Snowshoes MUST be worn in Dacks

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his thread was lost after the first response to the regulation

then seeing how i did PM him info to the original question i feel that it was only appropriate to give my opinion on the regulation.. seeing how it was onesided view points coming in....

but if you'd rather not hear my thoughts on this, then i guess the discussion on this thread in this fourm is done for me....

oh and thanks for always spining things... i do have to give you credit at being a master of that game....for only i am a wee lad and but always learning :eek:
 
I'd love to hear your thoughts -- it was you who were busting chops for discussing the issue -- just before you discussed the issue. Other than that, your logic is impeccable.

Ooohhh, this just in on the PM line:
rondak46 said:
Do you FEEL like a *********?
No, not really -- more like a diaper (see post #60 in this thread).
 
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As a few of you have said, I started this thread as a simple comment because I did not know the regulation/law existed, I just thought the thread might make it to others who may not know about the regulation before they get a fine or worse. I find it amazing that a simple comment can bring on a 4 page petty bitch session. Yes sometimes regulations can become many and frivolous to the naked eye, but with thousands upon thousands of people using the trail every year there must be some regulations or our trails would be ruind by the thoughtless few so the majority of others can not enjoy them. I for one have no problem with the snowshoe regulation, even if it were not enforced but only requested that snowshoes be warn if for no other reason than to be courteous to other hikers by not trashing the trail. Isn't being courteous to our fellow hikers and preserving the trail networks for all to enjoy the most important point here. Stop the petty bitching.........
 
Chill Out Dude!!!

"My apologies for my annoyed tone here, but I REALLY hate this WHITES vs. DAKS crap. This type of thread has taken on that tone, and from where I sit, it was only started as a simple "request for info" post"

I Don't see it as a Whites vs. Daks thing... It's just a snowshoe law vs. a common sence/courtesy thing. Some places choose to make it a law some choose to let the hikers use common sence/courtesy. I choose the latter. :)

Capt. Jim

ps: I DO use snowshoes when CONDITIONS mandate them but not just because LAWS tell me to.
 
afka_bob said:
I'd love to hear your thoughts -- it was you who were busting chops for discussing the issue -- just before you discussed the issue. Other than that, your logic is impeccable.

Ooohhh, this just in on the PM line:
No, not really.

ah yes, BUT when i "bustin chops" it was to those (as i explained) that degraded the discussion to screw the laws, we don't need no freakin laws!!

i appreciate your compliment..
 
ADackR said:
ah yes, BUT when i "bustin chops" it was to those (as i explained) that degraded the discussion to screw the laws, we don't need no freakin laws!!
I don't think the real gist of any of the "opposition" was "screw the laws." There was a spirited discussion on whether such a thing should be a rule or a law.

ADackR said:
i appreciate your compliment..
Anytime! ;)
 
If the snow is deep it is pretty hard to tell at the beginning of a trail or in the morning if snowshoes will be needed during a long day. Especially in this spring type weather, hard packed barebootable trails in the morning can become a barebooting nightmare by afternoon when the pack starts melting. It is just common sense to bring snowshoes along. I couldn't imagine trying to posthole my way back to car for many miles. Of course, I've been called a pansy for taking the easy way out. :rolleyes:

As far as making this a law, well, welcome to New York, the land of laws targetting the lowest common denominator. I always wear my seatbelt when driving, helmet when cycling and avoid smoking in all public places (private places too;) ). I do resent being told I have to though.

The problem with common sense is that it isn't common enough sometimes.

Tony
 
tonycc said:
The problem with common sense is that it isn't common enough sometimes.
Tony

Must be a NY thing ;)

Only kidding.... :D .... I see plenty of "live free or die" NewHampshireites and Massholes barebooting when it's obvious they see themselves that they're postholing the trail. Happened just this weekend as two girls (er... young women) followed me up the trail barebooted. They said they "thanks for leaving such nice prints for us to follow" in the virgin trail. Of course now on the way back down the trail I tried so hard to pack nice with snowshoes was all holed up for my (& their) return trip back down... oh well... I tried!

When I asked them why they weren't wearing snowshoes they said "we hate carrying them". To that I responded "isn't the idea to WEAR them???"

