Winter training

[dailey7779]

Here's my trip report of my R2R2R from a few years back in May if you'd like to read it, click here

The year I did it, 2014, water wasn't turned along the North Kaibab Trail until just a few days before. Depending on when you do it in April there my be some rotting snow and ice up top below the North Rim but probably minimal.

As for the need of a car spot, you can't park at the South Kaibab Trailhead, you park near the Bright Angel Trailhead at the Backcounty Lot and take the free shuttle over to South Kaibab. Or you can park at a picnic area at the junction of Yaki Point Drive and Desert View Drive and walk 10 to 15 minutes to the South Kaibab Trailhead, and when you are done take the shuttle back from Bright Angel to South Kaibab and walk back to your car.

As for food, unless you are running a major portion of it take a wide variety of food, when it comes to big mile hikes over several hours your cravings will be all over the place, this is like a H2H, you don't want to be bonking, especially when traveling through the 'BOX'.

Temps in April should be good for the the R2R2R, probably pretty cold before dawn, but shouldn't be too extremely hot mid-day down low. The afternoon shade starts overtaking the trail above Indian Garden around 4pm IIRC, so temps will start to drop again as you approach the finish.

Take a short side trip to Ribbon Falls along North Kaibab Trail if you are feeling good.

Other than that the footing compared to the northeast is a cake walk, never steep, lots of switchbacks, over cushiony red clay dirt.

Enjoy it, it's probably one of the coolest hikes/runs I've ever done. Other hikers and the rangers along the way asked or knew what I was doing and were very encouraging and friendly to me

-Chris

 

[heathcliff]

Thanks for the tips, Chris. I had actually read your R2R2R trip report a few days ago when I was first researching the topic. It's nice to read it again now that I'm more familiar with the trail and some of the landmarks!

It sounds like I need to call the park ahead of time to get a sense for which water stations have been turned on. My trip will likely be on 4/10 or 4/11, so it's still fairly early in the season. How was your nutritional need for R2R2R vs the Pemi Loop? I have a hard time staying on liquid diet on long hikes, so I'll prob go with fried rice and snacks again. The terrain looks pretty good from your pictures, so I'm pretty excited.

And how did you stay in shape through the winter? My biggest concern is that this would be my first big hike of the season. My plan was to ski and run during the winter, but after hearing all the advice on this forum, I will probably try to mix in some winter hiking too.

Thanks!

NW

 

[Snowflea]

What they said. I would add that if you are a beer drinker, Phantom Ranch sells it, and it is worth whatever they are charging for it these days. Tecate was the best one could get a few years ago, but perhaps their beer list has improved in recent years. Something to look forward to on your return trip to the South Rim.

Lived in California 2006-12 so was fortunate to be within a few hours drive and did the R2R2R four times. My favorite itinerary was to descend South Kaibab, up and down North Kaibab, and then up Bright Angel. Although I would run--the downs and flats anyway--was never able to put up a fast time because there was just too much time spent gawking at the incredible scenery!

As for water, the GC backcountry office could best answer your questions: 928-638-7875 is the number listed on their website.

As to your original query, find an activity you enjoy and keep at it regularly!

 

[heathcliff]

So, South Kaibab vs Bright Angel. Why go down one and up the other? Obviously it'd be nice to see more trails, but I'll be by myself, so I'm not sure if I can count on a ride in April from one trailhead to the other. I was going to do South Kaibab up and down (shorter distance, although if I have to park a mile away, it may not make that much of a difference).

I'm also not sure about pace yet. Normally I like to jog during down and flat parts, but given this is a new trail (and longer distance) for me, I worry about not pacing myself right and cramping. Maybe I'll fast hike the out trip and try jogging back down North Rim and see how my legs feel. Once I hit Phantom on the way back, I should be OK. 7-9 mile hike up won't be fun after a long day, but the beer should ease the pain!

By the way, are there good cheap motels nearby that I can crash at the night before?

I've never done a trip report before, but I'll be sure to post one here in 6 months to let everyone know how I fared. Hope you guys get notices from this thread!

