Hiker survives two nights solo in woods and Trap Dike rescue

[BlackSpruce]

http://www.adirondackdailyenterpris...rvives-two-nights-solo-in-woods.html?nav=5008

 

[Tom Rankin]

http://www.adirondackdailyenterpris...rvives-two-nights-solo-in-woods.html?nav=5008

Some very interesting quotes:

Sewards - Found, but "Molnar suffered exposure from the cold weather and severe frostbite on his hands and feet." And "He got his clothes dried out, but he couldn't dry out his boots because they were mountaineering boots - hard-shell plastic boots," Forest Ranger Kevin Burns said.

Trap Dyke - Climbers wanted a helicopter rescue (in the Dyke? ), but instead rangers helped them repel down to Avalanche Lake. Another quote: "There's no helicopter, dude; it's not happening." And again, "one of the men had severe frostbite on his toes."

 

[BlackSpruce]

Too many hikers out there "working" on their winter list or whatever else with very little knowledge of the terrain! Even more now are going out for the very first time in the winter with somebody else GPS recorded tracks. Furthermore events that pushes unprepared and untested winter climbers to test their limit are not a good idea.

 

[Seeker]

The Trap Dyke story sure doesn't give Ohio a very good name. Dolts.

I'm from Ohio, so I can say that.

Funny too--the FIS guys just skied it not too long ago.

 

[Scotzman]

Funny too--the FIS guys just skied it not too long ago.

I'm guessing there is a substantial difference in level of experience between the two parties...

Another quote: "There's no helicopter, dude; it's not happening." please?? hehe

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

"He got his clothes dried out, but he couldn't dry out his boots because they were mountaineering boots - hard-shell plastic boots," Forest Ranger Kevin Burns said.

One of the reasons hard-shell boots are used in mountaineering is so the boot itsself does not absorb water, and the wet removeable liner can more easily be dried..... right?

 

[SAR-EMT40]

I'm guessing there is a substantial difference in level of experience between the two parties...

Another quote: "There's no helicopter, dude; it's not happening."

Yep, free helicopter rides for everybody.

Keith

 

[Chip]

One of the reasons hard-shell boots are used in mountaineering is so the boot itsself does not absorb water, and the wet removeable liner can more easily be dried..... right?

From there, Molnar fell into a brook on the western side of Emmons, getting wet up to his thighs. After that, he attempted to keep moving to generate warmth, trudging through snow at least several feet deep. Ultimately, Molnar had to stop and light a fire.

"He got his clothes dried out, but he couldn't dry out his boots because they were mountaineering boots - hard-shell plastic boots," Burns said.

I'm just guessing, but it doesn't sound like it would have mattered what type of boots were worn. A spare pair of dry wool socks and plastic bags or VBL's over those might have helped. Too bad about the frostbite.

Glad everyone survived.

 

[Peakbagr]

"Too many hikers out there "working" on their winter list or whatever else with very little knowledge of the terrain! Even more now are going out for the very first time in the winter with somebody else GPS recorded tracks. Furthermore events that pushes unprepared and untested winter climbers to test their limit are not a good idea."

Interesting observations echoed by more and more people.

 

[Chugach001]

Lost and frozen hiker gets an epic patch in my book.

The Trap Dike guys appear to be ****s. Fortunately, my learning experiences have stayed out of the press.

.

 

[ALGonquin Bob]

Lost and frozen hiker gets an epic patch in my book.

The Trap Dike guys appear to be ****s. Fortunately, my learning experiences have stayed out of the press.

.

I was just thinking the same thing.

 

[TMax]

Fortunately, my learning experiences have stayed out of the press.

Me too! And for that I am forever grateful, right Guinness?

 

[Tom Rankin]

Me too! And for that I am forever grateful, right Guinness?

Now, you have to fess up!

 

[Viewseeker]

All can walk away with a new persective on life I guess... good that they made it out for sure.

 

[Peakbagr]

For more, from another thread:

http://adirondackexplorer.org/out-takes/2011/02/24/search-and-rescue-report/

 

[Rik]

Furthermore events that pushes unprepared and untested winter climbers to test their limit are not a good idea.

What type of "events" are you referring to?

 

[Kevin Rooney]

For more, from another thread:

http://adirondackexplorer.org/out-takes/2011/02/24/search-and-rescue-report/

This one really impressed me:

Mr. Molnar reports that he had climbed to the summit of Mt. Emmons on Saturday but the winds and blowing snow were so bad he became disoriented and began descending the west side of the mountain. He followed a drainage area down the mountain, intending to reach his car which was parked on the Corey’s Road. At one point he fell into a brook, becoming wet almost to his waist. Unable to start a fire he spent Saturday night under a tree covered only by an emergency space blanket. On Sunday morning, using a compass, he once again began hiking towards Corey’s Road. He hiked all day and through the night until he was located Monday morning.

(emphasis mine)

Now that is one tough cookie.

 

[DougPaul]

"Too many hikers out there "working" on their winter list or whatever else with very little knowledge of the terrain! Even more now are going out for the very first time in the winter with somebody else GPS recorded tracks. Furthermore events that pushes unprepared and untested winter climbers to test their limit are not a good idea."

We've been through this a number of times...

Pushing one's limits is essential to learning. Without it, we become static and won't progress. Mountaineering is not an amusement park (a place where the events are engineered to look dangerous but in reality are very safe), the risks are real. Pushing one's limits increases the risk that one will fail, possibly with serious consequences. (One can also fail with serious consequences while staying within one's limits.)

We (as a group) are very good at ex post facto judgment (Monday morning quarterbacking, if you prefer)--if someone succeeds at pushing his limits he is judged as being bold, if he fails he is judged as being foolish. Those who are not knowledgeable in the activity in question (and "officials") are particularly good at this...

We also tend to blame technology (cellphones and GPS today), but technology is just a set of tools which can be used intelligently or not. The first guy to invent hard-sole shoes (new technology) was pushing his limits when he used them to walk on sharp rocks (an untested activity) and I'll bet he would have been castigated if he hurt himself but lauded as a hero if he was able to walk across those rocks without injury.

Once upon a time, the vast majority of mountaineering was done with guides (who were often just local hunters who may have had some experience*). And they still did some foolish (excessively risky) things. See, for instance, Viereselgrat**. And then came (Horrors!!! Unthinkable!!!) unguided mountaineering. One could do foolish things on one's own!

* Certified professional guides operate at much higher standards these days.

** Viereselgrat (Translation: Four ***** Ridge) A ridge on the Dent Blanche (Switzerland). The first ascent party judged the climb to be so dangerous that they declared "Wir sind vier Esel" (We are four *****) and the name stuck. 1882.
http://books.google.com/books?id=xz...MQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q="vier esel grat"&f=false
http://www.fotocommunity.de/pc/pc/display/14112293
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dent_Blanche

One of the biggest differences these days is the ease with which anyone, knowledgeable or not, can publicly post his opinion.

Participants and observers both need to stop confusing mountaineering with amusement parks and recognize that pushing one's limits is a fundamental part of learning, but I don't expect it to happen anytime soon.

Doug

 

[kmac]

I'm just guessing, but it doesn't sound like it would have mattered what type of boots were worn. A spare pair of dry wool socks and plastic bags or VBL's over those might have helped. Too bad about the frostbite.

Glad everyone survived.

AND a sleeping bag, stove and thermorest....always think what if....before leaving on a hike.
Glad he got out alive.

 

[DougPaul]

AND a sleeping bag, stove and thermorest....always think what if....before leaving on a hike.

And a couple of porters to carry it all...

Glad he got out alive.

Sounds like he did a good job of dealing with the situation.

Doug