New Insect repellents recommended by CDC

[Grumpy]

. . .I've used it in the Adirondacks against deerflies which are the one species of bug I can't get away from when hiking. They're much worse in the Dacks than in Maine or NH, which is probably a tradeoff for not having as many blackflies. Not even the flailing arm method works on them, some days.

Have you been in the Adirondacks during really real blackfly season?

I'll agree that deerflies are annoying. And they sure will follow you, for miles. I find that keeping my hair cropped short helps a little, for some reason. Maybe it gives them less opportunity to hide away from the flailing arms?

G.

 

[Stan]

So there's a strategy ... take a cue from Grumpy ... hike with someone who attracks flies. Hmmmm. What does that say about Grumpy?

There seems to be a biting order. My wife likewise attracks flies and saves me but if I'm hiking with my son I'm the one they pursue.

My black fly, or any other biting insect, protocol is as follows:

During bug season I take extra vitamin B-1.
When the bugs come out the following go on as needed - long sleeves, long pants, hat, glove liner, head net.
Generous amounts of sunscreen or Avon skin-so-soft can have some effect but if they don't, I progress to stronger doses of DEET.

This strategy has worked for me and I never alter my plans over bug anticipation. In fact, I can't remember the last time I actually had to lather on the Bens ... I don't think I ever opened the bottle.

 

[Dugan]

I've been using a product called Bite Blocker for a couple of years. I was looking for something other than DEET because:
1. For the dog, we use it in short-furred areas (face, ear flaps, belly). Since dogs lick themselves, I want something fairly safe for them.
2. After using 20-28% DEET on me 1-2x/day for a few days, I notice that my skin starts to get a "crawly" feeling for a couple of hours after application, which can't be a good thing.

While searching for something dog-safe, I found this article
http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/128/11/931
via this link
http://www.sonic.net/~cdlcruz/GPCC/library.htm
that led me to bite blocker
http://www.biteblocker.com/

Just found this newer article that compares DEET with various other bug repellants:
http://www.lcmcd.org/relellents.pdf

 

[Umsaskis]

Have you been in the Adirondacks during really real blackfly season?

I was afraid somebody would call me on that! I've been in many places during really real black fly season and really real deerfly season, and my conclusions are blackflies rule in northern Maine, deerflies rule in the Adirondacks, and mosquitoes are about evenly distributed. The Whites, with fewer streams and ponds, don't seem quite so bad but I've run into some nasty noseeums there. My husband and I once drew up designs for a hat with a wind-producing propeller on it that would blow the bugs away, while we were running from mosquitoes in southern Vermont. Any place you go, it seems like you can't win.

Do you think the hat would sell?....

 

[Gris]

For me, no DEET=no being outside from May to September...

posted by Waumbek.

Seems a strange thing to say. I've spent a fair part of the last six summers - yes all the way from May through September - using your own Easton road as home base, wandering through the Whites and have NEVER been bitten by a black fly and only really harrassed by skeeters once (in the woods near Thoreau falls). Thus, I no longer carry DEET but I do always carry a headnet , gloves, etc. and rarely use them. If and when I have to I'll cover myself and sweat rather than intentionally apply neurotoxins to myself or my loved ones. Just my opinion, obviously YMMV.

 

[Waumbek]

Not at all a strange thing to say, Gris. It's got nothing to do with Franconia. Same thing happens everywhere there are bugs that bite. You're either allergic or you're not. Thank god for neurotoxins. When I go the net route, it's a full upper body suit. Now there's a fun thing to sweat in.

 

[TCD]

The last two posts re-emphasize the point that everyone's chemistry is different.

I know people who are almost never bitten by bugs, and they wonder what the fuss is about, and why people use repellant.

I know others who come out of the woods literally dripping with blood, blood dripping off their ears and chins. It's not their imagination.

Most of us are somewhere in the middle.

 

[Gris]

Oh, the bugs LOVE me (guess i'm sweet). Guess they just don't bother me as much, me being a Fla swamp rat and all. Don't seem bad to me in Whites. But i know what Waumbek is talking about. My dad (otherwise healthy as a horse) is allergic to bee stings, swells up like a house if bitten, can have trouble breathing. Happened once when we were in Patagonia, no medical attention to be had, was kinda scarey.

 

[David Metsky]

My dad (otherwise healthy as a horse) is allergic to bee stings, swells up like a house if bitten, can have trouble breathing. Happened once when we were in Patagonia, no medical attention to be had, was kinda scarey.

Have a Dr perscribe him an Epi-Pen and carry antihistemines. I have the same problem with bee stings, it's not a joking matter, it can kill in minutes.

