Recent Rescue on Washington

[Raven]

Also, I don't feel safety should be the ultimate goal. I know, crazy statement to make.

I am happy to hear someone else share this view. Safety is an important concern. However, if it was the ultimate goal, I would never have experienced summits to being with.

Amazing experience, deep connection to the natural world, and transcendence are my ultimate goals...and physical fitness I suppose.

 

[erugs]

We hikers do want more information about such events as this. I wish a news reporter of some sort would do a follow up story. The guy is easy enough to find with a simple Google. But, he survived and we have much more important news, like what Trump has to say.

 

[jfb]

We hikers do want more information about such events as this.

The only information I would like to see is how someone could lose his way while descending the Nelson Crag Trail. I've never descended that trail, but may like to someday. Is it hard to follow?

 

[Ed'n Lauky]

The only information I would like to see is how someone could lose his way while descending the Nelson Crag Trail. I've never descended that trail, but may like to someday. Is it hard to follow?

I never did it at night, but I never found it difficult to follow. I do think though that a person not familiar with the trail could accidentally get off that trail and onto the Huntington Ravine trail.

 

[erugs]

If they went out of sight and he saw another trail sign, he might have thought it was just as well. Or maybe he couldn't remember what they had told him? They should have said, go back down the way you came up. Maybe they did. Wouldn't it be nice to have their perspectives.

 

[peakbagger]

Nelson Crag Trail has a fairly long section of above treeline. There is no distinct trail bed and is mostly a rock hop. It does have cairns but they can be less prominent that the Crawford Path of Gulfside. There are occasional paint blazes on the rocks. It would be easy for someone at night to lose especially if they were already confused or not thinking clearly.

 

[hiker0200]

I ran into some lost hikers on Mount Agamenticus today. (Yes, the little 700 ft. hill in York, ME.) Instantly reminded me of the recent Mt. Washington rescue. Makes me genuinely scared for some of the "new generation of hikers"

 

[thegibba]

I never did it at night, but I never found it difficult to follow. I do think though that a person not familiar with the trail could accidentally get off that trail and onto the Huntington Ravine trail.

I recently went down the Nelson Crag trail with a friend on 11/5. We got to Nelson crag itself just after sunset and It obviously got dark quick. There is a nice big sign at the base of the Sherman Adams building indicating the start of the Nelson crag trail. The large cairns are pretty close together so someone with a reasonable headlamp could have followed them from where you cross the auto road to Nelson Crag. but after Nelson Crag they are further spaced out and at one point with my 160 lumen head lamp it took a few glances to see the next. It was a slow going trail to head down in the dark. I think it took us 40 minutes to go the .7 from the alpine garden trail down to the auto road. There are three opportunities to hit the auto road this way. Once near the summit, second when you intersect the huntington ravine trail and lastly when you get to Cragway Spring. The signage was good up there. The picture on the article on the first post was taken with a bit of day light left. I am not sure what the visibility was like up there that day. While not the greatest trail off the pile, it sure is marked well. And does lead you to the superhighway that is the AT.

Of course, unanswered questions are. Where was his mode of transportation? did he hitch over to the East side? was he planning on hitching back to his car? seems odd (but not out of the question) to be solo and just hike up and over a mountain.

 

[DayTrip]

The only information I would like to see is how someone could lose his way while descending the Nelson Crag Trail. I've never descended that trail, but may like to someday. Is it hard to follow?

I've descended this way several times (never climbed) and found it quite easy to follow. Fantastic route actually. One of my favorite routes off Washington. I don't really see how you could accidentally go down Huntington Ravine Trail if you had even a vague idea about the area by reviewing a map or looking at the lines of the trails from above (I forget what visibility on day in question was but if he could see hikers he was trying to follow in distance it must have been OK). And if he was trying to follow the people descending that way and could see them in distance why would he not follow the cairns in that direction, rather than turn in a completely different direction? I'd think as you approached the rim of the ravine you'd decide going down that way is not a good idea. Continuing on the flats in either direction would seem more prudent.

But then again, this all presumes some basic level of common sense and preparation. Panic of some sort must have set in. There are too many common sense conclusions he should have arrived at if he was in a reasonable state of mind.

 

[jfb]

But then again, this all presumes some basic level of common sense and preparation.

For all we know, he may have decided that the cairns were heading in the wrong direction (not towards PNVC) and decided to take a shortcut to the base of Huntington Ravine.

Another version of the story: http://nhpr.org/post/ill-prepared-hiker-rescued-mt-washington

 

[Breeze]

Saying it again, if you did not not catch it the first time, too many visitors to Mt Washington have no clue where they are, where they are going, how they are going to get" there and back", or what " there and back" even entails.

Where's the trail to Mt Washington? is next on the list to Where is the closest restroom, and the restroom is often the most important of the two questions.

Not understanding the complete vacuum in which some folks operate is a vacuum in understanding of itself. It is difficult to help someone who has no shared frame of reference. It is in no way uncommon for first time visitors to think that there is " one trail" to one summit, and both the Auto Road AND the Cog begin and end at the same place as the " One Trail".

It was hard for me , for some years, to finally see the actual issue. The issue was/is/ will always be ... this isn't about what I do or don't know, but what happens , when I ask , " which trail do you want to use", and the result is a blank stare, or a response of " oh, please, you know, the ONE that goes where I wantt".

Then I truly have to understand the need is greater than I can fulfill.

 

[iAmKrzys]

My guess is that he didn't really know where he was going (maybe he even didn't have a map) and took a wrong turn here: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?mlat=44.2771&mlon=-71.29383&zoom=16#map=17/44.27659/-71.29442&layers=C

 

[skiguy]

Saying it again, if you did not not catch it the first time, too many visitors to Mt Washington have no clue where they are, where they are going, how they are going to get" there and back", or what " there and back" even entails.

