averagejoe
New member
As a climber I have not been in that situation, though I have been in what could have potentially been a bad situation.
This was the first time I had ever gone ice climbing.
I set out with a friend to climb Pinnacle Gully. After finding the wait too long, (two parties ahead of us), we decided to check out Central Gully. After deciding it would go my partner went back to pinnacle to collect his pack (which contained the rope) and I told him I was going to play around at the base. I went a little too far and after climbing through some thin brittle ice I found myself on a ledge about a pitch up. You could have put a small moble home on this ledge so I thought nothing of being up there. My partner headed up after me and said the thin ice section was too broken up and about an 8 foot section was impassable. He had the rope and was too far away to throw it up to me and I could not down climb through it so I had to go up.
So who put would have been responsable for it had an accident occured? Me for setting off without the rope, or the experienced climber for not warning me to stay at the base of the climb?
My situation aside,
What if Shade had stayed till Selwyn was rescued. Then refused to be rescued because he did not need it and (maybe) didn't want to tax the system. Shade then has to rappel in the dark? or bivy till morning and risk exposure, getting caught in bad weather, maybe he had to work later and did not have time to wait for a rescue (a lot of employers don't care if your life was in danger as long as you get to work on time). What if while getting himself out of the woods on his own he is injured through no fault of his own (lightning strike, rockfall, etc)? Who is responsable? Selwyn for leaving him in the middle of their climb or Shade for not whimping out and taking responsability for his situation. Okay that's a little harsh, but it should be.
Working at REI I see this often when someone buys a Gri-Gri ("assisted braking device" all too often refered to as a "hands free braking device") and says they want to give it to their kid for safety cause they don't trust his friends to be attentive, or someone buys someone a spot cause they're going to CO to bag some 14ers and then it turns out they have given no consideration water purification, shelter, stove, food and so on. I tell these people that these devices are no substitue for common sense. Harsh again but true. People get dropped using Gri-Gri's and rescue could still be days away if you're at 10,000ft in a storm.
I don't know what either of their skill levels are, but the potential for injury or death is part of the deal anytime you leave the ground even ten feet or set off into the mountains for a hike. Also was Selwyn safely anchored to the stone or on a large ledge, or was he abandoned with no gear on a small belay stance? My understanding is when some hits the rescue me button, it calls in the cavalry every time, unless the batteries are dead...
I get really frustrated by these stories and feel that some people take far to lightly the realities of going into the woods.
Joe.
This was the first time I had ever gone ice climbing.
I set out with a friend to climb Pinnacle Gully. After finding the wait too long, (two parties ahead of us), we decided to check out Central Gully. After deciding it would go my partner went back to pinnacle to collect his pack (which contained the rope) and I told him I was going to play around at the base. I went a little too far and after climbing through some thin brittle ice I found myself on a ledge about a pitch up. You could have put a small moble home on this ledge so I thought nothing of being up there. My partner headed up after me and said the thin ice section was too broken up and about an 8 foot section was impassable. He had the rope and was too far away to throw it up to me and I could not down climb through it so I had to go up.
So who put would have been responsable for it had an accident occured? Me for setting off without the rope, or the experienced climber for not warning me to stay at the base of the climb?
My situation aside,
What if Shade had stayed till Selwyn was rescued. Then refused to be rescued because he did not need it and (maybe) didn't want to tax the system. Shade then has to rappel in the dark? or bivy till morning and risk exposure, getting caught in bad weather, maybe he had to work later and did not have time to wait for a rescue (a lot of employers don't care if your life was in danger as long as you get to work on time). What if while getting himself out of the woods on his own he is injured through no fault of his own (lightning strike, rockfall, etc)? Who is responsable? Selwyn for leaving him in the middle of their climb or Shade for not whimping out and taking responsability for his situation. Okay that's a little harsh, but it should be.
Working at REI I see this often when someone buys a Gri-Gri ("assisted braking device" all too often refered to as a "hands free braking device") and says they want to give it to their kid for safety cause they don't trust his friends to be attentive, or someone buys someone a spot cause they're going to CO to bag some 14ers and then it turns out they have given no consideration water purification, shelter, stove, food and so on. I tell these people that these devices are no substitue for common sense. Harsh again but true. People get dropped using Gri-Gri's and rescue could still be days away if you're at 10,000ft in a storm.
I don't know what either of their skill levels are, but the potential for injury or death is part of the deal anytime you leave the ground even ten feet or set off into the mountains for a hike. Also was Selwyn safely anchored to the stone or on a large ledge, or was he abandoned with no gear on a small belay stance? My understanding is when some hits the rescue me button, it calls in the cavalry every time, unless the batteries are dead...
I get really frustrated by these stories and feel that some people take far to lightly the realities of going into the woods.
Joe.