Capt. Jim
 
afka_bob said:
I've always thought the Adirondacks were good for at least one thing: they help keep the Whites less crowded ;)

Though hesitant to even read this topic -- let alone fan the flames -- I feel compelled to admit that for once, I agree with something afka_bob said.

[duck]

:D

(Feel free to ignore this post.)
 
I must first say that I was getting the same feeling as Mavs was about the ADK V. Whites so I don't think he got that out of thin air. I also find many of the posts to be somewhat petty.
As far as the issue at hand I find the rangers use pretty good judgement in my experience. I haven't seen anyone getting tickets for barebooting on a solid surface as long as they have them with them in case conditions change. I also have been thanked by the rangers for wearing them on more than one occasion. I'm not a big fan of more laws but I don't think ignoring them is the best way to express this disagreement. I also think it is much safer going more than a few miles into the backcountry to have them with me.
 
My unleashed dogs are constantly postholing. By the time eight legs pass over the perfectly packed trail it looks like Swiss cheese. Oh, that reminds me... I have to buy cheese at the store tonight. ;) :D
 
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Interesting how people often say that there is a law requiring snowshoes in NY or in the Adirondacks. In fact both are false. The law requiring them applies to the High Peaks region only. (If memory serves me correctly.) Even the loj parking lot is not in the high peaks winterness. The Boundry is about 0.8 miles in. It's marked.

I often think about postholing the sh__ out of the trail between the Loj and the boundry, just because I can.
 
The ADK High Peaks are just too darned popular, that's all...

I think the reason that so many rules and regs are necessary in the ADK High Peaks is because the area is so popular. And why is it so popular? Because it's spectacular and it's fairly close to major urban centers. That means the area sees a lot of inexperienced visitors. So it stands to reason that without rules and regs, these inexperienced visitors, with no ill intentions but out of ignorance, would likely do great damage to the place (and possibly themselves!) unless guided to do the right thing by the rules 'n regs.

Let me put it this way -- I was hiking up Plateau in the Catskills on the last day of spring. The trail was pretty nasty all the way up to the summit ridge, covered in postholes, rutted, slippery, icy... you name it. There was a group of twelve young folks from Staten Island going up at the same time. When the snow got deep enough I pulled out my snowshoes, prompting a couple members of the group to comment what a great idea they looked like.

When I got past the big pay-off lookout destination (Orchard Ledge and Danny's Lookout), the trail turned into a single pair of snowshoe tracks. I put on my snowshoes and had a fantastic walk in the soft, white snow under the gnarled yellow birches and red spruce. It was beautiful.

Unfortunately, on my way back I found that the S.I. 12 had followed me. They completely obliterated the trail, leaving two-foot deep holes and ruts everywhere. Now understand, the forest gets pretty thick up there, and it was rarely possible to simply walk around the mess. So I staggered and stumbled through what had been a blissful walk only a couple of hours before.

When I passed one of the girls near the back of the group looking totally exasperated at how much work it was to stumble through the snow, she commented that she really wanted to get a pair of snowshoes and asked me how much they cost.

Now, I'm pretty much a hiking newbie, and I've only started winter hiking this year, so I don't feel like I can lay an expert trip on anybody. But I know I had a better hike than those folks did, and I suspect that at least some of the folks in that group will be shopping for snowshoes on Ebay...

My point is that it's probably inexperience/ignorance that causes so many people to hit the ADK High Peaks trails in the dead of winter with no snowshoes to help them along. If they actually tried snowshoes they'd want a pair. Even a cheapy pair will work well enough to hike the valley trails, and certainly will make winter hiking more fun than sinking knee-deep into the snow.

So the regulations are pointing inexperienced hikers in the right direction, for their own safety and better enjoyment of a resource that needs protecting from overuse by those same inexperienced hikers.

Am I right? Or no...?
 
The reason one is required to wear snowshoes in the 'Dacks is because both skiers and snowshoers use the trails. I need not explain what occurs when hikers posthole on a multi-use trail.

About ten years ago, there were two climbers who walked in from Heart Lake to climb the Trap Dike up Mt Colden. They did not have snowshoes that day. As they were postholing in and had achieved about a half mile, a ranger skied to their position. He asked them to fill in their post holes while he supervised. Needless to say that when they completed the task, they were too tired to continue.

Moose
 
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