 

[DougPaul]

And how did you stay in shape through the winter? My biggest concern is that this would be my first big hike of the season. My plan was to ski and run during the winter, but after hearing all the advice on this forum, I will probably try to mix in some winter hiking too.

In late 1999, I skied Mt Garfield two or three weeks before day hiking GC (S Kaibab, Tonto, Plateau Pt, S Bright Angel trails, 18 mi, low temp below freezing while waiting for the shuttle before sun up, high ~80F, bright sun) in late March. (I had probably been hiking and XC sking throughout the winter.) It was good training, but of course did not acclimatize my body to the heat and low humidity. I had some mild dehydration problems after finishing... (I carried and drank lots of water and electrolyte--never ran out and never had to ration the water.)

Winter activity in the NE can condition you for the physical demands, but may not get your body adjusted to exercising in the heat and low humidity.

BTW, the rangers advised hikers to bring traction due to possible icy sections. The trail was clear, but I did see some snow in the bushes near the S Rim.

Doug

 

[dailey7779]

The reason for taking the Bright Angel Trail is for the water. You can fill up at Indian Garden which is the half way mark back up to the rim, and there are two more places to fill up above that if they are on. If you park at the back country lot and take the shuttle over to South Kaibab TH you'll be hiking back to your car so you won't have to worry about your car. I recommend hiking back up Bright Angel and not back up South Kaibab - different scenery, easier hike up, and the water.

As for a cheap place to crash nearby, try getting a campsite at Mather Campground inside the park entrance. Unfortunately right outside the park has ridiculously expensive hotels. Flagstaff is a great place to stay if you weren't doing your first R2R2R. It's around 90 minutes away.

How many days will you be able to hike in the park? If you have an extra day beforehand take a hike down to Indian Garden and out to Plateau Point to get a feel of the canyon and to know your way around the South Rim for parking, shuttles, and how you feel in a desert environment.

Hope this helps a little.

 

[DougPaul]

How many days will you be able to hike in the park? If you have an extra day beforehand take a hike down to Indian Garden and out to Plateau Point to get a feel of the canyon and to know your way around the South Rim for parking, shuttles, and how you feel in a desert environment.

I found finding my way around the maze of roads in GC Villiage in the pre-dawn darkness to be pretty confusing. Might be worth scouting it out in daylight.

FWIW, there was plenty of parking available near the shuttle stop (once I found the stop)...

Doug

 

[jniehof]

No water at North Rim in the "winter." We chose to go down Bright Angel and up South Kaibab because 1) we needed to be able to carry enough water to get pumphouse-North Rim-pumphouse which is substantially longer than Phantom-South Rim, so might as well go for the quicker route 2) didn't want to go down SK since it's steeper and we weren't sufficiently badass for that to be a plus, and figured we were more likely to run off a cliff in the dark with SK and 3) eh, why not, plus got to do the pretty trail in the light. Speaking of "sufficiently badass", one could close the loop on the trail along the South Rim and basically have a 50-miler.

We camped in the park both nights, left car at the tents, and didn't have much trouble getting to the Bright Angel TH. I don't think you'd get away with sleeping at the TH. Campsites aren't that pricey, just bring earplugs and eye mask...somebody rolled in with full headlights into the spot next to me about 2:30, since we were getting up at 3 anyhow that was pretty much that.

I caution that, even in April, you may well hit 80 down in the Canyon. Altitude (both acclimatization and sun exposure), dry air, and wind may further push you into needing more water than you might think. Spring in the mountains of the southwest can involve a persistent wind that'll strip it right out of you.

I haven't gotten in a Pemi yet, too much time on the roads. My gut feeling is that, for someone adjusted to altitude and to White Mountain rocks, the Pemi and R2R2R are probably roughly equivalent efforts. Of course, few people are adjusted to both!

Incidentally, I found people strongly recommended the Sky Terrain map. It is, indeed, very nice, better than the NatGeo.

 

[heathcliff]

Great. Thanks for all the tips!! Will keep you guys posted next spring!

