Isolation and Impressive Storm Damage, 11/23/2012

[BIGEarl]

……
i think the biggest nuisance in winter will be the hanging stuff that doesn't interfere now, but with a few feet of snow will be a problem. i'm pretty sure most of this damage can be avoided by using the bypass in the gully south of the campsite knoll, which is often the better route in winter anyhow.
……

nice report, earl. you guys are really rolling along on those grid peaks.

bryan

Bryan,

Thanks.

Right now getting through this area is fun in a “Jungle Gym” kind of way. I tend to agree with you and your concern after a few feet of snow accumulation. The stuff that’s overhead right now will no longer be overhead.

Hopefully you’re right concerning the short bypass at the campsite. I tried to get a sense of how things were in that area as we passed on our exit but I couldn’t really tell because all of the blow-downs.

 

[Silverfox]

I agree with Kevin's and Bryans posts here. If users of the trail systems helped out with a cut or 2 here and there problem solved. It amazes me to read a trip report about a section reporting no blowdowns or issues only to do the same trail a day or 2 later and find it obstructed by blowdowns and deadfalls which folk just avoided by walking around or maybe breaking a branch to crawl over. Waiting for someone else to take care of it. A small folding saw or straight blade easily cuts a 8-10 inch tree, never mind the small stuff.
We, as regular users of the trails all season, both wilderness and otherwize can't really rely on forest service or other "maintainers" to get out there everytime a storm rolls through to take care of this stuff. Whats the big deal about carrying a saw and helping out for the general good..it might cost 15 minutes on a hike...

 

[Driver8]

We, as regular users of the trails all season, both wilderness and otherwize can't really rely on forest service or other "maintainers" to get out there everytime a storm rolls through to take care of this stuff. Whats the big deal about carrying a saw and helping out for the general good..it might cost 15 minutes on a hike...

This is a great post and I agree wholly with its spirit. As one transitioning from intermediate to more expert hiker, I have moved past the "gosh, maybe I should cut that down, but do I have permission, is it ok?" stage and have always, when possible, moved smaller to medium trees and branches to trailside as I run into them. So, short, sweet and to the point, I will go get a saw and pack it with me for outings in the Whites and elsewhere.

I don't want to bust the budget, but do want a solid, relatively unobstrusive, handy saw. Recommendations, Silverfox? Anyone else? I'm thinking trip to Sears or Home Depot or the like, spending up to $30. Thanks in advance.

PS: I grew up in Arkansas and cut trees and such a lot on our family farms, so I'm well acquainted with saws, lobbers, etc. Just haven't used them much in the past several years, being a city dweller. I've got the skills, just want rec's for good, hike-friendly tools.

 

[TDawg]

Driver,

Corona makes a nice folding saw, I got a 10 inch. I also have a 13" fixed blade. Whatever you get, go with a curved blade for faster cutting.

www.coronatools.com

 

[Kevin Rooney]

I carry a Corona 6.5" saw like this one. If I know there will lots of blowdowns on a particular hike, I carry a Corona 10" saw - might be the same model TDawg uses.

I used to carry a Gerber folding saw I bought from EMS, but while the blades were excellent, the mechanism didn't hold up.

 

[Silverfox]

Driver..what tdawg and Kevin said..the Corona folding saws are hard to beat. For bigger stuff I saw the fixed blade one in action recently and was wowed. PM me and I can mail out any of these to you. I carry them at my store...

 

[Driver8]

Thanks for the recommends, guys. I will follow up this weekend. Check PM, S/f - if I don't buy from you, will buy here locally. Much appreciated.

 

[peakbagger]

I guess with the reduced staffing and budget pressures, the forest service and other groups have backed off on enforcing their former "rules" on unapproved trail maintenance. I have always ignored them and carry a Sawvivor during early season hikes and removed blowdowns I was comfortable with. I also at some point have gotten flack from a few VFTT members over the years for doing such maintenance, generally by the trail adopter for the specific trail that was new and a tad bit overly possesive of "their trail". I do not know if the rule is still in the books but for awhile the forest service could cite someone for the possession of trail maintenance tools. This was primarilly used as a tool to prevent folks from maintaining unauthorized trails but I have heard that it has been threatened in the past in wilderness areas on current trails.

Using a very broad brush, I dont see a lot of typical winter listers doing blowdown maintenance, days are short and many winter hikers have agressive schedules that are not conducive to stopping and cutting blowdonws out of the way. Heck even in the non snow seasons when I stop and cut a tree out of the way and could use help, I usually have multiple day hikers go streaming past.

By the way, I have tried other fixed blade saws (including the ubiquitous Sven) and have settled on a Sawvivor as it gives me the most capacity for its size. Folding hand saws work well on small stuff but they are notoriously easy to get pinched and bend a blade. Ther may be better on the market currently but years of discout bin shopping has stocked me up with plenty of spare blades.

 

[Driver8]

Thanks for the tips and the insights, P/b. Where you off to this weekend? I may take on Killington, but probably not the Whites b/c so cold. The itch might just get me to come all the way up, but most likely not.