-dave-

 

[tonycc]

Have a Dr perscribe him an Epi-Pen and carry antihistemines. I have the same problem with bee stings, it's not a joking matter, it can kill in minutes.

Is it still the recommendation to carry two pens in wilderness situations, ie. where you can't get to a hospital within an hour?

Tony

 

[David Metsky]

Is it still the recommendation to carry two pens in wilderness situations, ie. where you can't get to a hospital within an hour?

Two would be nice, but I carry one. Someday they'll come along with the two dose Epi-Pen, but they've been promising that for a while. Make sure you carry Benedryl as well, that has a more long term effect.

-dave-

 

[dms]

I went through the anti venom shot regimen, once a week for 5 months, then once a month for 5 years, and I still carry two epi's at all times. Scary stuff when you have the sting reaction.

 

[Waumbek]

Yes, I had a bad time way deep in the Pemi after hornets hammered my forehead one time just before dark. Woke up in the tent next morning with both eyes swollen shut. I learned that if that ever happens again to a) take antihistamines right away and b) get out that night or at least keep my head up all night. Live and learn.

 

[adamiata]

Thanks for the responses. I knew about the plastic melting part, but I've never had it do more than melt my fingerprints into things. I just didn't know if there were any established health effects.

 

[BrentD22]

I think I'm somewhat immune...

Black flies bother me somewhat, but not really all that much.

Mosqitoes (bad spelling) almost never bother me.

I've found that if you start wacking at the bugs, waving your hands everywhere the bugs seem to be attracted to it. Also if you kill a mosqitoe on your skin or other bug the deceased bugs buddies come looking for him. When they find out you killed him/her they get angry! Wouldn't you?

You may also want to do some research on what colors to wear to not attract the bug that is getting ya.

For me DEET has helped when I used it, but the smell and taste is basiclly not worth it. I can't stand getting it on my hands, then wipe my face off of sweat, then tasting the stuff or even worst getting it in my eyes.

 

[DougPaul]

Thanks for the responses. I knew about the plastic melting part, but I've never had it do more than melt my fingerprints into things. I just didn't know if there were any established health effects.

DEET has been established to both be effective and safe when used properly.

Abstract:
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content...4982956791_6411&FIRSTINDEX=0&journalcode=nejm

Full article:
http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content...IRSTINDEX=0&journalcode=nejm&journalcode=nejm
Note comments on safety near the end.

Excerpt:
"Despite the substantial attention paid by the lay press every year to
the safety of DEET, this repellent has been subjected to more
scientific and toxicologic scrutiny than any other repellent
substance. The extensive accumulated toxicologic data on DEET have
been reviewed elsewhere. DEET has a remarkable safety profile after 40
years of use and nearly 8 billion human applications. Fewer than 50
cases of serious toxic effects have been documented in the medical
literature since 1960, and three quarters of them resolved without
sequelae. Many of these cases of toxic effects involved long-term,
heavy, frequent, or whole-body application of DEET. No correlation has
been found between the concentration of DEET used and the risk of
toxic effects. As part of the Reregistration Eligibility Decision on
DEET, released in 1998, the Environmental Protection Agency reviewed
the accumulated data on the toxicity of DEET and concluded that
"normal use of DEET does not present a health concern to the general
U.S. population." When applied with common sense, DEET-based
repellents can be expected to provide a safe as well as a long-lasting
repellent effect. Until a better repellent becomes available,
DEET-based repellents remain the gold standard of protection under
circumstances in which it is crucial to be protected against arthropod
bites that might transmit disease."

Doug

 

[David Metsky]

I went through the anti venom shot regimen, once a week for 5 months, then once a month for 5 years, and I still carry two epi's at all times. Scary stuff when you have the sting reaction.

Mine was twice a week for a bit over a year. I carry one pen in the woods, never had to use it.

-dave-

 

[skidoc22]

The Key

The key to bug free hiking is carefully choosing hiking partners who are more attractive to the bugs than you are and staying close to them at all times.

 

[beverly]

Picaridin

Still waiting for someone to weigh in on Picaridin. I guess it's too new for any feedback here. It's only in Cutter Advanced, as far as I could find out. It's odorless and Cutter says it doesn't harm plastics or synthetics and the protction is comparable to DEET.
Worth a try.

 

[charlos]

anyone have anything to say about permethrin?
been using it on my clothes and some gear for a couple of years now with great results.

suprised not to see it mentioned in this thread, through my research it seems safe if you follow precautions correctly.

enjoy spring, charlo