Boston Globe article on Mt Washington hiking

[albee]

It may seem odd that you cannot purchase a "down only" ticket beforehand, but it makes good business sense. If they had to turn away a more lucrative "round-tripper" because they were saving a space for someone that may or may not be on time to meet the train at the top, they would lose money on the deal. Selling one-ways (down) at the top on an availability basis just makes sense. Not many people want to go "up only", anyway.

It is very possible that they purchased full-priced round-trip tickets to ensure a seat on the ride down when they spotted their cars. The price may not be much different for a one-way trip. (It doesn't list this price on the website.)

Seeing as how this group had dinner at the Mount Washington Resort afterwards, I wouldn't say it was out of their price range to drop $234 on 6 R/T tickets...

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I'd like to pose this question:

Whether the tickets were purchased in advance, or whether the hikers were experienced ... is there anyone on this board who would, when they reached treeline on Washington, continue to the summit when it's raining, hailing, high winds, with the possibility of lightening which sometimes accompanies hail - all without raingear? And your party is already soaked?

Is there anyone here who would do that? Except perhaps Dr. Wu?!

 

[albee]

I'd like to pose this question: Is there anyone on this board who would, when they reached treeline on Washington, continue to the summit when it's raining, hailing, high winds, with the possibility of lightening which sometimes accompanies hail - all without raingear? And your party is already soaked?

Is there anyone here who would do that?

Did you take a look at the picture? Where in the article did it state that they did not have raingear? The opening picture clearly shows that the kids are bundled up in what looks like rain-resistant (possibly waterproof) clothing, hats, and gloves.

 

[Mike P.]

Thanks for posting the writer's reply to your email, it does provide more detail on their plans. My reply from Dr. Dahl, I wrote him soon after his website on his misadventure went live, was not as nice. I probably was not as nice either though.

As the article is published, IMO some type of disclaimer or link to educational sites on what proper gear might be or the author's experience which may have made decisions he made less open to 2nd guesses would have been nice. (He may of even had them but they were cut by the editor)

Still don't know if I would have gone up with my kids but that is my decision. Steve should put his notebook in a zip-lock bag next time.

One of the things I like to hear about when looking at new people to hike with is not just where you have been but where have you retreated from. Is turning back an option in your vocabulary.

 

[Puck]

One of the things I like to hear about when looking at new people to hike with is not just where you have been but where have you retreated from. Is turning back an option in your vocabulary.

This pearl is one for the book of quotes.

 

[albee]

As the article is published, IMO some type of disclaimer or link to educational sites on what proper gear might be or the author's experience which may have made decisions he made less open to 2nd guesses would have been nice. (He may of even had them but they were cut by the editor)

The article has contact info for taking the cog, as well as a link to an article about "Essential clothing, food, and gear to bring" right next to it.

 

[giggy]

I'd like to pose this question:

Whether the tickets were purchased in advance, or whether the hikers were experienced ... is there anyone on this board who would, when they reached treeline on Washington, continue to the summit when it's raining, hailing, high winds, with the possibility of lightening which sometimes accompanies hail - all without raingear? And your party is already soaked?

Is there anyone here who would do that? Except perhaps Dr. Wu?!

My opinion remains unchanged.

Not with 3 children under 10 with me regardless of what gear I had with me.

 

[dr_wu002]

I'd like to pose this question:

Whether the tickets were purchased in advance, or whether the hikers were experienced ... is there anyone on this board who would, when they reached treeline on Washington, continue to the summit when it's raining, hailing, high winds, with the possibility of lightening which sometimes accompanies hail - all without raingear? And your party is already soaked?

Is there anyone here who would do that? Except perhaps Dr. Wu?!

I would actually turn around unless there was a tornado in the forecast. I'm not going to waste my time walking around the ridge unless there was a >50% chance of certain death. I wouldn't want to be accused of cheating or risk sullying my reputation as a foolish, grouchy and self-loathing hiker with a death wish.

Remember the scene from Twister, when the cow and the house floated by during the tornado. When I saw that, I wanted that to happen to me. Why is my life so boring? Every time I go to Washington, it's nice out and meanwhile, I'm one step closer to dying an unexciting death due to "natural causes" as if Mother Nature herself is denying my one chance at glory and my place in history. Whenever I look at that list of people who died on the mountain, I envision my name there at #134 or #135 (or whatever the latest tally is), and realize what a failure I've been with my apparent inability to achieve notoriety on this exclusive list.

That said, I e-mailed the dude and when he wrote back he said they had brief hail storm and they moved on (and that they passed around 20 hikers there as well). I think people are reading into this story way too much.

-Dr. Wu

 

[Kevin Rooney]

Albee -

Even if you had raingear - head-to-toe Goretex - would you still continue to the summit of Washington with 3 kids in those conditions?

 

[timmus]

Albee -

Even if you had raingear - head-to-toe Goretex - would you still continue to the summit of Washington with 3 kids in those conditions?

You have no idea how many times my father pushed us to continue in bad conditions, on mountains, lakes and off-trail in the deep Quebec forest. And please don't reply it's different from Mount Washington, we all know hypothermia can hit anywhere.

We were wearing jeans (I still think it's the best clothing for kids when traveling in the woods), had only k-ways as rain gear and no rights to complain. I always trusted him in keeping us safe, never even had a doubt.

And we did crazy stuff, not always smart but fun, that's for sure. Risky ? Yes. I am thankful for that, because this is how I learned that you can do a lot of things when you have the courage to reach your limits. Maybe the author of the article is the kid's new heroe, maybe one of them will climb Everest one day because of that trip on Mount Washington.

 

[Chip]

Remember the scene from Twister, when the cow and the house floated by during the tornado. When I saw that, I wanted that to happen to me.