 

[NH Tramper]

Blowdowns up there get a lot worse after the summit. We went in the back way yesterday and what we encountered near the summit eclipsed the north end entirely (the work that's been done on that side has really helped a lot, thanks): Mt Isolation via Davis Path (in), Isolation and Rocky Branch (out) - 11/29.

 

[DougPaul]

I don't want to bust the budget, but do want a solid, relatively unobstrusive, handy saw. Recommendations, Silverfox? Anyone else? I'm thinking trip to Sears or Home Depot or the like, spending up to $30. Thanks in advance.

I use a Sven folding bow saw when doing trail maintenance. Get the 21 inch model http://www.rei.com/product/404013/sven-folding-saw-21 , not the 15 inch model.

There are previous theads devoted to saws. Eg:
* http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?10186-Favorite-handsaw
* http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?43295-Packing-folding-saws-recommendations


As for why a trail maintainer (or the overseeing body) may not want random hikers doing maintenance: There are standards that may be unknown to the hikers and hikers may cut the wrong path or otherwise do something that is counter productive to the goals of the official maintainer.

Doug

 

[Driver8]

I use a Sven folding bow saw when doing trail maintenance. Get the 21 inch model http://www.rei.com/product/404013/sven-folding-saw-21 , not the 15 inch model.

There are previous theads devoted to saws. Eg:
* http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?10186-Favorite-handsaw
* http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.php?43295-Packing-folding-saws-recommendations


As for why a trail maintainer (or the overseeing body) may not want random hikers doing maintenance: There are standards that may be unknown to the hikers and hikers may cut the wrong path or otherwise do something that is counter productive to the goals of the official maintainer.

Doug

Thanks for the tip on saws, Doug. I wouldn't go out of my way to maintain someone else's trail, but agree with the thrust which has developed in this thread that removing a blown down small branch or tree to trailside is a no-brainer, and carrying a saw so one can do similarly with a medium sized obstructing tree is likewise. I promise I won't get all saw-happy.

 

[DougPaul]

Thanks for the tip on saws, Doug. I wouldn't go out of my way to maintain someone else's trail, but agree with the thrust which has developed in this thread that removing a blown down small branch or tree to trailside is a no-brainer, and carrying a saw so one can do similarly with a medium sized obstructing tree is likewise. I promise I won't get all saw-happy.

I think that few would quarrel with picking up small blowdowns and tossing them off the trail (without the use of tools). Of course, one needs to be certain that one is clearing an official trail and not something else such as an abandoned trail or a pile of branches used to block the entrance to an abandoned section of trail . Many, myself included, do this routinely.

In my opinion, carrying tools to clear blowdowns puts one in a different category. And depending upon the local authorities and maintainers, this may or may not be frowned upon.

Doug

 

[Kevin Rooney]

In my opinion, carrying tools to clear blowdowns puts one in a different category.
Doug

I agree with you. Those who carry a tool to remove blowdowns are known as "prepared" and "responsible hikers willing to help"...

Seriously - cutting a path thru small tree which has fallen across a trail is not exactly rocket science. Let's not pretend that it requires special training.

 

[Driver8]

I agree with you. Those who carry a tool to remove blowdowns are known as "prepared" and "responsible hikers willing to help"...

Seriously - cutting a path thru small tree which has fallen across a trail is not exactly rocket science. Let's not pretend that it requires special training.

"Don't try this at home, boys and girls." ...

 

[Silverfox]

I agree with you. Those who carry a tool to remove blowdowns are known as "prepared" and "responsible hikers willing to help"...

Seriously - cutting a path thru small tree which has fallen across a trail is not exactly rocket science. Let's not pretend that it requires special training.

agreed...that says it pretty well

 

[RoySwkr]

In my opinion, carrying tools to clear blowdowns puts one in a different category. And depending upon the local authorities and maintainers, this may or may not be frowned upon.

There are several previous posts on this topic, surely one can be fined for cutting trees without a permit

One the other hand in the WMNF you are allowed to cut dead and down wood for firewood without a permit, you might as well collect it in the middle of the trail and you can always decide to not have a fire after all

 

[Driver8]

There are several previous posts on this topic, surely one can be fined for cutting trees without a permit

One the other hand in the WMNF you are allowed to cut dead and down wood for firewood without a permit, you might as well collect it in the middle of the trail and you can always decide to not have a fire after all

So that means that the blown over, still alive trees en route to Isolation which Ed shows in his photos would have to be cleared by the official trail maintainers in order to be legal, no? The saw would come in handy for others with larger trees and branches which are fully down and dead, it appears.

 

[Kevin Rooney]

So that means that the blown over, still alive trees en route to Isolation which Ed shows in his photos would have to be cleared by the official trail maintainers in order to be legal, no? The saw would come in handy for others with larger trees and branches which are fully down and dead, it appears.

This is one of instances where a little common sense could go a long way ...

 

[Driver8]

This is one of instances where a little common sense could go a long way ...

As Dickens famously said, and is often though not always true, the law is an ass. This from, yours truly, a lawyer, the voice of experience.