov the most accurate.
 
I'm home! Drove 340 miles to hike 6.7 miles, but it was fun! will write up story on other thread.
 
I did all the Dak winter 46s solo as dayhikes w/o either stove or bag. But then again I was younger back then and stupid. I once ended up on the top of Cliff w no bag and no flashlight in 20 deg weather. (See, I told you I was stupid). I had a miserable night doing jumping jacks to keep warm until daybreak.

You can buy an adequate down 3 season bag that weighs 2 lbs. Wearing your outerclothes in the bag will make it 4 season, and you will have a great bag for the rest of the year.

But I don't think Slide is remote enough to warrant it. Personally, I would just pack an extra fleece shirt and one of those foil emergency shelters.
 
Winter day pack

I've seen several pack lists for winter day hikes on other sites (backpacking.net has one). I did a winter day hike at Donner Summit (near Tahoe in CA) on snowshoes in a state park to try out some new gear and went ahead and packed as if I was actually reasonably far away from civilization. I took a small canister stove and pot, extra water, an MEC overbag, fleece pants and jacket, extra food, first aid kit, space blanket, shovel, extra gloves, balaclava, headlamp in addition to what I was wearing, all in a pack about 3000 in size. I had enough so that if I had been caught out for the night, I wouldn't have been comfortable, but could have survived fairly cold weather. I'm a beginner winter hiker so I figure taking more is an extra safety measure that didn't detract from the hike at all. I did stop to make some tea. Remember-things like energy bars will freeze solid if you keep them in your pack, but a nice hot cup of soup along the way is a nice treat.
 
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