I always wanted to do that thing where they're actually in the bottom of the twister looking up into the core. That'd be cool.

I think people are reading into this story way too much.

-Dr. Wu

Ya think ? This was filler in a throw away, not a challenge to "The Freedom of the Hills".

 

[albee]

Albee -

Even if you had raingear - head-to-toe Goretex - would you still continue to the summit of Washington with 3 kids in those conditions?

1) What were "those conditions"? One of the pictures in the slideshow has them on the summit in a light mist.
2) You need to evaluate the situation when you are there - I don't have my WMG with me, but if it was 0.8 miles uphill to warmth and shelter versus 3 hours in the rain when you're already soaked for 3.3 slippery miles downhill over Lion's Head, I might choose up. But I wasn't there, so I won't say what he did was right or wrong. There were at least 2 other adults and a photographer (read the article closely) on the trip. It looked like they were prepared to me, but again - I wasn't there so I'm not gonna comment.

I'm not saying *everyone* should do this with their kids. I'm just saying that MANY of you are needlessly casting judgement on this guy. He made the call to go to the top. Him and his kids made it just fine. Why do people have to say "Oh, geez, I'M a hiking expert and I would never do THAT. What an IDIOT. I'M so SMART!" To each his own. Let's make this a positive community rather than an elitist "we're better/smarter than them" community.

How many people on this hiking board have hiked in poor conditions before? How many of you hiked with your parents -in cotton clothing- in the rain or snow before? If you have never done something questionable, then feel free to judge everyone you want. Giggy turned back from the summit many times - that's great for him and that's why I would love to climb with him - he's got great judgement - but why does everyone have to criticize and find fault with others' actions... especially when the situation turned out FINE in this case?

 

[dr_wu002]

This was filler in a throw away, not a challenge to "The Freedom of the Hills".

Ding Ding Ding! My Goodness this thread is out there.

I remember the scene from "Tommy Boy" when David Spade's character (Richard) said to Tommy, "You have de-railed!"

-Dr. Wu

 

[Tim Seaver]

Timmus, It sounds like your Dad was much like mine! He made us go through some pretty scary stuff (mostly death-canoe trips), but I was always glad that the didn't shut down the adventure every time someone got a little whiny. ( not to infer anything about the fine journalism from Boston about MW)

Maybe the author of the article is the kid's new hero, maybe one of them will climb Everest one day because of that trip on Mount Washington.

The only thing is, that kid is gonna be bummed when he looks around for the train down from Chomolungma!


It is almost amusing to see the different angles of "VFTT outrage" on this one.
Not to mention the outrage about the outrage. (It's kinda like a layer cake, but more bitter tasting)
Tough thing writing to please this crowd

 

[skiguy]

but why does everyone have to criticize and find fault with others' actions... especially when the situation turned out FINE in this case?

Criticism is a fact of life and certainly a part of this board...sometimes unfortunately and somtimes fortunately. When it comes to the outdoors people can be quick to judge and many times that comes in the form of criticism. IMO much of the time here it seems the so called criticizer is trying to bring to the front their PERCEPTIONS of a situation,( in this thread the "ARTICLE under Discussion") and the potential pros and cons of that situation. Again when we are dicussing the outdoors and it's inherent dangers a bit of Criticism IMO can go a long way to bring to the forefront potentially lethal situations. No it's not pretty but it certainly gets uglier elsewhere.

 

[dr_wu002]

Yawn...

Yes, to DougPaul you listen!

-Dr. Wu

 

[Neil]

Exerpt from a very old Trip Report. This thread made me think of it. Some say that Providence smiles on beginners and fools.


... The route up to the pass was a broad and flat glacier that curved its gentle way to the summit between two vertical rock walls. My map indicated that once I was over the summit I would be on rock. Snow Buntings followed me as I slowly worked my way up to 8500 feet of elevation. Imagine my surprise when I reached the pass summit only to see that another glacier blocked my path. Not only was my map was wrong in failing to indicate the glaciation but instead of being broad and flat the glacier was jumbled, broken and creviced. While I stood there in the late afternoon light pondering my next move I noticed a fresh set of footprints that led from 11,400 foot Hungabee Mountain on my right onto the glacier. They led towards the Opabin Plateau, which stood between me and Lake O’Hara. I reasoned that if the maker of those prints didn’t fall into a crevasse then neither would I so off I went across the Opabin Glacier, solo, with no means of being saved should I have fallen into a crevasse, which of course I didn’t do...

 

[timmus]

Timmus, It sounds like your Dad was much like mine! He made us go through some pretty scary stuff (mostly death-canoe trips), but I was always glad that the didn't shut down the adventure every time someone got a little whiny.

And I'm doing the same with my daughters !

How's that !!Clara (6) & Lorenna(4) last weekend

 

[pudgy_groundhog]

A little discrepency I noticed:

Cog Railway Ticket Info

Line 11 states: "One-way tickets are sold from the top only and are subject to space availability".

Maybe their website is wrong, but it seems to imply that one way tickets down can not be purchased in advance.

The reason why I know this is because I am trying to purchase a one way ticket for my 13 year old daughter for the Flags on the 48 event.

I found the same thing when I was looking at tickets in July. I was looking for a one way ticket from the bottom up, but they didn't have that option. I think they only sell one way tickets from the top because it's based on space available (maybe it's just too much to have to keep track of reservations for round trip and one way tickets? I don't know).

Being pregnant I couldn't handle a whole Presi Traverse like last year, so I met Steve and my friends on the top of Mt. Washington and finished the hike with them. We thought it was my best option, but it really pained me to have to take the cog (I'm a snooty hiker. Only hiking half a mountain doesn't qualify in my book. )

 

[giggy]

all I want to know is with all the folks getting on each other about this issue - when and where is the make up sex?