Where's the trail to Mt Washington? is next on the list to Where is the closest restroom, and the restroom is often the most important of the two questions.

Not understanding the complete vacuum in which some folks operate is a vacuum in understanding of itself. It is difficult to help someone who has no shared frame of reference. It is in no way uncommon for first time visitors to think that there is " one trail" to one summit, and both the Auto Road AND the Cog begin and end at the same place as the " One Trail".

It was hard for me , for some years, to finally see the actual issue. The issue was/is/ will always be ... this isn't about what I do or don't know, but what happens , when I ask , " which trail do you want to use", and the result is a blank stare, or a response of " oh, please, you know, the ONE that goes where I wantt".

Then I truly have to understand the need is greater than I can fulfill.

Almost twenty years ago now when I worked for one of the Outdoor Retailers in Conway I use to have to field all kind of questions about getting up and down the Rock Pile. By far the best question ever asked of me was: "How long does it take for the boat to get to the top"? lmao....you can't make that stuff up. http://www.cruisenh.com/

 

[Grey J]

There is a very well marked line of cairns but when the fog rolls in it can still be disorienting especially for a novice without a map in his pocket or in his brain where I carry my spare.

I agree with DayTrip that its a great trail, challenging for me, but with big payoffs. I think Breeze pretty much nails the essential problem, clueless people with this "one place" mentality. I worked in a state park in Florida where you floated down a river 3 miles from a natural spring. At the take-out, you rode a van back to your car at the start. One day a woman asked me ??why we hadn't made "the ride" go in a circle?? If your frame of reference is a Disneyland construct, you might be at greater risk in the real world.

 

[dug]

This 'one place' mentality isn't isolated to mountains, either. I don't spend a lot of time in the cities, but if I do visit somewhere, you have to figure out where you want to go to what you want to do. That isn't all that easy.

"Just go to the Old Port" is fine, but how to get there, where to park, where to go all need to be figured out; or you just aimlessly wander (which is fine) until you figure it out. Bit harder to do that on some mountains, but if you lack experience...

 

[jfb]

My guess is that he didn't really know where he was going (maybe he even didn't have a map) and took a wrong turn here: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?mlat=44.2771&mlon=-71.29383&zoom=16#map=17/44.27659/-71.29442&layers=C

After seeing the NHPR version of the story, I think he was looking at a map and decided to follow the Huntington Ravine Trail back to PNVC. It did not take very long for the rescuers to find him, leading me to believe that he told them exactly where he was.

 

[sardog1]

In the "For what it's worth" department, France does have a law dating back to Napoleon whereby you can be charged for a "manque d'aider une personne en danger", failure to help a person in danger. I know it doesn't apply in this country but it does show that over the years it is something that some have considered to be important.

Well, it does apply in some states in this country (including the state I grew up in that is often derided by hardcore Ayn Rand fanboys): Duty to rescue/report statutes

 

[iAmKrzys]

After seeing the NHPR version of the story, I think he was looking at a map and decided to follow the Huntington Ravine Trail back to PNVC. It did not take very long for the rescuers to find him, leading me to believe that he told them exactly where he was.

I agree - on reflection I though that maybe he recognized Huntington Ravine Trail name from some trail signs he saw on his way up and maybe he thought he could go this way back PNVC not realizing what he was setting himself up for. At least he called for help before he got hurt, so it took only 2 people to get him out of his predicament. I bet he learned his lesson.

 

[peakbagger]

One the day that the Obs runs the Seek the Peak fundraiser, I was with a group heading up Huntingtons Ravine Trail we met a group of 8 people along the Alpine Garden trail asking where Huntingtons Ravine trail was. The only map they had was a handout that the obs had handed out showing the major trails to the summit and the distance. It was not to scale and lacked contour lines. They had decided that they were going to take the easy way down via Huntingtons Ravine trail as it was the least distance. Among the group they had one small day pack and a few of them had water bottles in their hand. It was quite a hot day. We let them know that the guide strongly warned folks about descending. We pulled out the map and showed them the steepness, but it was obvious that they really couldn't read a map. The group were couples in their forties. We discussed it with them for several minutes and we initially they had their mind made up but eventually we convinced them to join us (we were planning to summit via Nelson Crag) offering them to take them over to Lions head. At one point they were complaining that Lions Head was too steep.

I have also run into winter hikers planning to go up Huntingtons to the summit as it was the shortest route.

 

[DayTrip]

One the day that the Obs runs the Seek the Peak fundraiser, I was with a group heading up Huntingtons Ravine Trail we met a group of 8 people along the Alpine Garden trail asking where Huntingtons Ravine trail was. The only map they had was a handout that the obs had handed out showing the major trails to the summit and the distance. It was not to scale and lacked contour lines. They had decided that they were going to take the easy way down via Huntingtons Ravine trail as it was the least distance. Among the group they had one small day pack and a few of them had water bottles in their hand. It was quite a hot day. We let them know that the guide strongly warned folks about descending. We pulled out the map and showed them the steepness, but it was obvious that they really couldn't read a map. The group were couples in their forties. We discussed it with them for several minutes and we initially they had their mind made up but eventually we convinced them to join us (we were planning to summit via Nelson Crag) offering them to take them over to Lions head. At one point they were complaining that Lions Head was too steep.

I have also run into winter hikers planning to go up Huntingtons to the summit as it was the shortest route.

And no amount of signage, brochures, etc can prevent this. It will continue to happen. You can't be in someone's living room pointing out the dangers as they pack their "gear".