 

[heathcliff]

Hi everyone, I know it's been a while, but I just recently did my trip and wanted to thank everyone for the excellent advice & give folks an update.

Training - unfortunately I never did manage to make it outdoors through the winter. Between having 3 little kids (i.e. Saturday activities) and trying to squeeze in a few skiing days (Sundays), I couldn't manage to find the time to drive up to the Whites & do any winter hiking. I did log a lot of treadmill time though, which was better than nothing. Starting in January, I would do about 5 hours/week on the treadmill (1hr Fri, 2hr Sat, 2hr Sun), set at 15% incline and 3.5mph speed. After a few weeks I started carrying dumb bells in my hands (5, 10 and then 20lbs). By early March, my back started bothering me, so I dropped the weights but kept the incline walks. I also mixed in a few faster runs (25-30min) mid-week, which I later changed to longer runs (60-90min) toward the end. I did my last long workout about 2 weeks before my hike, which in hindsight was a little late because at my age (40), I don't recover as fast as I used to, and I was still a little sore by my hike.

Planning - about a week before my hike, I found out that there was winter damage at the Grand Canyon & some trails were closed. Specifically, Bright Angel was closed near the bottom, which meant that I had to use South Kaibab. Plus North Kaibab was under construction just below the rim, from 8am-4:30pm. That was a problem because it left me with 2 choices (if I wanted to complete the entire R2R2R). I could either start at night and try to reach the North Rim by dawn, or I could start late in the morning, and try to get to the closed portion after 4:30pm, and come back in the dark. After much deliberation, I decided to go with the former. It's not ideal to start out in the dark, but I hear the path is easy to follow. The main disadvantage is that I'd have to dress warmly, as the rim top temperature drops to 25 by dawn. But the advantage is that I could move quickly in the dark without people around, and by the time I run into the crowd on my way back, I'd be slow and tired anyway.

Hike - after dropping my family off at an Indian village on Monday morning (4/10), I drove out to Flagstaff to load up on some supplies (Indian buffet & Chinese takeout). I got to the South Rim around 4pm, and tried to sleep in the back of my car. Woke up around 10pm, ate some noodle soup in my car, and got dressed to go. I carried a fairly small camelbak (1-2L of water) with 2 small pouches. I stuffed my food (1 ziplock of fried rice and 1 bag of peanut M&Ms) into the 2 pouches, and took off at 11pm. It was a nice full moon so visibility wasn't an issue at all. It was very nice and calm in the canyon and I moved down fairly quickly. I passed 4 people on the way down and made it to Phantom Ranch by 12:30am. On my way up North Kaibab, around 2am I ran into 2 people coming down from the North Rim (no clue why they would go up the North Rim so late in the evening), managed to find the tank of water at the ranger station @ the Pump House, and made it up to the North Rim just before sunrise @ 5:45am. Once I got up there, I didn't spend much time loitering because it was still snow-covered and you couldn't see much anyway. Coming back down the North Rim in the morning was majestic. It was a surreal experience as I didn't run into another person until I was almost back at the Phantom Ranch again at 9:30am. I took a 20 minute break at Phantom Ranch and finished eating what was left of my fried rice (my go-to food on long hikes; lots of carbs and just salty enough that I can wash down with water). I felt pretty good heading into the final leg, but after about an hour my body started failing me. Not sure if it's just the distance, or lack of outdoor training, but I finally hit the wall on the way back up South Kaibab. My speed quickly dropped from 3mph to 2mph to 1mph. When I was at Phantom Ranch, I was hoping to finish in 13-13.5hr, but the 2-2.5hr final climb ended up taking just over 4. Still, I was thrilled to have finished & couldn't be happier back in my car again.

Overall, it was an awesome experience. I've never really had a bucket list before, but I decided this was BL worthy so it became the inaugural item on my list. The views were simply amazing, and while the 11pm start wasn't ideal, perhaps in hindsight it was a blessing - the night start gave me a chance to experience the main canyon all by myself for most of the hike (11pm-9am). So thanks again everyone for your good advice on training. Feel free to PM me if you plan to attempt this hike yourself & I'm happy to share more details to help.